Question on a legal issue..

[Colinb913]

I am in the process of selling a gun to a woman. The woman is a instructor, who is training another younger girl in shooting competition, and needs a 9mm 1911. Well, that's what I am selling her.

Unfortunately, the lady I am selling the gun to, told me that she is buying the gun for a 19 year old girl that she teaches. I know that the 19 year old is ok to own a handgun, and the lady is ok to own a handgun. But would this be considered a straw sale?

I mean, a individual is buying a pistol for another individual. I did a little reading into the instructor, and she's a legit shooting coach, and is very active in the firearms community. I just don't want to accidentally commit a straw sale.

I told the instructor I would need to see a LTCH and a IN drivers license, both of which she has, so I know selling HER the gun would be ok, but I am wary of the fact that she told me she was purchasing the gun for another individual.

What says INGO?

 

[Redhorse]

You're selling her the gun. Once the gun is in her hands and the money is in yours, you aren't breaking any laws. And remember, this is a private sale, all sales to under 21 individuals is legal as long as its done so privately. So basically if she wants to sell it privately to the other young girl, it's legal. If you're concerned, have this 19 year old girl buy it from you directly since its legal privately.

On a side note, +1 to this 19 year old girl getting into shooting. She's my age, maybe we could go on a date to the range sometime? Haha I'm kidding.

Anyways, it's legal, you don't need to worry. This 19 year old does need to get her ltch permit though in order to simplify things. It helped me when I purchased a handgun.

 

[Colinb913]

I am 19 as well, so I am well aware of the problems we face. I just wanted to make sure that I wasn't going to get in any trouble. All the IC I could read pertained to a straw purchaser, and not the seller. So I guess I am in the clear!

 

[Bunnykid68]

Is she purchasing on behalf of the girl or as a gift to the girl? It is perfectly legal to buy a gun for another person as a gift.

 

[cosermann]

The OP could sell directly to a 19 yr old in Indiana who is otherwise not prohibited from owning a firearm.

That would simplify things, eh?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Ok, like coserman says, why the Rube Goldberg stuff?

Do you have reason to believe that the 19 year old is a prohibited person?

 

[Colinb913]

Not at all. The 19 year old can't come down to evansville but the instructor can. So that's why I can't just sell to the 19 year old.

 

[Jack Burton]

A key consideration on a straw sale is who's money is used to purchase it. I can buy a gun and give it to my neighbor. No problem. I can buy a gun and sell it to my neighbor. No problem there either. But what I cannot do is have my neighbor hand me $500 of his money, buy a gun for him with that money, and then give it to him.

In the first two instances I am the legitimate buyer of the gun. In the last I am not.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Ah, logistics. I see.

 

[CarmelHP]

Is a Form 4473 being completed? Are you an FFL? The rule on straw purchases applies to sales by an FFL to prevent by-passing the Instant Check system. Ever read the US Attorney's Office press releases on the ATFE website? The charges are "making a false statement on a Form 4473."

What is a straw purchase?

"A straw purchase is an illegal firearm purchase where the actual buyer of the gun, being unable to pass the required federal background check or desiring to not have his or her name associated with the transaction, uses a proxy buyer who can pass the required background check to purchase the firearm for him/her. It is highly illegal and punishable by a $250,000 fine and 10 years in prison." Source: Don'tLie.org

Not illegal if not an FFL unless there is some other disability. Geez.

 

[kludge]

^this^

 

[Kirk Freeman]

A key consideration on a straw sale is who's money is used to purchase it.

Yeah, no straw buyer issue as no licensee involved for intrastate sale. I was just concerned about why the Rube Goldberg mechanism here.


With further info provided, my concern is a non-issue. But I have been told I worry about stuff too much.

 

[HoughMade]

Yeah, no straw buyer issue as no licensee involved for intrastate sale. I was just concerned about why the Rube Goldberg mechanism here.


With further info provided, my concern is a non-issue. But I have been told I worry about stuff too much.

How much are you charging for all this?

 

[Kirk Freeman]

How much are you charging for all this?

The rule on INGO is that I only charge rhino and that is in cases of .45.

 

[HoughMade]

YES!

 

[WebSnyper]

The rule on INGO is that I only charge rhino and that is in cases of .45.

I'd change that to cases of 22 LR these days. Inflation and all and the fact that it is Rhino would warrant that I would think.

 

[Redhorse]

Just sell it to her and tell her whatever she does with it is her business. It's a private sale all the way around

 

[CPT Nervous]

...need to get her ltch permit...

Once you have your LTCH permit, that allows you to obtain your LTCH, right? You've said "LTCH permit" before. I'm not familiar with it, can you please explain it?

 

[Redhorse]

Liscene to carry handgun permit? Come on, you're the grammar genius on here, can't you figure out a simple four letter phrase? And we've been over this, reply to the thread along with the side note.

As to the OP, if she gets her LTCH permit, it'd help in the future if she wanted to buy a handgun.

Yes, I said it, LTCH permit, do you still not get it CPT? You have to be permitted to carry a gun in Indiana. I don't think if I say "ltch" and "permit" side by side that it really matters.

 

[CPT Nervous]

Liscene to carry handgun permit? Come on, you're the grammar genius on here, can't you figure out a simple four letter phrase? And we've been over this, reply to the thread along with the side note.

As to the OP, if she gets her LTCH permit, it'd help in the future if she wanted to buy a handgun.

Yes, I said it, LTCH permit, do you still not get it CPT? You have to be permitted to carry a gun in Indiana. I don't think if I say "ltch" and "permit" side by side that it really matters.

License to Carry a Handgun Permit. It's redundant.


You have to be licensed. You don't have to be licensed and permitted. It's the same thing. There's no reason to say it twice in the same phrase.


That's like saying, "Too, also, as well." No one says that.