Probable cause- DNR boat stops

[Cameramonkey]

Growing up in Michigan spending plenty of time on the water, DNR frequently pulled along side to check for safety equipment and licenses. We complied and never gave it any thought. DNR officers were all pretty cool.

Yep. Dad and I found several that were cool when I was around 10.

1st time out up at Boone's Pond in our brand new molded 2 man pontoon style boat. Got motioned into shore. No registration. Dad Didnt realize that a trolling motor put us over the threshold for registration. (He thought only larger or gas powered required it) He let us off with a verbal warning as long as we stopped right then and there. It was obvious the boat was shiny and brand new and we werent doing it habitually.

A couple weeks later we are back out with our freshly tagged and numbered boat and got waved in again. What now?!?!? Numbers were not far enough above the water line he said. Dad pointed out to be high enough off the water he would have had to use numbers too small to be compliant. CO thought about it for a minute and said that under the circumstances too low was better than too small, and to carry on.

 

[bstewrat3]

Lot of myths in this thread...

COs aren't any more "powerful" than any other LEO. They just have different purview / duties than City / Muni / County / Staties.

Actually they are, because in addition to enforcing state laws, they also have the federal authority of the USFWS to enforce.

 

[Fargo]

Actually they are, because in addition to enforcing state laws, they also have the federal authority of the USFWS to enforce.

So DNR officers are federal agents?

The State Police routinely enforce federal motor carrier regs, and police officers of all stripes work with the feds to enforce federal drug laws. The idea that the DNR has some sort of super powers is really a myth, especially when one considers that if they are going to go federal with anything they have to get the US attorney's office to file.

There is one class of law-enforcement officers in Indiana which do have significant additional powers granted by statute within the criminal realm, but it sure isn't DNR.

 

[IndyDave1776]

So DNR officers are federal agents?

The State Police routinely enforce federal motor carrier regs, and police officers of all stripes work with the feds to enforce federal drug laws. The idea that the DNR has some sort of super powers is really a myth, especially when one considers that if they are going to go federal with anything they have to get the US attorney's office to file.

There is one class of law-enforcement officers in Indiana which do have significant additional powers granted by statute within the criminal realm, but it sure isn't DNR.

My guess is that this stems from the fact that they can go at will pretty much anywhere Bambi may roam without having to present any good reason where most all other officers can't/don't/choose not to. You will never be startled by kicking up a (regular) state trooper in your own woods, but with DNR it is entirely possible.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

My guess is that this stems from the fact that they can go at will pretty much anywhere Bambi may roam without having to present any good reason where most all other officers can't/don't/choose not to.

Mostly "choose not to". Open Fields doctrine.

"Open Fields".—In Hester v. United States,285 the Court held that the Fourth Amendment did not protect "open fields" and that, therefore, police searches in such areas as pastures, wooded areas, open water, and vacant lots need not comply with the requirements of warrants and probable cause. The Court's announcement in Katz v. United States286 that the Amendment protects "people not places" cast some doubt on the vitality of the open fields principle, but all such doubts were cast away in Oliver v. United States.287 Invoking Hester's reliance on the literal wording of the Fourth Amendment (open fields are not "effects") and distinguishing Katz, the Court ruled that the open fields exception applies to fields that are fenced and posted. "[A]n individual may not legitimately demand privacy for activities conducted out of doors in fields, except in the area immediately surrounding the home...

"Open Fields" :: Fourth Amendment--Search and Seizure :: US Constitution :: US Codes and Statutes :: US Law :: Justia

The only time I can recall venturing into the woods or an open field was during a pursuit or track.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Mostly "choose not to". Open Fields doctrine.



"Open Fields" :: Fourth Amendment--Search and Seizure :: US Constitution :: US Codes and Statutes :: US Law :: Justia

The only time I can recall venturing into the woods or an open field was during a pursuit or track.

Thanks for the good information!

 

[Tactically Fat]

So DNR officers are federal agents?

The State Police routinely enforce federal motor carrier regs, and police officers of all stripes work with the feds to enforce federal drug laws. The idea that the DNR has some sort of super powers is really a myth, especially when one considers that if they are going to go federal with anything they have to get the US attorney's office to file.

There is one class of law-enforcement officers in Indiana which do have significant additional powers granted by statute within the criminal realm, but it sure isn't DNR.

Sheriffs? Coroners?

 

[Fargo]

Sheriffs? Coroners?

Nope, below is the title 35 definition. If we are talking powers granted by statute and constitution, one of the defined agencies has the ability to control virtually all the criminal cases of all the others in addition to having general powers under title 35. It just isn't apparent because they almost never exercise those general powers and so don't fall into what people generally percieve to be law enforcement.

Sec. 185. (a) “Law enforcement officer” means:
(1) a police officer (including a correctional police officer), sheriff, constable, marshal, prosecuting attorney, special prosecuting attorney, special deputy prosecuting attorney, the securities commissioner, or the inspector general;

(2) a deputy of any of those persons;

(3) an investigator for a prosecuting attorney or for the inspector general;

(4) a conservation officer;

(5) an enforcement officer of the alcohol and tobacco commission;

(6) an enforcement officer of the securities division of the office of the secretary of state;  or

(7) a gaming agent employed under IC 4-33-4.5 or a gaming control officer employed by the gaming control division under IC 4-33-20.


(b) “Law enforcement officer”, for purposes of IC 35-42-2-1, includes an alcoholic beverage enforcement officer, as set forth in IC 35-42-2-1.

(c) “Law enforcement officer”, for purposes of IC 35-45-15, includes a federal enforcement officer, as set forth in IC 35-45-15-3.

(d) “Law enforcement officer”, for purposes of IC 35-44.1-3-1 and IC 35-44.1-3-2, includes a school resource officer (as defined in IC 20-26-18.2-1) and a school corporation police officer appointed under IC 20-26-16.

- See more at: Indiana Code Title 35. Criminal Law and Procedure § 35-31.5-2-185 | FindLaw

 

[amboy49]

Yep. Dad and I found several that were cool when I was around 10.

1st time out up at Boone's Pond in our brand new molded 2 man pontoon style boat. Got motioned into shore. No registration. Dad Didnt realize that a trolling motor put us over the threshold for registration. (He thought only larger or gas powered required it) He let us off with a verbal warning as long as we stopped right then and there. It was obvious the boat was shiny and brand new and we werent doing it habitually.

A couple weeks later we are back out with our freshly tagged and numbered boat and got waved in again. What now?!?!? Numbers were not far enough above the water line he said. Dad pointed out to be high enough off the water he would have had to use numbers too small to be compliant. CO thought about it for a minute and said that under the circumstances too low was better than too small, and to carry on.

I have single man 9' inflatable pontoon boat I use on the Pere Marquette in Michigan to fish for king salmon. It does have a place where a trolling motor could be mounted although I have never done so. From your post I believe should I choose to put a trolling motor on it I would have to have registration info including numbers on the boat ? The boat pontoons don't ride much above 12" out of the water, if that much, and I don't really see a place a registration number could be placed.

I've not fished Boone's pond yet, but have thought about doing so just to have a place to take my wife and grandkids. Are the inflatables included in the registration requirement ?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Cameramonkey]

I have single man 9' inflatable pontoon boat I use on the Pere Marquette in Michigan to fish for king salmon. It does have a place where a trolling motor could be mounted although I have never done so. From your post I believe should I choose to put a trolling motor on it I would have to have registration info including numbers on the boat ? The boat pontoons don't ride much above 12" out of the water, if that much, and I don't really see a place a registration number could be placed.

I've not fished Boone's pond yet, but have thought about doing so just to have a place to take my wife and grandkids. Are the inflatables included in the registration requirement ?

Thanks in advance.

My understanding is any boat powered by ANYTHING but human power is required to be tagged (and taxed).

 

[DCR]

I have a non-motorized DNR permit on my kayak. It's not a boat registration, just permission to use state waters.