Preban?

[DCM8513]

I was wondering if someone could explain to me what the whole preban topic is all about. Im not talking about 86' ban for full autos, but rather semi automatic rifles. I see a lot of "preban" titles for assault rifles and am wondering what this is refering to. Thanks.

 

[OneBadV8]

I was wondering if someone could explain to me what the whole preban topic is all about. Im not talking about 86' ban for full autos, but rather semi automatic rifles. I see a lot of "preban" titles for assault rifles and am wondering what this is refering to. Thanks.

The '94-'04 Assault Weapons Ban.

People still advertise it as preban, because they overpaid when they bought it and still think they can collect a premium

(That's entirely my opinion on why, not actual fact )

 

[indykid]

The pre-ban thing generally centers around two distinct bans. The first was the Bush1 ban because he thought that the way a firearm looks causes people to become criminals, so he banned "evil features". This led to the changing of AK variants into things like the MAK-90 which had the evil bayo lug removed, and most had no threads on the muzzle to keep you from using the sun blocking flash hider. It also gave us the Bush-hole stock in place of the standard stock and separate pistol grip. The MAK-90 and "evil looking rifles" and shotguns after the Bush ban could not have evil features without violating the sporting purpose clause of the new ATF second amendment.

In the time between the Bush1 ban and the clinton stupidity of 1994 by banning long guns by name, the rifles were called post-bans, mostly as post-Bush1-ban because you really can't call them post-clinton bans because those don't exist because of his ban.

There was then the "ban-period" of 1994-2004 which during that time prevented you from buying long guns with evil features, and it also banned the sale of standard capacity magazines, forcing most pistols to come with a clinton capacity of 10 rounds max.

After the clinton ban sunset in 2004, you have what can be called the post-post-ban because evil features were now allowed, but ATF cracked down on importation and manufacture of long guns that didn't meet the sporting purpose clause of the new ATF second amendment. That required the builder or manufacturer to meet certain unknown standards of a "sporting purpose". To meet that rule, the long gun could not contain more than 10 countable imported parts. More than 10 made a rifle an "evil assault rifle" making it illegal, but 10 or less imported parts made it angelic and baby safe.

And there in a large nut shell is a slightly sarcastic, but true account of what Bush1 and clinton did to the second amendment.

And as I have no respect for the president between Bush1 and Bush2, I will not capitalize his name.

 

[BGDave]

Very simply put the pre ban firearms are highly sought after in the non-free states like New York and others. More to it but I'm to lazy to look up other states take on evil features.

 

[DCM8513]

So is the idea that the weapons that were before these/this ban are better because they have more imported parts?

 

[indykid]

I don't think it is the idea that they have all imported parts as much as the parts were designed to work together from the factory, as opposed to being imported and then having to be modified to meet the sporting purpose clause of the new ATF second amendment.

For instance, a Romanian WASR-10, in order to be imported into the USA come in with a mag well that is too narrow to use standard AK mags, and can only use special narrow single stack mags with a clinton capacity of only 10 rounds. Once imported, the importer, or a distributer then opens the mag well to accept standard AK rounds, but to maintain it's "sporting purpose" the imported parts count must be kept to no more than 10, so the importer installs the needed US made parts.

The problem with Century imports is that they were known, until recently, to install very poor quality parts, like a trigger group well known for trigger slap, and instead of installing the US made gas piston correctly, they weld one in place which if not done correctly can cause feed issues. They also decided that in some cases to use a mag with a US part, so that if you have one and accidentally install a standard mag, you are now in violation of federal law.

The other reason that "pre-Bush1-ban rifles command a higher price is that so few of them made it into the country, and supply and demand comes in because as demand increases due to new people getting into the sport, prices rise due to the limited supply.

And this all wouldn't have happened if the right to keep and bear arms was not infringed.

 

[leftsock]

In Indiana, "pre-ban" is a euphemism for "old."

 

[DCM8513]

Its all coming together. Makes sense. Thanks for the info! I have a wasr10 but fortunately dont have any of these issues. I purchased it back around 2005 and its been a great gun. Any idea as to what some of the higher end aks are?

 

[ATM]

Very simply put the pre ban firearms are highly sought after in the non-free states like New York and others. More to it but I'm to lazy to look up other states take on evil features.

Yep. There are still state-level bans in a few states.

If they want an original configuration, they have to get one that is grandfathered with a manufacture date prior to the start of their ban.

 

[indykid]

Its all coming together. Makes sense. Thanks for the info! I have a wasr10 but fortunately dont have any of these issues. I purchased it back around 2005 and its been a great gun. Any idea as to what some of the higher end aks are?

Higher end of the pre-bans are any of the H&K rifles.

As to the AK pre-Bush1-bans, the Poly Tech Legend is way up there and billed as the closest thing you can buy to a true Kalashnikov Type 3 but in semi-auto only. The Kassnar import SA-85M are the tops of the European imports, as well as a Steyr imported Maadi. Kassnar and Steyr importation is important as all others are "post-Bush1-ban" and did not have all the "evil" features.

Others like the Steyr AUG is sought after by collectors, and unfortunately the prices show it. The post-bush-pre-clinton Steyr USR is also a really nice rifle for the bullpup lovers.

I am sure there are many others, and I do know of a few rarities from Europe that made it in under the wire. And I am sure many others can chime in with other pre-bans that are no longer available, but this gives you an idea of the higher end rifles.

 

[canav844]

Very simply put the pre ban firearms are highly sought after in the non-free states like New York and others. More to it but I'm to lazy to look up other states take on evil features.

MA also has pre-post ban, CA might, but I'm pretty sure they just flat ban regardless of the manufacture date, and I think NJ is on the list, CT might be.

In states that still have AWBs,with the 10 round mag limit, preban is how you get more than 10 round capacity magazines; so if you jump onto a national gun forum or gunbroker type sites you'll see them selling for more than new parts many times. As was said, on INGO it just means old.

 

[Mr Evilwrench]

Yeah, in Cali you're not only still limited by regulations similar or even worse than the clintoon ban, you have to have a "bullet button" which is a mag release that requires a tool to remove your lame 10rd magazine. There are other states, like taxachussetts, that pretty much just kept the clintoon atrocity. Here in America, I own a good stack of AR and M9 mags that are stamped "for military/law enforcement use only" or somesuch. Those amuse me.

 

[223 Gunner]

If you are referring to the Colt AR's running in the classifieds, the only way those sellers will see the kind of money they are asking is to list them on gunbroker. In my OP no-one wants an AR with a fixed carry handle. Also the Colt's that were put out without the bayo lug are even less desireable, because that is about when Colt started putting a block in the lower to keep people from converting them to an M-16. Colt also used different sized pins in the lowers, a bolt carrier that was not standard to other AR's. The list goes on and on. For 1200$, I would buy a DD, or something more up to date. But as the saying goes "people pay for the pony" I think there are much better mfg.'s of AR's than Colt.
I just don't drink the Colt Just my . I will add, that Colt did get back in the game when they came out with the 6920, because they realized they were losing a lot of money in the AR game. They finally started making a mil-spec rifle for the civilian market, long after other mfg.'s were already doing so, and they realized that's what poeple want. For years Bushmaster was/is making better rifles than Colt.

 

[nhgluff]

The only real pre-bans are the HK-91,93's and IMI Galils and the Poly Tech or Norinco AK's because they will never be imported again.