Sen. Elizabeth Warren Intros Legislation To Allow Refinancing Of Student Loans

[actaeon277]

...



So what's the problem with letting people who qualify refinance the loans they have with the lender they have?

If they do it without government intervention, then I have no problem.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

If they do it without government intervention, then I have no problem.

You paid for my education with government intervention, and I didn't even have to pay it back. It's called the GI Bill, and was one of the most successful government programs ever in terms of social mobility.

 

[jamil]

You paid for my education with government intervention, and I didn't even have to pay it back. It's called the GI Bill, and was one of the most successful government programs ever in terms of social mobility.

I don't really consider that as much of a "government program" as it is an incentive an employer offers to do a dangerous job.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I don't really consider that as much of a "government program" as it is an incentive an employer offers to do a dangerous job.

Then why isn't it a cash bonus? Why is it solely for education or training?

 

[actaeon277]

You paid for my education with government intervention, and I didn't even have to pay it back. It's called the GI Bill, and was one of the most successful government programs ever in terms of social mobility.

I don't really consider that as much of a "government program" as it is an incentive an employer offers to do a dangerous job.

Then why isn't it a cash bonus? Why is it solely for education or training?

I also consider it an incentive.
And any money given to a person can have strings attached.
I get eye care, dental, medical, education benefits at my work.
But, the money has to be used for eye care, dental, medical, and education. Or else it is theft.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I also consider it an incentive.
And any money given to a person can have strings attached.

Of course its an incentive. No one is arguing otherwise. Of course it has strings attached, that's self evident. The question is...and why are those strings attached? Why does the government mandate the money be used for education? Because its a *gasp* government program to provide veterans with a better chance at landing a good job once they exit military service. Veterans benefit from a government program designed to put education into the realm of possibility for those who otherwise would not have been able to get it.

Read your history. Many vets hadn't finished high school before entering military service, and therefore couldn't take advantage of their GI BIll to go to college. Yet another government program to help with education was set up, the results of which were the GED.

So, if we have a vested interest in making sure veterans get an education, providing for a more educated workforce, providing social mobility, etc...do we not have the same vested interest in educating those who don't enter military service? Do we not all benefit? INGO is full of "get an education if you don't like your crap job"...but not everyone can afford education, even trade schools, and have any credit history for a conventional loan. A program which allows subsidized loans, and which turns a profit, seems to be a pretty reasonable thing for a nation that wants to keep its place in the world.

No, you deny the GI Bill is a government program because its something you like...and it's awkward knowing you like a government program since they are the root of all evils in our society today.

 

[PistolBob]

Then why isn't it a cash bonus? Why is it solely for education or training?

It's a benefit that is offered that not many take advantage of. So it's a cheap bennie. Whereas handing out cash is always popular.

 

[PistolBob]

Let's talk about college money from the military. It's offered to almost everyone that qualifies to join and serve in the United States military, but no one is required to make use of it. Frankly, the feds could give a warm soft dookey about you ever becoming socially mobile...whatever the hell that is. Thinking the VA cares about your social mobility is just plain silly. They don't. The VA is in deep trouble right now, mistreating our wounded returning heros, when in fact the ugly blame lies in the laps of the congress.

Less than 10% of the registered voters in Indiana made it to the polls on Tuesday.

No one cares. It's never going to get better at this rate.

 

[actaeon277]

Of course its an incentive. No one is arguing otherwise. Of course it has strings attached, that's self evident. The question is...and why are those strings attached? Why does the government mandate the money be used for education? Because its a *gasp* government program to provide veterans with a better chance at landing a good job once they exit military service. Veterans benefit from a government program designed to put education into the realm of possibility for those who otherwise would not have been able to get it.

Read your history. Many vets hadn't finished high school before entering military service, and therefore couldn't take advantage of their GI BIll to go to college. Yet another government program to help with education was set up, the results of which were the GED.

So, if we have a vested interest in making sure veterans get an education, providing for a more educated workforce, providing social mobility, etc...do we not have the same vested interest in educating those who don't enter military service? Do we not all benefit? INGO is full of "get an education if you don't like your crap job"...but not everyone can afford education, even trade schools, and have any credit history for a conventional loan. A program which allows subsidized loans, and which turns a profit, seems to be a pretty reasonable thing for a nation that wants to keep its place in the world.

No, you deny the GI Bill is a government program because its something you like...and it's awkward knowing you like a government program since they are the root of all evils in our society today.

The GI Bill is available to people that undertake certain circumstances.
It is not available to everyone that breathes.
And here's how much I think of it.
I DID NOT USE IT. None.
My college came out of my pocket.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

The GI Bill is available to people that undertake certain circumstances.
It is not available to everyone that breathes.

As are subsidized student loans.

Frankly, the feds could give a warm soft dookey about you ever becoming socially mobile...whatever the hell that is. Thinking the VA cares about your social mobility is just plain silly.

Right. Except that's the exact reason the GI Bill came to be. To allow a large portion of the population, returning veterans, to gain education and training to become valuable workers in a day and age when college was out of reach of the majority of our citizens.

It has been heralded as one of the most significant pieces of legislation ever produced by the federal government—one that impacted the United States socially, economically and politically. But it almost never came to pass.The Servicemen’s Readjustment Act of 1944—commonly known as the GI Bill of Rights—nearly stalled in Congress as members of the House and Senate debated provisions of the controversial bill.
Some shunned the idea of paying unemployed Veterans $20 a week because they thought it diminished their incentive to look for work. Others questioned the concept of sending battle-hardened Veterans to colleges and universities, a privilege then reserved for the rich.
Despite their differences, all agreed something must be done to help Veterans assimilate into civilian life.
Much of the urgency stemmed from a desire to avoid the missteps following World War I, when discharged Veterans got little more than a $60 allowance and a train ticket home.
During the Great Depression, some Veterans found it difficult to make a living. Congress tried to intervene by passing the World War Adjusted Act of 1924, commonly known as the Bonus Act. The law provided a bonus based on the number of days served. But there was a catch: most Veterans wouldn’t see a dime for 20 years.
A group of Veterans marched on Washington, D.C., in the summer of 1932 to demand full payment of their bonuses. When they didn’t get it, most went home. But some decided to stick around until they got paid. They were later kicked out of town following a bitter standoff with U.S. troops. The incident marked one of the greatest periods of unrest our nation’s capital had ever known.
The return of millions of Veterans from World War II gave Congress a chance at redemption. But the GI Bill had far greater implications. It was seen as a genuine attempt to thwart a looming social and economic crisis. Some saw inaction as an invitation to another depression.

Source: History and Timeline - Education and Training

President Franklin D. Roosevelt’s Statement on Signing the G.I. BillJune 22, 1944
This bill, which I have signed today, substantially carries out most of the recommendations made by me in a speech on July 28, 1943, and more specifically in messages to the Congress dated October 27, 1943, and November 23, 1943:
It gives servicemen and women the opportunity of resuming their education or technical training after discharge, or of taking a refresher or retrainer course, not only without tuition charge up to $500 per school year, but with the right to receive a monthly living allowance while pursuing their studies.

As I previously mentioned, the government even commissioned a test that previously didn't exist in order for vets to show they had the equivalent of a high school diploma and could use those benefits.

In November 1942, the United States Armed Forces Institute asked the American Council on Education (ACE) to develop a battery of tests to measure high school-level academic skills.[SUP][8][/SUP] These tests gave military personnel and veterans who had enrolled in the military before completing high school a way to demonstrate their knowledge. Passing these tests gave returning soldiers and sailors the academic credentials they needed to get civilian jobs and gain access to post-secondary education or training.

Source: General Educational Development - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Again. Government program.

 

[jamil]

Then why isn't it a cash bonus? Why is it solely for education or training?

Are you kidding? What employers do that? Ask MY employer the same question about their benefit package. Why don't they just offer more cash instead of their tuition reimbursement program. What about their health insurance package that they provide without cost to the employee? Why don't they just offer cash instead of that? I dont have to use either. And if I don't use either, well too bad for me because they won't give me cash for not using it. I'm guessing they didn't force you to use the GI bill?

Yeah. Pretty much an employment benefit. Benefits are work incentives, except when you start thinking of them as entitlements.

 

[Hohn]

I can understand if you don't agree with Warren's politics, but she's far from stupid.

You're right. The better term is ignorant.

No one with a modicum of intellectual curiousity can remain so virulently ignorant, so maybe she is just plain incurious. Who cares about how the economy works, something, somewere isn't fair!

Elizabeth's Warren's Career: She Didn't Build That. (her high cheekbones did).

I just wish Fauxcahontas would say more things in public so her stupidity can further embarrass those of her party.

 

[roadrunner681]

look i wish i hadn't went to collage( where i went was more of a trade school anyways) some times i spent a lot of money i wouldn't of spent and i give up a 1/4 of my income a month. and i can tell you frankly that the government should stay out of it, i went to school to be a diesel and alternate fuels tech( a mechanic) now why in the hell should i had to take english, math, business math, American history the same things you supposed to learn in public high school, FOREIGN history( that one really pissed me off) business math, psychology( which makes no sense what so ever), two classes on learning to type on a computer one class on excel and two more classes on writing and this was required by the government and the state of ohio. now each of these classes was six weeks long for five hours a day five days a week and i took doubles so i was in class for 10 hours day now why should i a guy that wants to be a mechanic be forced to take all those stupid extra classes. i dont use anything that those classes teach at work. and when i did work on trucks half of them dont speak freaking english anyways. i dont get it its like they set you up for massive debt.

 

[ATOMonkey]

Have you ever wondered why 20 years ago you needed at least 10 credit hours less for the same degree.

40 years ago you needed a lot less than that.

College is a racket. Too much meddling by various institutes. I can't totally blame the government on this one. College is in the business of selling more college every year. They want you taking more credit hours. If they get some governing body to require it for them to maintain their accredidation, I doubt they complain too much.

 

[Cygnus]

You're right. The better term is ignorant.

No one with a modicum of intellectual curiousity can remain so virulently ignorant, so maybe she is just plain incurious. Who cares about how the economy works, something, somewere isn't fair!

Elizabeth's Warren's Career: She Didn't Build That. (her high cheekbones did).

I just wish Fauxcahontas would say more things in public so her stupidity can further embarrass those of her party.

Exactly!

That is why I would love to see her run or even be on the ticket. She would be a joy to watch in a debate. She would stammer and sputter and Deval Patrick wouldn't be behind her to step and speak for her.

 

[JettaKnight]

Have you ever wondered why 20 years ago you needed at least 10 credit hours less for the same degree.

40 years ago you needed a lot less than that.

College is a racket. Too much meddling by various institutes. I can't totally blame the government on this one. College is in the business of selling more college every year. They want you taking more credit hours. If they get some governing body to require it for them to maintain their accredidation, I doubt they complain too much.

Maybe because there was less to learn then.

I bet electrical engineering was pretty quick 100 years ago, maybe three semesters or so...

 

[ATOMonkey]

lolz... Not really, but I get what you're saying.

There have been some additions to knowledge, but electical engineering for example still teaches principles discovered 1827. Things like diodes, capacitors, inductors, aren't exactly new either.

Most of the advanced math hasn't changed, nor have the laws of physics.

My uncle and I have the same degree from the same school seperated by about 30 years. I think I needed 160ish credit hours to graduate. When he was at school it was less than 100. Purdue requires 148 credit hours for the same degree.

Am I a better engineer than my uncle because I have 60 more credit hours hanging on my wall? I'm probably worse off, because he could focus more on his engineering and less of "short stories" or "music appreciation"