selling FTF anyone considered this

[zlittell]

so i am sitting in government class and the teacher is talking about the process of becoming a us citizen.

and a kid raises his hand and says dont you have to sign something saying your a good guy.

apparently its called an affadavid (sp) and wouldnt it be a sweet idea for those worried to have one of these signed when selling a gun to someone face-to-face.

-zack-

 

[Blue Tile Spook]

I have not heard of individuals in FTF transactions asking for someone to sign an affidavit, but some do ask for a bill of sale to be signed. Remember, too, that individuals in the sale have the right not to complete the sale if they feel that something isn't "right" with the other individual or if the other person is not legal to purchase a weapon (not an Indiana citizen, underage, known-to-you-felon, etc.).

I am not sure how an signed affidavit "of good character" would hold up in court if there were ever any problems. I wouldn't think it would, but IANAL.

 

[Irish1218]

I have always had someone sign a bill of sale, keep one copy for my lockbox and one for him. This way I have some record of the transaction

 

[fpdshooter]

Acually it's all about culpability. You have to "knowingly" sell a gun to a felon to be in any kind of trouble. Hell, the guy may be 60ish, clean cut wearing a suit and tie. He could also be a convicted felon for fraud. If you don't know then there is no problem with the sale.

 

[jeremy]

Personally if my word and handshake are not good enough, neither am I. This would be a deal breaker for me.

 

[SigSense]

Personally if my word and handshake are not good enough, neither am I. This would be a deal breaker for me.

Exactly my feelings....

 

[redneckjoe]

Exactly my feelings....

think about this this is why i do a bill of sales not only for me but the other person because what if you buy a gun off a really nice guy and think every things OK and leave with the gun he goes home and calls the cops some time and says its been stole (i know it would take one hell of a person but if) you get in a situation where the cops look at you gun and thin its your word against his just what if???

 

[MadBomber]

Exactly my feelings....

Same here. I'm always careful to meet in a public place and to have my "BS" detector tuned to the highest setting. I've done 3 recent transactions with INGO members and have had nothing but good vibes. But an affidavit would turn me off. A Bill of Sale is fine but that's as far as I'd go.

 

[jeremy]

A bill of sale or a receipt is different. I have no issue with that. But an affidavit that is a no go.

 

[haldir]

There isn't any way that I am going to sign or have someone else sign an affidavit. I have seen guns on here that I would have been interested in but the other person said they wanted to see my carry permit or wanted a signed bill of sale so I skipped on past them. Yes I do have a carry permit. No I have nothing to hide. Just don't think too much info is good for anyone.

 

[Ashkelon]

an affidavit would be worthless for proof in a FTF. If it is a self verifying affidavit then the potential felon is affirming that he is a good guy. Worthless because he is already a felon making a misrepresentation.
Having a notary on hand only requires the person to prove their identity such as showing a driver's license. Felons lie. Plain and simple.
Bill of sale is no better. It completely boils down to "knowledge".
If anything the bill of sale or the affidavit could be worse for the seller as there is now a paper trail linking the prohibited buyer to the seller. Some prosecutors (and I deal with many on a daily basis) would argue that the bill of sale was executed cover the arse of the seller and is nothing but a paper front for a prohibited transaction.
All of the above are why you don't see many of these cases working their way through the Courts. VERY difficult to prove and relatively easy to defend.
Unless there is a requirement of a NICS check executing any document potentially exposes the seller more than nothing at all. I know it sounds counter intuitive but that is how how system works sometimes. I am a lawyer sooooo Flame On......

 

[jedi]

so i am sitting in government class and the teacher is talking about the process of becoming a us citizen.

and a kid raises his hand and says dont you have to sign something saying your a good guy.

Correct you don't sign anything saying "you are a good guy" however someone who is trying to become a US citizen must fill out N-400 TRUTHFULLY.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/N-400.pdf

Look at section 10.A, B, C, D, E
and then PART 11

I certify, under penalty of perjury under the laws of the United States of America, that this application, and the evidence submitted with it, are all true and correct.

followed the the SIGNATURE of the person.

So if they lie on any part of the form they are NOT a 'good guy' and the application is denied. If the federal government finds out later that they lied they can under the law revoke the citizenship!

So that they did not sign!

You have to answer truthfully the entire form. If Juan comes into the US illegal in 1990 and gets caught and deported in 1991 and then comes back into the US in 2007 on a visa with permit residence option and then in 2009 files for naturalization JUAN must state his 1990 illegal entry and 1991 deportation! It will not matter for his current process since 10+ years have passed so Juan is forgiven the 1990 illegal act. However if Juan does not put it on his application and immigrant finds the record (they will) then he will get denied for falsification of his application!

The government is not considered with the about of illegal activity that you did (and paid for your crime [eg. jail time, 10+ years out of the country after being deported]) but that you are 10,000% TRUTHFUL about your past.

Now if Juan happens to have a crime sheet 20 pages long and is in the mob, etc. off course he is not going to be accepted. If Juan was a criminal 20+ years ago was sent to jail, came out and become a model citizen in his country and then applies 25 years later he probably will get accepted as he has shown change in character (provided he tells all the facts!)

 

[DRob]

It's the seller's game

If you want to buy the gun, you gotta' play by the seller's rules. If you don't like the rules, find another game.