ported barrels

[finity]

What is the concensus on the the usefullness of ported barrels? Do they really do what they claim in significantly reducing recoil?

My dad recently bought a .454 Casull lever action rifle but now it turns out he doesn't like the kick. My brother suggested getting it ported by Mag-na-port. He figured out that the cost is going to be around $250-$300 dollars.

My question, is it worth it?

For the physics guys out there:

I understand that it's effective for reducing muzzle rise by porting the gasses out the top forcing the muzzle back down. That makes perfect sense.

If it does reduce recoil (they claim up to 50%!!!) how does it do that without significantly reducing muzzle velocity? I would think that it is equivalent to shortening the barrel due to cutting slots/holes in the last several inches of the barrel.

Am I correct that the majority of recoil occurs as the powder ignites & the bullet starts to travel down the barrel? Wouldn't the majority of recoil already be imparted to the shooter by the time the bullet reached the porting? I know that the powder doesn't all ignite at once & that there is a "pressure curve", which is the reason why longer barrels allow for a higher muzzle velocity in the first place, but it just seems counter-intuitive that porting is some magical physics phenomenon that significantly reduces recoil with no loss in efficiency. I can see how it would reduce recoil a modest amount but with the attendant loss of muzzle velocity.

Unless I'm completely wrong in my understanding of the concept of recoil....

If I am, please enlighten me.

 

[jim b]

I can't help you mutch on the porting but if the .454 recoil is to much why doesn't he just shoot .45 colt out ofthe rifle? That would reduce the recoil, still have plenty of power for deer to 100 yards, and would be cheaper shooting. The only .454 lever that i know of are the Pumas and they were made to handle .45 colt as well.

 

[slackerisme]

I believe the porting is slightly angled to both push the barrel down and forward. As for the physics, it seems to me that that 50% number most likely comes from a large slow projectile, whose momentum is drug out over the length of the barrel.

 

[Mgderf]

I have SEVERAL ported barrels, one on a .454 casull handgun, another on a Thompson Contender in .45/70 govt, another on a 12ga....

YES, the porting makes that much difference, and in my opinion, WITHOUT significant loss of performance.

I don't know the physics behind it, I just know it works!

 

[finity]

I can't help you mutch on the porting but if the .454 recoil is to much why doesn't he just shoot .45 colt out ofthe rifle? That would reduce the recoil, still have plenty of power for deer to 100 yards, and would be cheaper shooting. The only .454 lever that i know of are the Pumas and they were made to handle .45 colt as well.

Thats what we thought too but the guy we got it from (dealer) said it "wouldn't work". He didn't know why, mind you, just that we couldn't use it. He said in a handgun it would work but not in the rifle. & yes its a Puma.

Good to know.

Thanks.

 

[Mgderf]

Thats what we thought too but the guy we got it from (dealer) said it "wouldn't work". He didn't know why, mind you, just that we couldn't use it. He said in a handgun it would work but not in the rifle. & yes its a Puma.

Good to know.

Thanks.

I know of no reason you could NOT fire .45colt through that Puma rifle with ONE possible exception. I would NOT try cowboy loads, They MAY be underpowered for a long barrel.

 

[purple72]

Another thing to compare. There sure is alot of trap guns that are ported to reduce recoil. I think the only drawback to porting would be on a defense pistol where you might have to shoot multiple shots quickly. But even then, it would help muzzle jump but might not clear the smoke. I think it would help quite a bit.

 

[turnandshoot4]

That is exactly why porting is good. All of your follow up shots are right there due to the lack of muzzle flip. I haven't noticed any extra smoke in the least. Not to jump on you about this.

I have had many ported guns. They all fire great. My Sig p220 sport shoots like a dream. I have also heard great things about the EFK firedragon barrels.

 

[Vlad the Impaler]

So what about flash blinding when using a ported handgun for defense?
If you shoot in the dark, can you visualize a good follow-up shot after etting an eye full of redirected muzzle blast?

 

[Kimbertrace]

So what about flash blinding when using a ported handgun for defense?
If you shoot in the dark, can you visualize a good follow-up shot after etting an eye full of redirected muzzle blast?

Good question, hope we get an answer

 

[jmb79]

So what about flash blinding when using a ported handgun for defense?
If you shoot in the dark, can you visualize a good follow-up shot after etting an eye full of redirected muzzle blast?

In my experience this is a non-issue. I've shot a fair amount at night with ported firearms and I've never been "blinded" or had my night vision negatively affected by burning gas exiting the ports.

The issue with ported barrels on SD handguns is that, especially with very short barrels (e.g., 2" bbl. on S&W J frame) is the possiblity of burning yourself with the burning gasses when shooting from retention or in other close quarters situations.

 

[turnandshoot4]

So what about flash blinding when using a ported handgun for defense?
If you shoot in the dark, can you visualize a good follow-up shot after etting an eye full of redirected muzzle blast?

Then everyone's eyes will be blinded then. I haven't even seen a fireball out of the top of the barrel yet. Also most ported barrels get pointed AWAY from the shooter. Such as the EFK firedragon.

 

[x10]

My 44mag super redhawk had terrible muzzle flash and the porting actually helped the flash, I don't know how but it does foul my front sight

If you think it through, the recoil reduction can only help for the amount of time the bullet is still in the barrel so you will still have the recoil impulse from ignition until the bullet gets to the port. You can major change in muzzle flip and some actual recoil reduction but you have to remember the angle of the force has a lot to do with the way you feel the recoil so if the rifle or pistol stays flat then the recoil will be more inline with the way the gun is held so therefore the butt of a rifle will stay square on your shoulder instead of rocking upwards and putting a greater amount of force on a small location at the top of the stock contact. So what I'm saying is you can't get a brake to move the gun forward but you can make the gun more managable during the recoil.

So if you get the gun ported your going to add noise and control but your not going to take a bunch of the recoil Off of your shoulder.

 

[Airwolf]

Not sure about a handgun, but porting makes a rifle significantly louder because the report is directed 90 degrees to you instead of away from the muzzle. It will also increase the concussion felt by the shooter.

 

[finity]

x10 & airwolf,

Your thoughts on this parallel my own. I can see the muzzle flip & control benefit but not so much the recoil reduction that they claim. I was really hoping someone could give me a scientific explanation of why it works (if in fact it really does).

Then everyone's eyes will be blinded then. I haven't even seen a fireball out of the top of the barrel yet. Also most ported barrels get pointed AWAY from the shooter. Such as the EFK firedragon.

If that's true then it is completely counterintuitive. I have seen some muzzlebrakes (like on the Barrett) that angle the gasses backwards which would pull the gun forward a little at the end of the recoil pulse. I can see how that would help a little. But to blow the gasses forward?

 

[x10]

another thing touched on here that hasn't really been expounded on is the amount of noise and concision your neighbors get. I have a Rem700 built for long range and have a muzzle brake installed (forget brand) it has ports with an angle so that some gas goes at a 45deg back at the shooter, so that puts people on the line on either side of me right in the blast , and it is a blast, The first round from prone cleans away any loose grass and depbres from the area a lot of times I put a cloth down to help my neighbors I try to get on the end of the line when shooting and alway's advise people around me to plug and Muff. The brake on the 308 tends to stop the recoil pulse part way through the recoil so as I said before the reaction of the rifle while the bullet is in the bore is still there but when the bullet exits it basically stops the rifle rearward movement but at the cost of throwing up dirt and much increased sound, my 44 mag feels like someone took a bat and hit the end of the gun down and the sights will still be woblling around the target when I"m done, My 45 1911 comp gun sits there an cycles and the dot doesn't move off the sight

If your wanting to save your shoulder a ported gun does work but for the reasons stated, you can control the firearm instead of letting the gun get above the line of recoil but physics are still physics, It can't do anything until there is gas running through the ports

If your ever coming to Hoosier Hills Rifle and Pistol Club on a shooting night let me know and I'll bring a ported gun for you to shoot

 

[2ADMNLOVER]

The barrel on my 500 12G is ported . I have a recoil reducing stock and use low recoil 00 buck .

I don't know if porting makes much of a difference or not but with all three it makes for some sweet shootin .

 

[DWFan]

Have him sell the rifle and buy something he's comfortable with. Trading the instinctive flinch from anticipating the recoil for the same flinch from anticipating the increased volume and flash of the muzzle blast is a no-win situation. If a shooter is not comfortable with a weapon, their proficiency with that weapon is bound to suffer; not to mention they simply won't enjoy it.
These rifles are very popular and any number of people will give you near new, if not actual new retail value for the weapon provided it hasn't been fired much and is well taken care of. He might even be able to work a trade where he ends up with a rifle he'll enjoy and money in his pocket.

 

[finity]

Have him sell the rifle and buy something he's comfortable with. Trading the instinctive flinch from anticipating the recoil for the same flinch from anticipating the increased volume and flash of the muzzle blast is a no-win situation. If a shooter is not comfortable with a weapon, their proficiency with that weapon is bound to suffer; not to mention they simply won't enjoy it.
These rifles are very popular and any number of people will give you near new, if not actual new retail value for the weapon provided it hasn't been fired much and is well taken care of. He might even be able to work a trade where he ends up with a rifle he'll enjoy and money in his pocket.

Yeah, I don't know why he insists on buying guns that he knows are going to kick like a mule when he knows he doesn't like the recoil of anything heavier than a .22. I'm trying to sell his PT111 in the classifieds (shameless plug?) that he's shot less than a box out of because he doesn't like the kick.

He's bought several guns over the last couple of years & has sold every one of them except for his .22's at a loss after just a few tries at shooting them. Oh well, it's his money.

I have a standing order for my kids to tell me that I'm being stupid if I do that when I'm 80 (if I make it that far ).

 

[Gav-n-Tn]

I believe the porting is slightly angled to both push the barrel down and forward. As for the physics, it seems to me that that 50% number most likely comes from a large slow projectile, whose momentum is drug out over the length of the barrel.

I'd just be leary of changing the ballistics due to altering the original config. It might pay to consult the factory.