Prohibited Carry?

[DarkRose]

Ok, this might be a dumb question, but I'm asking anyway, because I didn't see any clarification in the Indiana Code that follows...

"IC 35-47-9
Chapter 9. Possession of Firearms on School Property and School Buses


<A name=IC35-47-9-1>IC 35-47-9-1
Exemptions from chapter
Sec. 1. This chapter does not apply to the following:
(1) A:
(A) federal;
(B) state; or
(C) local;
law enforcement officer.
(2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:
(A) a school; or
(B) another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function;
to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.
(3) A person who:
(A) may legally possess a firearm; and
(B) possesses the firearm in a motor vehicle that is being operated by the person to transport another person to or from a school or a school function.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.11.
<A name=IC35-47-9-2>IC 35-47-9-2
Possession of firearms on school property, at school function, or on school bus; felony
Sec. 2. A person who possesses a firearm:
(1) in or on school property;
(2) in or on property that is being used by a school for a school function; or
(3) on a school bus;
commits a Class D felony.
As added by P.L.140-1994, SEC.11."

Does this apply to ANY school, or only state schools, primary and secondary schools, etc?
i.e. does it apply to a private, non-state funded university.

I have to go pick my girlfriend up from night class tonight around midnight in a not-great section of Indianapolis, and it's not a state university, it's a private academy, how does this fall with the code?

It appears that by the first section, it may not apply to me because I'm a person who may legally posses a firearm, and it can be left in my vehicle, as I'd be transporting a person from a school function. (in Bold and Blue)

Am I reading this correctly?

 

[TriggerWork]

That is the way I understand the law to read. I drop my son off at school each morning! It better be the intent!

 

[DarkRose]

So as long as the gun stays in the vehicle I'm good, if I get out with it on me, I could be in trouble if caught... Unless I'm not picking her up directly on school property (not sure how it's set up, never been there yet)

 

[eldirector]

Schools are very narrowly defined in code. I'll have to dig up the citation, but Colleges and Universities are not schools. Private K-12 ARE schools. Where exactly is your GF taking classes, and maybe we can know for sure? (I'll still try to find the code).

Also, the "transport to and from" thing means you can be armed in your car, but cannot get out and cannot leave your gun in the car if you do get out. I'm not even sure it allows you to help your kid get in, as that would require you to leave the vehicle.

 

[Prometheus]

Is your GF in highschool or college? That section of code doesn't apply to colleges, they are not prohibited by law. The college may have a rule, but it's no different than a rule at costco. All they can do is ask you to leave.
K-12 and preschool is where the no carry laws (and car exemption) come into play.

 

[cosermann]

. . . Also, the "transport to and from" thing means you can be armed in your car, but cannot get out and cannot leave your gun in the car if you do get out. . . ..

Correct, the statute refers to, "a motor vehicle that is being operated by the person." You get out of the vehicle, you cease operating the vehicle at that point. I think that's been our concensus here.

I don't have Ciyou's book handy at the moment. Can anyone confirm?

 

[DarkRose]

Is your GF in highschool or college? That section of code doesn't apply to colleges, they are not prohibited by law. The college may have a rule, but it's no different than a rule at costco. All they can do is ask you to leave.
K-12 and preschool is where the no carry laws (and car exemption) come into play.

Ok, that's what I was trying to find out, it's a college/academy. Indy Chef's Academy.
I couldn't find the section that specified what constituted a "school"

I'm 31, she better not be in high school, lol.

 

[MinuteMan47]

So, does this mean teachers and people hired by the school are exempt?


(2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:
(A) a school; or

 

[eldirector]

Ok, that's what I was trying to find out, it's a college/academy. Indy Chef's Academy.
I couldn't find the section that specified what constituted a "school"

I'm 31, she better not be in high school, lol.

Chef's Academy? Yeah, you are fine. Heck, I would *definitely* carry in that part of town.

 

[eldirector]

So, does this mean teachers and people hired by the school are exempt?


(2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:
(A) a school; or

At first blush, yes. They are clearly employed and clearly performing an activity authorized by the school. I suspect a teacher would still get fired, though.

 

[MinuteMan47]

At first blush, yes. They are clearly employed and clearly performing an activity authorized by the school. I suspect a teacher would still get fired, though.

Ok, and how about a guy contracted by the school (not employed by the school) to do work. Say....HVAC work or maintenance.

 

[eldirector]

Ok, and how about a guy contracted by the school (not employed by the school) to do work. Say....HVAC work or maintenance.

Great question, and I don't really know.

I have thought about doing some side contract work for schools (I work for a educational software company), and have seriously thought about including a clause that read something like: "...hereby authorized to carry a concealed weapon for personal protection, while on school property, as per Indiana Code 35-47-9-1 and 35-47-5-2.5 ..."

 

[Joe Williams]

So as long as the gun stays in the vehicle I'm good, if I get out with it on me, I could be in trouble if caught... Unless I'm not picking her up directly on school property (not sure how it's set up, never been there yet)

No sir... YOU must stay in the vehicle.

To be in compliance with the letter of the law, the gun can only be on the property so long as it's possessed by a legal person OPERATING the vehicle.... you can't be operating the vehicle if you step out. This also means that your passenger cannot legally carry on school property, even in the vehicle with an LTCH. They are not operating the vehicle.

 

[eldirector]

No sir... YOU must stay in the vehicle.

To be in compliance with the letter of the law, the gun can only be on the property so long as it's possessed by a legal person OPERATING the vehicle.... you can't be operating the vehicle if you step out. This also means that your passenger cannot legally carry on school property, even in the vehicle with an LTCH. They are not operating the vehicle.

You got it. One of the most evil parts of the whole shebang.

You can't assist your son/daughter or elderly parent in/out of the car, and all other passengers (even if they do not get out of the car) cannot be armed.

Edit (addition):
I am wondering, though. If you can get a DUI while "operating" a vehicle you are not inside of (eg: start the vehicle, exit it, and still get arrested), are you not arguably "operating" a vehicle if you are getting in/out and helping your passengers in/out? IC defines an "operator" as:

IC 9-13-2-118
Operator
Sec. 118. (a) "Operator" means, except as provided in subsection (b), when used in reference to a motor vehicle, a person, other than a chauffeur or a public passenger chauffeur, who:
(1) drives or is in actual physical control of a motor vehicle upon a highway; or
(2) is exercising control over or steering a motor vehicle being towed by a motor vehicle.
(b) "Operator", for purposes of IC 9-25, means a person other than a chauffeur who is in actual physical control of a motor vehicle upon

 

[sj kahr k40]

No sir... YOU must stay in the vehicle.

To be in compliance with the letter of the law, the gun can only be on the property so long as it's possessed by a legal person OPERATING the vehicle.... you can't be operating the vehicle if you step out. This also means that your passenger cannot legally carry on school property, even in the vehicle with an LTCH. They are not operating the vehicle.

Actually in this case, since it's not a school per the IC, he can carry anywhere legally, school might have a rule against guns but it's not against the law.

 

[DarkRose]

Chef's Academy? Yeah, you are fine. Heck, I would *definitely* carry in that part of town.

Yeah, and she told me tonight to not be so paranoid, it's on the "right" side of the tracks, lol.

 

[Bill B]

So, does this mean teachers and people hired by the school are exempt?


(2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:
(A) a school; or

No. It means security guards, or others in authorized activities, are exempt:

(2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:
(A) a school; or
(B) another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function;
to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.

Written in longhand it would look like this:
A person who has been employed or authorized by a school, or another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function,to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.

Other activities could mean shooting teams, drill teams, etc.

 

[ATM]

No. It means security guards, or others in authorized activities, are exempt:



Written in longhand it would look like this:
A person who has been employed or authorized by a school, or another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function,to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.

Other activities could mean shooting teams, drill teams, etc.

Teaching is not an authorized activity or function at a school?

 

[MinuteMan47]

No. It means security guards, or others in authorized activities, are exempt:



Written in longhand it would look like this:
A person who has been employed or authorized by a school, or another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function,to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.

Other activities could mean shooting teams, drill teams, etc.

Bill,

Here is how I read it...


A person who has been employed or authorized by a school, OR

another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function,to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school



Thus the reason for (A) and (B)...

 

[ATM]

Here's a breakdown and my thoughts:

(2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:
(A) a school; or
(B) another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function;
to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.

A person employed or authorized by:
A or B
to
X, Y, or Z

So, if you are:

employed or authorized (to carry a handgun?)*


either:


by a school
or
by the owner/operator of the property a school uses,

specifically for the purpose of

acting as security,
or
participating in a school function,
or
participating in any authorized school activity




* My guess is that the part I added in red was likely the original implied intent - but it did not make it into the law. This leaves open the possibility of a completely legal loophole they likely never intended.

That's why it's debatable if teachers or others could legally carry when employed or authorized to participate even without specific authorization to carry a handgun.

Just my