Semi-auto M249!?

[ScouT6a]

Yes, enginepower, we set the head space and timing on our M2s every time, before we rolled out of the wire.
IIRC, the SAW now has a "fixed" rate of 850 rpm.
People thought the M60s could be temperamental but that was usually coming from non Infantry types. The biggest thing I saw people do wrong with the M60 was having the bolt forward, slamming the feed tray cover closed, and then yanking the charging handle to the rear when the "top hat" on the bolt was outside the track on the feed tray cover. Bad things happened then.
Had to remember that you were dealing with German engineering.Lol

 

[Woobie]

No, still gotta set the headspace and timing, I'm afraid. And I have yet to ever see a 240L, don't think they're common outside of SOCOM yet.

The nice thing about the SAW is that it's a lot of controllable firepower in a pretty small package. I had no problem humping a SAW and extra ammo, can't say the same for a 240. And while it's "just" 5.56, thats A LOT of 5.56. Enfilade fire at that rate will cut up a formation, don't care who you are. Unless you're doing PR with vics, 7.62 is a little too much.

Negative. Laid my hands on a new m2 earlier this year. No headspace and timing. Barrel clicks in similar to a 240, sorta. And yes, the 240L's are in some infantry line companies now.

 

[Woobie]

Yes, enginepower, we set the head space and timing on our M2s every time, before we rolled out of the wire.
IIRC, the SAW now has a "fixed" rate of 850 rpm.
People thought the M60s could be temperamental but that was usually coming from non Infantry types. The biggest thing I saw people do wrong with the M60 was having the bolt forward, slamming the feed tray cover closed, and then yanking the charging handle to the rear when the "top hat" on the bolt was outside the track on the feed tray cover. Bad things happened then.
Had to remember that you were dealing with German engineering.Lol

Yes, the saws and 240's are fixed rate of fire now. I think you're right about 850 on the saw. It's 650 on the newer 240B's. I assume the 240L's are as well.

 

[teddy12b]

Personally, I was never issued a SAW. I asked, and they issued it to the tiny guy next to me so go figure. I always liked them and yes even as late as 2004 I had heard that the saw ammo wasn't safe in M16's, but M16 ammo was safe in a SAW.

Nostalgia, and man pride will sell these rifles off the shelves. A year from now it'll be interesting to see how the prices on these are compared to whenever they hit the market. I'd love to have one just to take it apart and keep putting it all back together just for the sake of it. If it were sub $2K I'd buy one. At $7K it's a rich mans toy, and I'll be happy for anyone who choses to buy one.

 

[Woobie]

Personally, I was never issued a SAW. I asked, and they issued it to the tiny guy next to me so go figure. I always liked them and yes even as late as 2004 I had heard that the saw ammo wasn't safe in M16's, but M16 ammo was safe in a SAW.

Nostalgia, and man pride will sell these rifles off the shelves. A year from now it'll be interesting to see how the prices on these are compared to whenever they hit the market. I'd love to have one just to take it apart and keep putting it all back together just for the sake of it. If it were sub $2K I'd buy one. At $7K it's a rich mans toy, and I'll be happy for anyone who choses to buy one.

I can't say with certainty that saw ammo and m16 ammo have always been the same. I suspect they have. However, since I have been in, the saw ammo has always been m855 with m856 mixed in.

 

[Alamo]

... I'm not paying $7k for nostalgia, though.

Maybe you could organize a time-share.

 

[Cerberus]

I can't say with certainty that saw ammo and m16 ammo have always been the same. I suspect they have. However, since I have been in, the saw ammo has always been m855 with m856 mixed in.

Yes it has. I was using M855 ball in my SAW and the M16A2 in 1987. It was the M193 that was thought to be bad for the SAW at first. I do remember them going over that issue in USMC SOI at Camp Geiger. We were instructed to only fire the green and orange tip ammo in it. I was never issued M193 ball in my USMC years.

 

[Mark 1911]

Here ya go! Current bid $6775 or Buy it Now for $15,000!
M249 Post Dealer Sample : Machine Guns at GunBroker.com

 

[teddy12b]

I'd already seen that but now everyone on INGO is going to outbid me. So much for getting it for $50 now.

 

[cop car]

Negative. Laid my hands on a new m2 earlier this year. No headspace and timing. Barrel clicks in similar to a 240, sorta. And yes, the 240L's are in some infantry line companies now.

Can confirm on Limas being in regular infantry units. Not all units have the M2A1. Personally I don't like them, setting head space and timing isn't that big of a deal, but have to make it stupid proof.

 

[cop car]

Also I think it should be noted that the SAW was originally made as a 7.62x51 weapon. The Minimi. And some non regular units still use them in their 7.62x51 caliber.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mk_48_machine_gun

 

[Cerberus]

Also I think it should be noted that the SAW was originally made as a 7.62x51 weapon. The Minimi. And some non regular units still use them in their 7.62x51 caliber.

Mark 48 machine gun - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I don't think you are correct in this. The Minimi started life as a 5.56 weapon. The Mk 48 is a different beast, a scaled up version of the older Minimi.
FN Minimi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[cop car]

Yes the wiki article says that. And I might be mistaken.. But there was something in the history I read somewhere at some point that the 7.62 came first. But I may be wrong. I think a 7.62x51 saw would be much better than a 5.56 one though..

 

[Streck-Fu]

Also I think it should be noted that the SAW was originally made as a 7.62x51 weapon. The Minimi. And some non regular units still use them in their 7.62x51 caliber.

Mark 48 machine gun - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Mk48 is a lightweight machine gun that is the result of an expressed need by SOCOM. They wanted a much lighter 7.62 machine gun than the 240.. FN did use an early design of the Minime to develop the Mk48. The M249 used to be called the SAW but is not any more and is chambered in 5.56. It. too, is based off the Minime design. SOCOM also commissioned a version of the Mk48 in 5.56 and it is the Mk46.

Simply put:
The M240 is the FN MAG in 7.62.
M249 is 5.56 update of Minime
Mk48 is a lightweight 7.62 based on Minime
Mk46 is lightweight 5.56 based on Minime.

Yes the wiki article says that. And I might be mistaken.. But there was something in the history I read somewhere at some point that the 7.62 came first. But I may be wrong. I think a 7.62x51 saw would be much better than a 5.56 one though..

The M240 was first used as a coaxial gun on armor vehicles in the late 70s. The M249 came about around '85 or '86. The the M240 was adopted for infantry use to replace the M60s in 1990 or so. The Marines started using the 240 before the Army did.

Here is a good history:
M240: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/m240g-history.htm
M249: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/m249-history.htm

 

[teddy12b]

Here ya go! Current bid $6775 or Buy it Now for $15,000!
M249 Post Dealer Sample : Machine Guns at GunBroker.com

Just in case anyone was wondering, this rifle sold for over $11,000, with a total of 26 bids. Wow, somebody has some deep pockets and shallow brains.

 

[Streck-Fu]

Just in case anyone was wondering, this rifle sold for over $11,000, with a total of 26 bids. Wow, somebody has some deep pockets and shallow brains.

That was a full auto version. It does not seem the price is excessive.

 

[HoughMade]

...The M240 was first used as a coaxial gun on armor vehicles in the late 70s. The M249 came about around '85 or '86. The the M240 was adopted for infantry use to replace the M60s in 1990 or so. The Marines started using the 240 before the Army did...

I was enlisted in the Army NG (Mich) in the early '90s, and being the NG, we still had M60s. Also, being a rather sizable fellow (6'3" and 210# back then....40 more now) I was at first, a 60 "asst. gunner" which is a euphamism for an ammo mule. I was also a 60 gunner for a while. I know the 60 had it's issues, but no matter how illogical, I loved that beast...when it was on its bipod...firing. Humping it around, not so much.

 

[teddy12b]

That was a full auto version. It does not seem the price is excessive.

Oops, my bad. I thought that was a semi auto. $11k makes sense then and if anything seems cheaper than I'd have thought.

 

[Cerberus]

Simply put:
The M240 is the FN MAG in 7.62.

While I would not be surprised to learn that the old FN MAG 58 was made in other chamberings, I will state that it was most common in 7.62 NATO. So basically the M240 series is merely our version of the standard MAG 58. The USMC version is practically the same, the Army version has added handguards.

And for the record I always found the M60 a much easier MG to carry. Balance was much better. Too bad they were allowed to remain in service to the point of becoming problematic. And the E3 version sucked.

 

[Streck-Fu]

Poorly written on my part.... I did not mean to infer that other chamberings were made.