Secession... We're going about it the wrong way

[nemo97]

I've been somewhat humored as of late of all the petitions to the federal government to allow states the ability to secede from the Union.

I, however, think we are going about things the wrong way. What if, instead of trying to exit the Union, we petition to kick out (excommunicate so to speak) states that screw up the rest of the Union, such as, New York, California, Massechusetts, New Jersey, illinois and the like?

The Union isn't so horrible when you factor out these albatrosses, is it?

 

[6mm Shoot]

I like that idea. It sounds good to me.

 

[netsecurity]

Except those are all the port states that control our trade....

 

[the1kidd03]

That wouldn't really be "the right way" either.

The principle behind the movement is merely to show the powers at hand, that a large number of the populace has been very displeased with how they've been running things for many years. This is about the only way they can show that through legal means while garnering media support/coverage on it.

The government would do well to take notice and take it seriously, rather than further divide the nation and ignore so many people.

 

[ben992]

That would leave out many good folks. For instance, Illinois....most of the people in the state have good sense--its Chicago that screws the state up. The islands (cities) in the sea of decent, contributors to society--they are the problem...at least seemingly.

 

[HavokCycle]

build a wall, and ship liberals to the other side. within a year they'll be climbing the wall to get over, as they're picked off. within two, we can reclaim the newly empty half of the country.

 

[roisigns]

US 2012 Election Results Map by County

http://commoncts.blogspot.com/2012/11/us-2012-election-results-map-by-county.html

 

[Derpacoon]

All of these petitions for succession are very interesting.

But is there even a "right way" to succeed from the union. Is there any constitutional law or mention of how a state exits the union.

Since state legislatures just have to ratify the Constitution to join, don't they just have to decided to leave the union the same way.

Isn't this what the South ran into during the Civil War(War of Northern Aggression depending on where you are from hehe)

 

[Scutter01]

All of these petitions for succession are very interesting.

But is there even a "right way" to succeed from the union. Is there any constitutional law or mention of how a state exits the union.

I hate to be the grammar nazi, but it's "secede" and "secession". Thank you, and you may now return to your regularly scheduled grousing.

 

[Prometheus]

Except those are all the port states that control our trade....

Ummmm.... I think you are about 12 states shy there, lol.

 

[buckstopshere]

US 2012 Election Results Map by County

COMMON CENTS: US 2012 Election Results Map by County:

I think these maps really demonstrate the divide between urban and rural folks. Large cities, small in area comparatively to the state, large population.

Cities are full of progressives. Many, perhaps most, feel they've evolved past the rural folks which is why they know best. Who in their right mind would want to leave in the country???

 

[JoshuaW]

I think these maps really demonstrate the divide between urban and rural folks. Large cities, small in area comparatively to the state, large population.

Cities are full of progressives. Many, perhaps most, feel they've evolved past the rural folks which is why they know best. Who in their right mind would want to leave in the country???

The thing is, cities are also where most of the population is. Yes, land wise that map is mostly red, but the blue areas hold most of the country's population. It's not that city dwellers think they have evolved past rural dwellers, it's that rural dwellers have failed to learn math and therefor are incapable of calculating what constitutes a popular majority and have instead decided to insist that city dwellers are out to get them and destroy their way of life.

 

[Cowboy71]

it's that rural dwellers have failed to learn math and therefor are incapable of calculating what constitutes a popular majority and have instead decided to insist that city dwellers are out to get them and destroy their way of life.

Well, fortunately for us poor dumb, math-challenged hicks we have a little thing called the United States Constitution to protect us from the tyranny of majorities we're just too plumb fired ignorant to wrap our pea brains around.

And btw, city dwellers are out to get us and destroy our way of life. I give you Mike Bloomberg and his ilk as ample evidence.

 

[Survivalcookie]

The thing is, cities are also where most of the population is. Yes, land wise that map is mostly red, but the blue areas hold most of the country's population. It's not that city dwellers think they have evolved past rural dwellers, it's that rural dwellers have failed to learn math and therefor are incapable of calculating what constitutes a popular majority and have instead decided to insist that city dwellers are out to get them and destroy their way of life.

And more people in the cities get free stuff...those in the rural are tend to work for what they get.

 

[zippy23]

I think that if it ever happens, like minded people will move to the states that will prosper, it will be a necessity for those that are informed, cities and states will collapse hopefully I have moved before it has happened. This is a real SHTF scenario. Texas may be the place to go, at least NORTH texas!! but hey, we just all need to be prepared

 

[yepthatsme]

It amazes me how quickly our president has been able to divide our country and on so many levels as well. He has been able to accomplish something in four years that our enemies have been trying to do for decades. With the media on the side of the left, they are quickly convincing the American people that the majority of Americans actually want more government control. The sad thing is, we are falling for it. Instead of dividing ourselves, we need to stand together to stop this movement towards tyranny. Just my

 

[Faine]

A friend of mine and I were discussing things recently and we touched on some of this. It's practically impossible to secede from the US. There are not only major financial and political issues there is the issue of the legality of doing it. Land rights come into place, federal government installations located on newly foreign territory, it's just not practical, feasible or in my estimation the proper way to go about getting what you want.

We also talked on "cities". For those who live in rural areas your life is typically a bit more simple. You interact with your neighbors for miles around you in some situations, you "know" a rather large percentage of the people in the area, and if you're in a small town you might know even more than that of the population. Civil matters are generally few in comparison to the urban/large city environment and people in general get along well with each other.

In cities however there is another new and unrealized issue coming about. We are expecting more and more for people to live in closer and closer proximity and everyone "values their privacy". So we're living closer together and we are expected to stay out of the affairs of our neighbors and those around us. It's creating a socially backward vortex that is ripping our cities and nation apart. Because at its core communication is the solution to almost every issue, as we resolve to reduce communication yet increase the number of people we should be communicating with we increase the number of issues that arise from that lack of communication. In extreme situations this leads to violence. Kids joining gangs for "protection", "friends", "family", "money", or whatever else. How many of those things could be provided by a willing and receptive community built around those children?

I'm not advocating either side of this argument only stating that the vast differences between urban and rural life are what ultimately will drive these issues to a head. Imagine if you will the farmers of America stand up and refuse to sell their stocks of grain, beans, livestock or refuse to grow those resources. It would lead to chaos in the cities. Rural America would be absolutely fine, Urban America would turn into war zones over night.

This is not to incite anything but to show that rural America is who truly runs this country. For every corporation lobbying in Washington, there are rural American suppliers that provide them with the materials they need to do business. If rural America puts its foot down, then you will see true American power and not the corrupt American system of foreign corporations controlling our legislators making decisions. If we want to take back our country and put a stop to what almost everyone on both sides of the aisle can classify as "wrongness" we first need to eliminate the splinter in our eye so that we can clearly see.

We live in a Constitutional Republic, not a Democracy, that means the Constitution overrides majority opinion. The only way to move us to a Democracy is to dismantle the Constitution which will require great effort from a super majority which we may never see, America has never been more divisive than it is today.

disclaimer: I feel it necessary as this topic does slide very close to some taboo topics to note that I in no way endorse secession, war, or violence. I believe in using the system set up by our forefathers to ensure the pursuit of life, liberty and happiness.

 

[roisigns]

We live in a Constitutional Republic, not a Democracy, that means the Constitution overrides majority opinion. The only way to move us to a Democracy is to dismantle the Constitution which will require great effort from a super majority which we may never see, America has never been more divisive than it is today.

This is a point that I've tried to make to others. Our nation is assembled under a set of rules (laws). If you do not like the Constitution, follow the rules for changing it.

 

[johnny45]

Wow.... interesting maps.
I wonder why Alaska is shaded out on the second one.

 

[JR50]

I wonder why Alaska is shaded out on the second one.

Johnny,
Those are projections of electoral votes made before voting ended in the last election. That's why in the first map some states are listed as 'leading'. The polling stations probably didn't close in Alaska when the second map was made. Ever since Reagan beat Carter and Carter capitulated before all of the polls closed, the networks haven't made predictions before the polls closed even though we all knew which way some states would go. The early predictions supposedly discourage some from voting, affecting voting results.