Should people feel shame for the deeds of their ancestors?

[jamil]

Word.

That might have limited effectiveness though. I'm not sure if you could get a shame pass if you "tried" not to kill puppies.

 

[rhino]

That might have limited effectiveness though. I'm not sure if you could get a shame pass if you "tried" not to kill puppies.

Hush, you! We don't want them to find out!

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

That might have limited effectiveness though. I'm not sure if you could get a shame pass if you "tried" not to kill puppies.

...unless they were Pomeranians.

 

[jamil]

...unless they were Pomeranians.

I was going to ask what's up with the Pomeranian hate? Then I googled it. You kinda have a point.

 

[jamil]

Hush, you! We don't want them to find out!

Oh, heck. Look at the poll. There are only two of them. We've shamed the rest into compliance.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I was going to ask what's up with the Pomeranian hate? Then I googled it. You kinda have a point.

If you've ever had a friend or family member that's had one...Yippin', nippin', little ****-eaters.

 

[rhino]

There is more than one annoying breed of animal whose existence I question.

 

[IndyDave1776]

I have yet to see any type of concerted effort to obtain reparations gain widespread traction amongst the persons most likely to benefit from them. "Reparations," is a scare word used to reinvigorate the more "traditional" members of the right wing.

I felt ashamed when that Indian shed a tear when he saw all that litter.

Really. I did. And I quit littering.

Would you feel any less shamed if you knew that the "Indian" in question was actually an Italian actor?

 

[churchmouse]

If you've ever had a friend or family member that's had one...Yippin', nippin', little ****-eaters.

I hate those ankle bitters

 

[Trigger Time]

You aren't the only one posting in this thread, either. I am addressing points you made and points Indydave made as well, I tried to lump each under the appropriate quote.

I addressed him with the "tacit support". I addressed you with the "Muslims aren't doing anything like Christians do."

Muslims are treated with a fair different standard than other religions. Nobody uses quotes around "peaceful" when talking about Buddhists, yet obviously there are violent Buddhists killing and rioting based on religion. According to many on INGO the Pope doesn't reflect the beliefs of Catholics. The Pope. Apparently not Catholic enough. Yet one Nidal Hassan becomes millions of Muslims.

Some people forget when they talk about groups of people they actually are people. Real people. Let's bring it home a bit. If you want to talk about "Muslims" remember you're talking about me. You're talking about my wife. You're talking about my friends. Not some alien non-humans. I'd like to know what Indydave believes I support because I'm not going to change my religion. I'd like to know what he believes my wife supports. I'd like to know what exactly you think I should do and how much of my life I should dedicate to it to be as good at "doing something about it" as other religions are, and if my burden is the same as Buddhists, Christians, Jews, etc.

How angry would you be if you saw calls for you to be reeducated, that you should be barred from military service despite having honorably served, if I implied your wife supported terrorism if she didn't change her religion, etc? All things I've seen on INGO, if not in this thread. Does that fill you with joy?

How they're treated could have something to do with things we see from parts of the world where that is not only the religion but the ruling govt law. Also parts of England (London) where "Muslim patrols" are going on and the threatening of non believers is happening. You cannot deny it or try to make me see puppies when all there is that seems to follow it are beheadings and abuse of women and children Ect.
I'm not a religious person so here's how I see it ..... If we let it spread across our country then we are inviting terrorism and the destruction of our country. This IS a national security issue and not a religious one. Terrorist hide behind a name and call it peace. I call bs

 

[jamil]

Would you feel any less shamed if you knew that the "Indian" in question was actually an Italian actor?

No. It wasn't really the actor or the fake tears. That was just a way of stating it that everyone would get. It was the suggestion of looking at myself throwing trash out on on the roads so nonchalantly through the eyes of someone else. It was an effective ad back in the day.

 

[IndyDave1776]

No. It wasn't really the actor or the fake tears. That was just a way of stating it that everyone would get. It was the suggestion of looking at myself throwing trash out on on the roads so nonchalantly through the eyes of someone else. It was an effective ad back in the day.

The funny thing is that, your personal experience notwithstanding, that campaign was a total failure. The next one was a great success, the "Don't mess with Texas" campaign, which was about throwing litter on the ground, nothing we would typically think about when we hear that phrase. As one commentator put it, "Don't mess with Texas" had a far greater impact on young men who drive pickup trucks than did a crying actor.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

How they're treated could have something to do with things we see from parts of the world where that is not only the religion but the ruling govt law. Also parts of England (London) where "Muslim patrols" are going on and the threatening of non believers is happening. You cannot deny it or try to make me see puppies when all there is that seems to follow it are beheadings and abuse of women and children Ect.
I'm not a religious person so here's how I see it ..... If we let it spread across our country then we are inviting terrorism and the destruction of our country. This IS a national security issue and not a religious one. Terrorist hide behind a name and call it peace. I call bs

So being Muslim or allowing Muslims is a national security issue?

Are we going to ignore there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world? Almost 1/4 of the world population...yet all they bring is turmoil and strife? Odd. I didn't notice any beheadings or abject abuse in Qatar. Or Jordan. Or Bahrain. I wasn't in Oman long enough to form an opinion. What about Malaysia? When you've got 1.6 billion of anything, you can find examples to show whatever you want. If 0.005% are mass murderers, that's 80,000 people. Plenty for you to cherry pick and make them evil. Of course that means we can determine who all gun owners in the US are by cherry picking 16,000 people. I wonder if I could prove anything I wanted with that .0005%? How dangerous and reckless you are. What a threat to community safety. Why, one of you just walked into a church and killed a bunch of black people for being black. Don't deny it or tell me everything is puppies, you gunowners are simply too dangerous and a threat to the safety of our communities.

Would you like me to start a post of atrocities committed by non-religious governments? Perhaps non-religious people are a national security threat? That Hitler grew up Catholic? That Communists have slaughtered people for whatever religion they held simply because they held a religion? The French Revolution certainly held anti-religious attitudes prominently and killed accordingly. History shows that only death and subjugation follows a non-religious group taking power, right?

No, of course not. That's all equally ridiculous. Gunowners aren't represented by the mass murders and criminals unless you have an agenda of banning guns. Athiests and the like aren't any more dangerous than anyone else unless you are playing "you did it too" to support your own religion or have an agenda that mankind must have a religion to be moral. However if you're only exposed to that percentage, how do you view gunowners or athiests? You *think* it's all beheadings and honor killings because that's what you've been exposed to and you've never bothered to look past it. I lived there for a few years, and am going back this year to visit family and friends. Would I willingly take my wife and child into an area of beheadings and abuse of women and children? No, of course not. I'm not, though, I'm taking them to Jordan. You know, where the king himself flies combat missions against terrorists while our leaders play golf? How about all of our allies, both nationally and individually, who have aided in the war on terror? Who do you think does all the translation of documents secured in Iraq? I used to guard them, and the vast majority were Muslims from the Arabic countries that are financially and politically secure. Who provides intel? Who are the guides and liasons? Right. Your "issue of national security" plays both ways.

 

[miguel]

Regarding litter, we only throw unpackaged foods out the window, but only towards grassy areas and when no other cars are around. That way, the animals get a snack and my vehicle doesn't smell any worse than it already may.

 

[jamil]

The funny thing is that, your personal experience notwithstanding, that campaign was a total failure. The next one was a great success, the "Don't mess with Texas" campaign, which was about throwing litter on the ground, nothing we would typically think about when we hear that phrase. As one commentator put it, "Don't mess with Texas" had a far greater impact on young men who drive pickup trucks than did a crying actor.

As I said, the effective part wasn't the crying Indian, it was seeing what we were doing. The Texas campaign, or one GFGT linked would have been just as effective for me. Also, I was still in grade school back in 1970 when those campaigns started. I remember we used to just throw out the McDonnald's trash like the side of the highway was the designated public dumping ground. Everyone did.

 

[Trigger Time]

So being Muslim or allowing Muslims is a national security issue?

Are we going to ignore there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world? Almost 1/4 of the world population...yet all they bring is turmoil and strife? Odd. I didn't notice any beheadings or abject abuse in Qatar. Or Jordan. Or Bahrain. I wasn't in Oman long enough to form an opinion. What about Malaysia? When you've got 1.6 billion of anything, you can find examples to show whatever you want. If 0.005% are mass murderers, that's 80,000 people. Plenty for you to cherry pick and make them evil. Of course that means we can determine who all gun owners in the US are by cherry picking 16,000 people. I wonder if I could prove anything I wanted with that .0005%? How dangerous and reckless you are. What a threat to community safety. Why, one of you just walked into a church and killed a bunch of black people for being black. Don't deny it or tell me everything is puppies, you gunowners are simply too dangerous and a threat to the safety of our communities.

Would you like me to start a post of atrocities committed by non-religious governments? Perhaps non-religious people are a national security threat? That Hitler grew up Catholic? That Communists have slaughtered people for whatever religion they held simply because they held a religion? The French Revolution certainly held anti-religious attitudes prominently and killed accordingly. History shows that only death and subjugation follows a non-religious group taking power, right?

No, of course not. That's all equally ridiculous. Gunowners aren't represented by the mass murders and criminals unless you have an agenda of banning guns. Athiests and the like aren't any more dangerous than anyone else unless you are playing "you did it too" to support your own religion or have an agenda that mankind must have a religion to be moral. However if you're only exposed to that percentage, how do you view gunowners or athiests? You *think* it's all beheadings and honor killings because that's what you've been exposed to and you've never bothered to look past it. I lived there for a few years, and am going back this year to visit family and friends. Would I willingly take my wife and child into an area of beheadings and abuse of women and children? No, of course not. I'm not, though, I'm taking them to Jordan. You know, where the king himself flies combat missions against terrorists while our leaders play golf? How about all of our allies, both nationally and individually, who have aided in the war on terror? Who do you think does all the translation of documents secured in Iraq? I used to guard them, and the vast majority were Muslims from the Arabic countries that are financially and politically secure. Who provides intel? Who are the guides and liasons? Right. Your "issue of national security" plays both ways.

If it's so much better there then why live here?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

If it's so much better there then why live here?

Odd response. Some things are better there. Some things are better here. Or are you just wanting to avoid the original topics?

 

[BugI02]

If it's so much better there then why live here?

I know what you wish to say, but not really a valid argument in this case. Verging on Ad Hominem

 

[Trigger Time]

Odd response. Some things are better there. Some things are better here. Or are you just wanting to avoid the original topics?

I just think we fundamentally disagree so I was simply moving on.

 

[Trigger Time]

I know what you wish to say, but not really a valid argument in this case. Verging on Ad Hominem

No I said exactly what I meant to say. He has earned the right to live here. He is an American number one and a veteran number 2. I respect that. I just don't understand his reasoning but it's not my life. Just like I don't expect people to agree or understand my views on that issue. We will just move on. Nothing good will come of talking further on that