Short Barreled Shotgun with rifled barrel?

[trik396]

I know that Indiana does not allow SBS (and that does NOT make me happy).. because of all the NFA types, this is what I would most like to own...
My question is the definition of an SBS says "smoothbore" I believe so if one were to utilize a rifled barrel, would this be considered OK?
I'm a new guy here and I've searched but can't really find an answer. I have my lifetime LTCH but my prefered choice of home security is a shotgun AND something shorter is MUCH easier to handle in close quarters as we all know.
Thanks

 

[Indy_Guy_77]

There's also the qualifier about overall length...

If the bore description doesn't get ya; the length qualifier will.


-J-

 

[DaKruiser]

Do like my wife done, get you a Shotguns - Safety Harbor Firearms, Inc. or a Super Shorty !

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

Or you can get the Saiga AOW Shorty. A little more expensive, but....

If you really want to have fun check out this:
Cadiz Gun Works

 

[trik396]

Overall length has to be over 26", correct? That should be doable with a fixed stock and say, 10" barrel.

I like the idea of the AOW pistol shotguns (basically) but practicality says using one of those for a REAL defensive situation is NOT going to be easy.

 

[Mr. Habib]

If a shotgun has a rifled barrel can it be registered as an SBR?

 

[printcraft]

Overall length has to be over 26", correct? That should be doable with a fixed stock and say, 10" barrel.
......

No.


https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/class_iii_nfa/121442-sbs_legal_in_in.html#post1483225

Actually, I found some Indiana case law on this exact topic. The arguments are pretty similar to ours. It's a little long, and the case is from the Indiana Court of Appeals, 1983 (Brook v State, 448 N.E.2d 1249). Relevant section is below:

Brook contends his shotgun was not “sawed-off” because it did not have a barrel length of less than eighteen inches and an overall length of less than twenty-six inches as required by the statute. Brook's reading of the statute is erroneous.

[1] Brook relies on the use of the conjunction, “and,” within I.C. 35-23-9.1-1. Brook is correct in his assertion the conjunctive*1251 “and” and the disjunctive “or” are not interchangeable. Barr v. Sun Exploration Co. (1982) Ind.App., 436 N.E.2d 821. If the statute defined sawed-off shotgun as “a shotgun having one or more barrels less than eighteen inches in length and an overall length of less than twenty-six inches” we would agree with Brook's interpretation of the statute as containing dual requirements of barrel length and overall length.

[2] [3] However, the conjunction “and” is immediately followed by the phrase “any weapon made from a shotgun (whether by alteration, modification or otherwise)....” All statutory language is deemed to have been used intentionally and words or clauses in a statute are to be treated as surplusage only in the absence of any other possible course. Sidell v. Review Bd. (1982) Ind.App., 428 N.E.2d 281. Therefore, although the conjunctive “and” is used, it is evident from the plain language of I.C. 35-23-9.1-1 the statute is not, as Brook contends, setting forth a single definition of sawed-off shotgun which contains two requirements. Rather, I.C. 35-23-9.1-1 provides two definitions: 1) a shotgun having one or more barrels less than eighteen inches, and, 2) any weapon made from a shotgun if its overall length is less than twenty-six inches.

[4] [5] In reading the plain language of the statute we carry out our primary duty of giving effect to the intention of the legislature. Marion County Dep't. of Public Welfare v. Methodist Hosp., (1982) Ind.App., 436 N.E.2d 123, 126. Indispensable to the determination of legislative intent is a consideration of the reasons and policy which underlie the statute and the goals sought to be attained. Frost v. Review Bd., (1982) Ind.App., 432 N.E.2d 459. We believe a careful reading of the definitions of sawed-off shotgun provided in I.C. 35-23-9.1-1 reveals two legislative intentions. The overall rationale for the legislative ban of sawed-off shotguns centers on their concealability and therefore likely use for criminal purposes rather than for sport or hunting. The statutory scheme precludes “any weapon made from a shotgun... if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than twenty-six (26) inches” because such a shotgun is considered concealable and therefore, undesireable by the legislature, notwithstanding any possible use for hunting.

Secondly, we believe the legislature, while condemning sawed-off shotguns when used as weapons, recognized the legitimate use of shotguns for hunting and sporting purposes. Thus, “a shotgun having one (1) or more barrels less than eighteen (18) inches in length” is forbidden because with such a barrel length a shotgun has a decreased range and therefore minimal utility as a hunting and sporting tool. Its chief value is as a weapon, regardless of its overall length and concealability.

[6] Brook's shotgun, with its barrel length of less than eighteen inches, comes within one of the statutory definitions of sawed-off shotgun. The overall length of his shotgun is irrelevant.

 

[IndianaResident]

I believe a virgin receiver is your only real option.

Finding one is apparently pretty difficult, but if you can then you may add whatever barrel length and stock you like in your built (tax stamp abiding as DD or AOW).

Again, if I'm not mistake (jump in here if I am...VUPD?) you can then use factory innards, barrels, and anything, much like a parts kit for any other gun, and it won't be an SBS as the weapon was not "made
from a shotgun (whether by alteration, modification or otherwise)"

Yes?

 

[mms]

If a shotgun has a rifled barrel can it be registered as an SBR?

this is what im wondering now to

 

[TREETOP]

If a shotgun has a rifled barrel can it be registered as an SBR?

Not with a bore of greater than .50". So maaaaaybe with a .410 shotgun.

 

[tv1217]

Wouldn't that be a DD?

 

[subtlesixer03]

Ive been thinking judge plus stock. It is a pistol to start and adding a stock would make it a SBR would it not? Even better would be the new smith when it comes out. I believe thats a six rounder. Any thoughts gods of the nfa?

 

[VUPDblue]

I believe a virgin receiver is your only real option.

Finding one is apparently pretty difficult, but if you can then you may add whatever barrel length and stock you like in your built (tax stamp abiding as DD or AOW).

Again, if I'm not mistake (jump in here if I am...VUPD?) you can then use factory innards, barrels, and anything, much like a parts kit for any other gun, and it won't be an SBS as the weapon was not "made
from a shotgun (whether by alteration, modification or otherwise)"

Yes?

Shoulder fired and capable of firing a fixed shotgun shell makes it a shotgun by definition, virgin receiver or not, rifled barrel or not.
A rifled barrel would not make it an SBR because of the bore diameter being >.50.

To answer the OP's specific question, with a rifled barrel, it is still a shotgun...

 

[subtlesixer03]

Shoulder fired and capable of firing a fixed shotgun shell makes it a shotgun by definition, virgin receiver or not, rifled barrel or not.
A rifled barrel would not make it an SBR because of the bore diameter being >.50.

To answer the OP's specific question, with a rifled barrel, it is still a shotgun...

Well that sucks

 

[IndianaResident]

Shoulder fired and capable of firing a fixed shotgun shell makes it a shotgun by definition, virgin receiver or not, rifled barrel or not.
A rifled barrel would not make it an SBR because of the bore diameter being >.50.

To answer the OP's specific question, with a rifled barrel, it is still a shotgun...

So then virgin receiver shotgun pistols are in? i.e.:

 

[VUPDblue]

No. Bore diameter and lack of rifling preclude that from being a pistol.

 

[tradertator]

No. Bore diameter and lack of rifling preclude that from being a pistol.

Unless one was wanting to make an AOW via virgin receiver.

 

[IndianaResident]

Yeah I didn't actually mean designated pistol, just pistol form.

I should have written "So then virgin receiver shotgun pistol-looking AOW's are in?"

 

[orange]

I really hate that about Indiana law.

Would love to own something like this... it's one of the few places where Canadian gun laws are superior to the States.'

 

[CountryBoy19]

Shoulder fired and capable of firing a fixed shotgun shell makes it a shotgun by definition, virgin receiver or not, rifled barrel or not.
A rifled barrel would not make it an SBR because of the bore diameter being >.50.

To answer the OP's specific question, with a rifled barrel, it is still a shotgun...

You sure about that?

IC 35-47-1-11
"Shotgun"
Sec. 11. "Shotgun" means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed shotgun shell to fire through a smooth bore either a number of ball shot or a single projectile for each single pull of the trigger.

I think it has to be a fixed shell AND fire through a smooth bore to meet the definition of a shotgun (unless it was made or remade from a shotgun).

But then thats just the way I'm reading it. And we all know I've read IC wrong before.