Springfield Armory Echelon 9mm

[drillsgt]

What? It is not 1957 in the manufacturing world anymore?

Unfortunately we probably couldn't afford stuff made like 1957!

 

[mcapo]

Unfortunately we probably couldn't afford stuff made like 1957!

At least SA doesn't hide it. Frame is, of course, stamped Made in Croatia and they also put it in the crest roll mark.

 

[Skip]

This is a great friend of mine. Grant is a Marine, sniper, cop, sniper, trainer (I’ve taken several classes from him) and a great Christian man BUT, in this video short, he sounds like a naysayer from the 1980’s and the initial Glock era.

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His evaluation of the pistol is here:

And, yes, I called him on his negativity….. lol. What are friends for?
Hahaha

 

[Skip]

P. S. I am going to wait for other grip modules to become available. I’m a long slide, short grip, kind of guy. P80 CL style….

 

[cedartop]

This is a great friend of mine. Grant is a Marine, sniper, cop, sniper, trainer (I’ve taken several classes from him) and a great Christian man BUT, in this video short, he sounds like a naysayer from the 1980’s and the initial Glock era.

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

youtube.com

His evaluation of the pistol is here:

And, yes, I called him on his negativity….. lol. What are friends for?
Hahaha

So I am going to assume you were joking about negativity as he was starting to sound like he works for Springfield until he got to the very end. Overall I would call it a nice well balanced review. My big negative is that I don't need to switch guns and all of the accoutrements that go with it.

 

[Skip]

So I am going to assume you were joking about negativity as he was starting to sound like he works for Springfield until he got to the very end. Overall I would call it a nice well balanced review. My big negative is that I don't need to switch guns and all of the accoutrements that go with it.

The review was fine. The short, where he tells you not to buy one is where he got negative. Two videos…

 

[cedartop]

The review was fine. The short, where he tells you not to buy one is where he got negative. Two videos…

Gotcha. I like the short better. Ha-ha. I don't trust too much palathering on about a new product. His point about the night vision doesn't mean anything to me, but I can see where it might be an issue for a few.

 

[sheepdog697]

I got to fondle one of these at 219 armory in Valpo. Ergonomics are awesome. Reallllly thinking about picking one up.

 

[sheepdog697]

View attachment 287539

"Nah man, we changed the slide serrations a little and called it gen 6."


(yes i know glock does actually make changes on their generations...)

 

[Dingleberry]

Not to put too fine a point on it, but there are NO "boring" iterations of the 1911.
True, some are more beautiful, or useful than others, but they are all "interesting", for one reason or another.


Moving on......As most people use the expression "beating a dead horse",
my analytical side must inquire as to your "Ringo-ism" (malaprop) r.e. "beating the..horse to death".
I'm intrigued as to whether this form is a colloquialism from your area, or upbringing, or merely a typo.

Or perhaps you're just barely repressing a deep seated irrational hatred of all things 1911. Hmmmmm.....tell me more about your mother.

Whatever you say dude, it's a dead old design just like Glock.

 

[2tonic]

Whatever you say dude, it's a dead old design just like Glock.

I'm sorry....exactly what date and time did the 1911 become a no longer viable or effective self defense device? All mine still work fine, and punch nice big holes at point of aim.
I understand the yearning for the latest, greatest crunchentikker, or design improvements, after all, the 1911 platform has had many modifications to the original design that are now considered standard.

But I think it unwise to dismiss the pistol that probably has a higher body count than any competing design is likely to ever achieve.

YMMV.

 

[Route 45]

But I think it unwise to dismiss the pistol that probably has a higher body count than any competing design is likely to ever achieve.

I seriously doubt that. Pistols are just not significant weapons of war, mostly a last-ditch backup. Most nations that have been major players in war have also issued something other than the 1911 as their military sidearm. 1911s have never been in widespread use in police departments, so limited "body count" there. Don't see a lot of thugs armed with 1911s, either.

The most produced pistols in the world in the last century are the Glock, the Makarov and the S&W Model 10 revolver. All three are, or have been, in widespread use in militaries, police agencies and in civilian hands. I'm betting they smoke the 1911 in "body count," if that's your metric of a relevant pistol.

Maybe we can find some stats on which platform has more body count, so we all can be sure to carry the most historically killingest pistol in the universe. Wouldn't be surprised if it's a .22 LR, though. Choose wisely.

 

[ECS686]

I seriously doubt that. Pistols are just not significant weapons of war, mostly a last-ditch backup. Most nations that have been major players in war have also issued something other than the 1911 as their military sidearm. 1911s have never been in widespread use in police departments, so limited "body count" there. Don't see a lot of thugs armed with 1911s, either.

The most produced pistols in the world in the last century are the Glock, the Makarov and the S&W Model 10 revolver. All three are, or have been, in widespread use in militaries, police agencies and in civilian hands. I'm betting they smoke the 1911 in "body count," if that's your metric of a relevant pistol.

Maybe we can find some stats on which platform has more body count, so we all can be sure to carry the most historically killingest pistol in the universe. Wouldn't be surprised if it's a .22 LR, though. Choose wisely.

I will add. I get a laugh when folks use that while “Two World Wars” statement. Well so was the P 08 Luger, so was the 3006 the 8mm Mauser (winning or not doesn’t matter they all had a lot of bodies)

But as far as body count you really can’t say a 1911 or 45 it’s simple numbers. Is the 45 effective Yes it’s a great round and I carry a 45 now that I can choose my own. I also carried by choice and was mandated 9mm for years.

But what a lot of people
Leave out or forget as far as major conflicts. All the African wars throughout the 1960’s and 70’s. Lots of Browning High Power and other 9mm’s with ball ammo with a lot of folks getting dirt naps so just numbers wise 9mm has won that caliber war it’s everywhere and no more or less effective than any other “service” issued caliber provided it’s judged on the same shot placement etc.

 

[Dingleberry]

I'm sorry....exactly what date and time did the 1911 become a no longer viable or effective self defense device? All mine still work fine, and punch nice big holes at point of aim.
I understand the yearning for the latest, greatest crunchentikker, or design improvements, after all, the 1911 platform has had many modifications to the original design that are now considered standard.

But I think it unwise to dismiss the pistol that probably has a higher body count than any competing design is likely to ever achieve.

YMMV.

Actually a spear has probably taken more lives but that doesn't make it the best choice either. There are better options.

 

[Skip]

but there are NO "boring" iterations of the 1911

Cough…..cough…..cough…..I think I just threw up in my mouth..
1911AARP…..45AARP….you fanboys need to let that old girl die already….

 

[2tonic]

Fanboy huh?
Yeah, you're right..... I mean, most accurate large bore pistol platform, best trigger, slimmest profile, most concealable, most ergonomic grip angle, intuitive controls, points naturally, highly effective chamberings.....what was I thinking......nothing to see here, folks.

As far as departmental acceptance, please don't forget the time period where a lot of large city detectives carried 1911's (you remember them, the guys who used to be involved in most police shootings, before every hoodrat shoved a Glock or a Highpoint down their pants), and SWAT teams, when they came along.....oh, and 40 years with the Shanghai police back when they were stackin' bodies.
Texas Rangers, when life was "exciting" for them, Border Patrol, too.
Delta, SEALS, and othec Spec-op units used 'em, and keep flirting with using them on a limited basis, depending on political winds.
There were others, but you are quite correct in stating the Glock, and similar, as being more ubiquitous regarding departmental issue. Of course, you also must consider the legal atmosphere at the time (lawsuits) and the perceived need to provide a "one size fits all" tool to all concerned, even the most basic recruits.

Something that works as well for it's intended purpose as the 1911 does, will never be "dead". Firearm design marches on, and many designs have come close, or even surpassed the 1911 in one category or another. I'm sure one day something will come along that bests it in every way, but it's still subjective by its very nature.
We are all free to choose what works best for us, individually, according to our personal order of needs.

I'm at a loss to understand why a humorous post (my best attempt at it) expressing my personal view of pistol design would generate such vitriol as to dub me a "fanboy" (a pejorative, I assume). Notwithstanding the fact that I've been carrying one since before some of you were born, I never said your favorites were any lesser, just that the 1911 was/is still viable.

I'll just wrap up by saying designs, and manufacturing methods, change and evolve, but they still build ships with the pointy end in front, and the fat end at the rear.

 

[Skip]

Fanboy huh?
Yeah, you're right..... I mean, most accurate large bore pistol platform, best trigger, slimmest profile, most concealable, most ergonomic grip angle, intuitive controls, points naturally, highly effective chamberings.....what was I thinking......nothing to see here, folks.

Vitriol? Not hardly.
All the you mentioned about old slab sides can be said about a lot of other pistols too. Most of them are 100% subjective, oh, and you cleverly left out “low round count” and “heavier than a baby whale”….like a fanboy…. Lol

 

[2tonic]

Vitriol? Not hardly.
All the you mentioned about old slab sides can be said about a lot of other pistols too. Most of them are 100% subjective, oh, and you cleverly left out “low round count” and “heavier than a baby whale”….like a fanboy…. Lol

Well, like most of us, I tend to think of myself as pretty clever.......so there's that.
As far as round count....some of us don't need as many as some others do. YMMV.

Weight? Don't even notice it anymore, but I would bet one of my Bobtailed aluminum framed Commanders with 8+1 in it, plus two 8rnd mags, is not far off the total for a double stack plasticfantastic with a spare mag.

If it makes you feel better I carry a Shield Plus as well. Sometimes just the Plus with 13+1 and a spare 13 rnd mag, so I am evolving.
It's just that "Old Slabsides" can be made so much more elegant.

And no self-repecting man carries plastic to a barbecue.

 

[Skip]

Well, like most of us, I tend to think of myself as pretty clever.......so there's that.
As far as round count....some of us don't need as many as some others do. YMMV.

Weight? Don't even notice it anymore, but I would bet one of my Bobtailed aluminum framed Commanders with 8+1 in it, plus two 8rnd mags, is not far off the total for a double stack plasticfantastic with a spare mag.

If it makes you feel better I carry a Shield Plus as well. Sometimes just the Plus with 13+1 and a spare 13 rnd mag, so I am evolving.
It's just that "Old Slabsides" can be made so much more elegant.

And no self-repecting man carries plastic to a barbecue.

Well, you are quippy anyway. I’ll give you that. The 1911AARP has no legitimate clones. All modern pistols, other than the Beretta lines, follow the higher refined JMB design of the BHP. More rounds, better looking and much, much, better CCW round. Subjective…
I carried the 1911AARP back when I was in the Corps. 1973-1976. Wonderful boat anchors….kinda ruined me on them.

 

[drillsgt]

Well, you are quippy anyway. I’ll give you that. The 1911AARP has no legitimate clones. All modern pistols, other than the Beretta lines, follow the higher refined JMB design of the BHP. More rounds, better looking and much, much, better CCW round. Subjective…
I carried the 1911AARP back when I was in the Corps. 1973-1976. Wonderful boat anchors….kinda ruined me on them.

Are you contemplating the purchase of an Echelon?