Price Gouging.... should it be illegal/ Why or why not?

[hornadylnl]

I have a nice diesel generator and about 100 gallon of fuel. If in the event of a power outage, the father of a child with diabetes came and asked to put his daughter's insulin in my fridge, I'd gladly oblige. If he came to me making demands, I'd accommodate his daughter and forcibly remove him from my property.

The father in the video could ask those with generators to store it for him. But I'd think a father of a child with diabetes would know that insulin needs refrigerated and would plan accordingly. Instead, many count on the charity of others. Charity is a great thing and I encourage it. Demand it and you lose all sympathy with me.

 

[bhowell34]

Charity is VOLUNTARY.
I give to many different charitable organizations. I determine which charities use my money better, and which causes.

Taxes from a rabid IRS are NOT VOLUNTARY.

I know its voluntary... Never said it wasn't Just saying people have quit giving to charity bc they have the mindset of screw them let them fail or the government will take care of them. If more people cared and helped people it would just be another reason to shrink the government. We all want the same thing. Small limited government and a free market

 

[bhowell34]

I have a nice diesel generator and about 100 gallon of fuel. If in the event of a power outage, the father of a child with diabetes came and asked to put his daughter's insulin in my fridge, I'd gladly oblige. If he came to me making demands, I'd accommodate his daughter and forcibly remove him from my property.

The father in the video could ask those with generators to store it for him. But I'd think a father of a child with diabetes would know that insulin needs refrigerated and would plan accordingly. Instead, many count on the charity of others. Charity is a great thing and I encourage it. Demand it and you lose all sympathy with me.

Yeah thats great we need more people like you in America

 

[churchmouse]

I have a nice diesel generator and about 100 gallon of fuel. If in the event of a power outage, the father of a child with diabetes came and asked to put his daughter's insulin in my fridge, I'd gladly oblige. If he came to me making demands, I'd accommodate his daughter and forcibly remove him from my property.

The father in the video could ask those with generators to store it for him. But I'd think a father of a child with diabetes would know that insulin needs refrigerated and would plan accordingly. Instead, many count on the charity of others. Charity is a great thing and I encourage it. Demand it and you lose all sympathy with me.

Yup....

 

[churchmouse]

Yeah thats great we need more people like you in America

You lost me with this one. He stated he would refrigerate the girls meds if asked. If demands were made he would accommodate the girl ie. refr. her meds and remove Dad from his property. I would respond in kind. Ask me and if I am able, help will be given. Demand of me and I will kick you in the junk. Pretty simple.
The girl still gets her meds refr.
Question, why is not dear old dad ready for such things. Power outages are common enough for any of several reasons.
If my kids had such issues I/we would be ready.....oh, wait, we are ready and would be approached by those in need.
Ask and help will be given.

Demand and cover your jewels...........

 

[churchmouse]

I know its voluntary... Never said it wasn't Just saying people have quit giving to charity bc they have the mindset of screw them let them fail or the government will take care of them. If more people cared and helped people it would just be another reason to shrink the government. We all want the same thing. Small limited government and a free market

Yup. But still, Charity is voluntary.
We still give to those we trust when we can.

 

[smokingman]

The problem is not the price gouging.That would mean we had free markets.The problem is we do not have free markets.We have markets where commodities,real estate,and every real asset are manipulated.Monopolies in things like electric markets,communications,and many others.Then you have market makers like the CME that control virtually all commodities under one roof.If you want to trade grain futures,cattle futures,or nearly anything physical you have to do it at the CME.This of course makes prices very easy to manipulate if you have enough money or enough collateral to meet margin requirements.All of course government regulated to make competition harder.

Here is a good example.A Goldman Sacs trader takes out an 8 BILLION dollar position in a direct effort to manipulate the market(futures contracts).He still lost as someone else had an even greater ability(more than 8 billion)to manipulate the contract on the CME.Since he lost 118 million and was "busted" he went to trial.He was convicted of one count of wire fraud.He will serve 33-41 months in jail,and pay a fine not to exceed $75,000.He only made 1.6 million in his bonus and $150,000 in salary,which he was allowed to keep.Meanwhile every person in this country was affected by the manipulation,and higher prices on real goods.

Another example.JP Morgans commodities desk.1.8 Trillion under management to do one thing and one thing only.Manipulate prices in commodities to favor themselves and their investors.Explain to me how trading almost 2 trillion in commodities when our annual GDP is 15 trillion makes sense to anyone?This is how you get trading volumes which exceed total world production in a single day.On average at the CME in any given commodity 5-40% of total yearly production is traded DAILY.

Even the foundation of "our" free market is manipulated.The Federal Reserve controls interest rates to the tbtf banks.Those banks control interest rates via LIBOR to consumers.Sure the banks where found to be rigging libor and some paid hundreds of millions in fines,but one thing did not change.The way LIBOR is calculated,and it is still manipulated.Why?Because the fines are less than the profit from the manipulation by one hundred fold.
If you think you live in a free market system,you are clueless.

 

[CathyInBlue]

This one was easy. Just searched the IC for "gouging" and it popped right up.

Indiana Code 4-6-9.1

IC 4
TITLE 4. STATE OFFICES AND ADMINISTRATION
IC 4-6
ARTICLE 6. ATTORNEY GENERAL
IC 4-6-9.1
Chapter 9.1. Price Gouging in Declared Emergencies

IC 4-6-9.1-1
Period for which emergency declared
Sec. 1. (a) Sections 1 through 7 of this chapter apply to the period during which an emergency is declared and the twenty-four (24) hours before the declaration by the governor under IC 10-14-3-12 or IC 10-14-3-13.
(b) The definitions in IC 10-14-3 apply to this chapter.
As added by P.L.124-2002, SEC.1. Amended by P.L.2-2003, SEC.11.
IC 4-6-9.1-2
"Price gouging" defined
Sec. 2. For purposes of this chapter, "price gouging" means charging a consumer an unconscionable amount for the sale of fuel. Price gouging occurs if:
(1) the amount charged grossly exceeds the average price at which fuel was readily obtainable within the retailer's trade area during the seven (7) days immediately before the declaration of emergency; and
(2) the increase in the amount charged is not attributable to cost factors to the retailer, including replacement costs, taxes, and transportation costs incurred by the retailer.
As added by P.L.124-2002, SEC.1.
IC 4-6-9.1-3
Powers and duties of attorney general
Sec. 3. The attorney general has the following powers and duties regarding price gouging:
(1) To investigate complaints received claiming price gouging.
(2) To seek injunctive relief as appropriate.
(3) To seek restitution for victims of price gouging.
(4) To institute an action to levy and collect a civil penalty.
As added by P.L.124-2002, SEC.1.
IC 4-6-9.1-4
Use of information obtained in investigation
Sec. 4. (a) Information obtained during the attorney general's investigation under this chapter, including information from a person who responds to the investigation and designates the information as confidential, must be maintained as confidential until the investigation is completed by the attorney general and a course of action is determined. The attorney general may not make known in any manner any information obtained in the course of the investigation to persons other than those specified in subsection (c). Once the investigation is completed, if there is an agreed upon settlement or if charges are filed, the information becomes public.
(b) The attorney general shall make available to the public, upon request, aggregate information concerning complaints of price
gouging. The aggregate data may not identify particular persons or locations under investigation.
(c) For purposes of this section, references to the attorney general include other individuals designated in writing and acting on behalf of the attorney general during the investigation. A person designated shall preserve the confidentiality of information under subsection (a).
(d) A person who is served with a request for information, a subpoena to give testimony orally or in writing, or a request or order to produce books, papers, correspondence, memoranda, agreements, or other documents or records under this chapter may apply to any court for protection against abuse or hardship.
As added by P.L.124-2002, SEC.1.
IC 4-6-9.1-5
Action brought by attorney general
Sec. 5. If an investigation by the attorney general results in a finding of price gouging, the attorney general may bring an action in a circuit or superior court with jurisdiction in the county where the price gouging allegedly occurred. If the court finds that the retailer engaged in price gouging, the court may assess a civil penalty against the retailer. The civil penalty may not be more than one thousand dollars ($1,000) per transaction.
As added by P.L.124-2002, SEC.1.
IC 4-6-9.1-6
Civil penalties
Sec. 6. Civil penalties collected under section 5 of this chapter must be deposited in the state general fund.
As added by P.L.124-2002, SEC.1. Amended by P.L.6-2012, SEC.11.
IC 4-6-9.1-7
Preemption of local government powers in price gouging emergencies
Sec. 7. This chapter preempts the power of local governments to regulate pricing of commodities under a declaration of emergency:
(1) under IC 10-14-3-12;
(2) under IC 10-14-3-13; or
(3) by a local government.
As added by P.L.124-2002, SEC.1. Amended by P.L.2-2003, SEC.12.

In Indiana, "price gouging" appears to be exclusive to fuel, so the example from the video of selling generators would not enable the INAG to act, but selling full cans of gas to run them would.

 

[chizzle]

Libertarian Opinion; Is the Concept of "Price Gouging" a Communist Concept?

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...ept_of_price_gouging_a_communist_concept.html

 

[mbills2223]

I tried to explain that price gouging is an incredibly socialist/communist concept and inherently impossible in capitalism awhile back. I was talking about the ammo shortage though, so I of course got flamed. We only support things unless it impacts us negatively, it seems.

Price gouging should absolutely NOT be illegal. If one company manages to buy up all the water sources in this country and then charges $100/liter, then we can talk. Until then, and EVEN then, the market knows best.

 

[mbills2223]

I have a nice diesel generator and about 100 gallon of fuel. If in the event of a power outage, the father of a child with diabetes came and asked to put his daughter's insulin in my fridge, I'd gladly oblige. If he came to me making demands, I'd accommodate his daughter and forcibly remove him from my property.

The father in the video could ask those with generators to store it for him. But I'd think a father of a child with diabetes would know that insulin needs refrigerated and would plan accordingly. Instead, many count on the charity of others. Charity is a great thing and I encourage it. Demand it and you lose all sympathy with me.

Can someone rep him for me? I gotta spread it around. Socialism...ironic...

 

[223 Gunner]

Can someone rep him for me? I gotta spread it around. Socialism...ironic...

He has enough rep already. As determined by all the other socialists on here.

 

[churchmouse]

Can someone rep him for me? I gotta spread it around. Socialism...ironic...

Got him for you...and me.

 

[merotek]

IF your talking basic things needed for survival, food, water, etc... then yes, there should be a law against profiting on others misfortunes. If your talking about an AR15, this is a luxury item and the buyers set the price.

 

[88GT]

I know its voluntary... Never said it wasn't Just saying people have quit giving to charity bc they have the mindset of screw them let them fail or the government will take care of them. If more people cared and helped people it would just be another reason to shrink the government. We all want the same thing. Small limited government and a free market

You have it exactly backward. It is not because we have become less charitable that the government has grown. It is because the government has grown that we have become less charitable. Government will not shrink because we dig deeper. And people have quit giving because the government has dug deeper.

 

[88GT]

IF your talking basic things needed for survival, food, water, etc... then yes, there should be a law against profiting on others misfortunes. If your talking about an AR15, this is a luxury item and the buyers set the price.

I shouldn't be "allowed" to sell to the highest bidder?

 

[HARVEYtheDAMNED]

There's no reason to drum up some more draconian legislation for an issue like this, just vote with your wallet and don't shop at places that price gouge. The free market should remain that, free.

 

[actaeon277]

IF your talking basic things needed for survival, food, water, etc... then yes, there should be a law against profiting on others misfortunes. If your talking about an AR15, this is a luxury item and the buyers set the price.

And why?
Because some people stocked up, and some people didn't?
A lot of people would rather spend their money on the latest "gimmick" electronics, see movies, buy a new car every 5-7 years. And make fun of those "preppers".
Someone else holds on to their car, doesn't buy so much stuff, and stockpiles a little away just in case....

Maybe people need to stop expecting their substitute father (.gov) from saving them for every little problem.

 

[ultra...good]

oh, yes, just what we need, more laws to protect us from ourselves.

 

[MTC]

What are these other so-called deadly sins? I can't recall.

Go rent the movie SEVEN, it will remind you what they are.

No ****. Was going to list them here, but don't want to spoil the movie for anyone. Excellent movie starring Morgan Freeman and Brad Pitt.