SIG going after Springfield over the Hellcat Magazine patent infringement

[Bigtanker]

This should be interesting.

 

[Ingomike]

Will the S&W new shield also be drug into this?

 

[Bigtanker]

Will the S&W new shield also be drug into this?

And Ruger for that matter.

 

[jsx1043]

Soooo, what makes them so special? What’s the difference between an old-school double stack metal magazine and the current micro nines? I have a G43X so it’s not a good comparison LOL

 

[Expat]

Well obviously they did something that no one else was doing. They found some way to cram more bullets into a smaller package than anyone else (too small for me).

 

[COOPADUP]

The P365 mag is very uniquely designed compared to traditional double stack mags. I am not familiar with the Hellcat design, but this must be where the issue lies.
It is a very small gun, and after carrying it for several months, you can almost forget you are actually carrying.

 

[Tactically Fat]

I had a thought the other day... That SIG should buy the rights (or the whole company) to the Shield Arms S15 mags used in the G43x and G48.

This is gonna get interesting for sure.

 

[Whip_McCord]

It's not obvious Sig did something different. Kel Tec came out with the P11 in 1995. It is smaller and lighter than the P365 and holds 10-round, flush fit mags. Also, S&W 59 mags fit the P11.

I always wondered if Sig made some type of deal with Kel Tec. The P11 was discontinued about the time that the P365 came out. Seems like a weird time for Kel Tec to drop a gun when that type of pistol becomes more popular than ever.

 

[grillak]

hey...what about my taurus g2c 9mm? it holds 12 and my p226 mags fit

 

[KokomoDave]

Shield Arms should sue Sig.

 

[Ingomike]

It's not obvious Sig did something different. Kel Tec came out with the P11 in 1995. It is smaller and lighter than the P365 and holds 10-round, flush fit mags. Also, S&W 59 mags fit the P11.

I always wondered if Sig made some type of deal with Kel Tec. The P11 was discontinued about the time that the P365 came out. Seems like a weird time for Kel Tec to drop a gun when that type of pistol becomes more popular than ever.

Does it have to be obvious to the end consumer that patentable technology is present that others may not infringe? In a word, NO...

 

[firecadet613]

This sheds some light on it...

SIG SAUER Files P365 Magazine Patent Infringement Suit Against Springfield Armory -

Another day another lawsuit in the firearms realm. Whats new? This time SIG is suing Springfield over the SIG P365 magazine design.

www.thetruthaboutguns.com

 

[Dean C.]

I find this interesting as truth be told the whole double to single stack idea hase been around for quite some time. The magazine on the left is a 2011 magazine while the right hand magazine is a P365 same basic idea right?

Plus one would assume Smith and Wesson , and Ruger would have made sure there were not any legal pitfalls before releasing their micro 9's so recently.

 

[Ingomike]

Plus one would assume Smith and Wesson , and Ruger would have made sure there were not any legal pitfalls before releasing their micro 9's so recently.

Maybe they all stole it from someone else.

Crazy thing happened in marine generators, this is culmination of my research in what really happened. One manufacturer "borrowed" technology from the auto industry, then patented that use in marine generators, then sued another manufacturer who also "borrowed" similar technology. The second manufacturer stopped production and now the marine generator market has only one manufacturer.

Not implying that happened in this case but patent issues are complex and often do not benefit the end users.

 

[Dean C.]

Maybe they all stole it from someone else.

Crazy thing happened in marine generators, this is culmination of my research in what really happened. One manufacturer "borrowed" technology from the auto industry, then patented that use in marine generators, then sued another manufacturer who also "borrowed" similar technology. The second manufacturer stopped production and now the marine generator market has only one manufacturer.

Not implying that happened in this case but patent issues are complex and often do not benefit the end users.

100% agree, this could give Sig a monopoly on a very very valuable section of the market. That monopoly would stagnate further development to the detriment of the consumer. I thought when the Hellcat came out this might be an issue, but I obviously totally spaced how long it takes to get patents approved.

 

[Ingomike]

100% agree, this could give Sig a monopoly on a very very valuable section of the market. That monopoly would stagnate further development to the detriment of the consumer. I thought when the Hellcat came out this might be an issue, but I obviously totally spaced how long it takes to get patents approved.

Maybe SIG was waiting for others to infringe to increase the payout. They likely would not even have to sue the others after SA is settled, just send the lawyers to get a settlement, they get the cash and no bad publicity. But that hurts our market...

 

[DadSmith]

The majority of these little guns stem from the Taurus 12rd pistol. G2c or whatever it was called before that. Taurus hit the market 1st with that style of pistol. It caught on and everyone jumped on board. Name another 12rd small pistol like Taurus brought out before Taurus.

 

[binkerton]

I find this interesting as truth be told the whole double to single stack idea hase been around for quite some time. The magazine on the left is a 2011 magazine while the right hand magazine is a P365 same basic idea right?

Plus one would assume Smith and Wesson , and Ruger would have made sure there were not any legal pitfalls before releasing their micro 9's so recently.

The shield mag design at the top hasnt changed since it was introduced in 2012 though. They only had to make this one slightly wider to get the increased capacity.

 

[seldon14]

100% agree, this could give Sig a monopoly on a very very valuable section of the market. That monopoly would stagnate further development to the detriment of the consumer. I thought when the Hellcat came out this might be an issue, but I obviously totally spaced how long it takes to get patents approved.

I don't think Sig will win, but if they do, my guess is they are just going to get a cut for each hellcat/hellcat mag sold.

 

[firecadet613]

Springfield Responds to SIG SAUER's Magazine Patent Lawsuit -

TFB recently reported that SIG has filed a lawsuit against Springfield over patent conflicts between the P365 and Hellcat mags. Springfield has fired back.

www.thefirearmblog.com