The Open Carry Argument

[1stLast&Always]

Regardless of 2A and whether people OC or CC, there must be some reason they feel they might need to use it, or they wouldn't carry it, right?

I am very interested in any available statistics on OCers who were injured as a result of assailant recognizing they had a firearm. Anyone know where this can be found? A rebuttal posted in "mah rights" referenced the OC thread, so I brought my question about it here. Leonidas proposes some criminals may target you as an OCer.

Perhaps thinking that all criminals are dumb isn't the best strategy. Some may look first for threats to eliminate. Some might ambush you, no matter your training, situational awareness or reflexes. It is a possibility. So is them seeing your OC and saying, "Ok, not this time."

CCers, if you're suddenly faced with a decision to draw and fire- isn't open carry faster at that point? OCers who believe in deterrence, where's the other statistic- "How many criminals avoided a crime because they saw someone with a firearm?"

OCers or CCs- When criminals show up in your vicinity, at what point do you say, "The best way to handle this is by using my firearm"?

 

[protias]

Regardless of 2A and whether people OC or CC, there must be some reason they feel they might need to use it, or they wouldn't carry it, right?

I am very interested in any available statistics on OCers who were injured as a result of assailant recognizing they had a firearm. Anyone know where this can be found? A rebuttal posted in "mah rights" referenced the OC thread, so I brought my question about it here. Leonidas proposes some criminals may target you as an OCer.

Perhaps thinking that all criminals are dumb isn't the best strategy. Some may look first for threats to eliminate. Some might ambush you, no matter your training, situational awareness or reflexes. It is a possibility. So is them seeing your OC and saying, "Ok, not this time."

CCers, if you're suddenly faced with a decision to draw and fire- isn't open carry faster at that point? OCers who believe in deterrence, where's the other statistic- "How many criminals avoided a crime because they saw someone with a firearm?"

OCers or CCs- When criminals show up in your vicinity, at what point do you say, "The best way to handle this is by using my firearm"?

You are asking the questions, why not find your favorite search engine and ask the questions?

How many OCers have been attacked? Last I can remember, the number is ~5. How many people OC? Thousands, every single day. Pretty good odds that if you OC, you aren't going to be attacked? And of course, why would you be? You are a hard target? How many gun stores do you see being robbed during the day? How many gun ranges are attacked? If I'm OCing, how many criminals are going to take the chance to attack me vs attacking a soft target or someone who looks like a soft target?

If someone is being attacked, I might help them, I might not. I'm responsible for my own protection, not someone else's.

 

[actaeon277]

CCers have also been targeted for carrying.
CC is not Invisible

 

[wtburnette]

There are a lot of things you have to decide on when you carry. What gun fits me best? What is the right amount of ammo to carry? Should I carry a backup gun, or be satisfied with the one weapon? How much training is enough? Then you have to decide where you want to carry and how you want to carry. It's hard to find statistics for deterrence. If a criminal is selecting prey, they do so using certain criteria. John Lott, Jr performed interviews on criminals in jail and determined that a large majority would go with what they considered an easy target. Most, when seeing an armed target, would pass them by in favor of an easier target. There have been other studies that have born out similar information. If you think about it, it's common sense. Now, that doesn't mean that all criminals will pass you by if you OC. People with mental issues or junkies that are strung out and looking to score don't think logically and are unpredictable. I've also heard of gangs here in Indy who will target someone open carrying and use multiple assailants in order to take a weapon. On top of all of this, open carrying can bar you from entry for certain businesses, or put you in a situation where you are asked to leave. To me, you have to make decisions based on where you plan to go and what you plan to do. In the warmer months, I'll OC when I'm keeping to locations I know and have been to in the past without any issues. If I'm going somewhere that doesn't allow people to be armed, I'll conceal with a large shirt or jacket. In the cooler months I OC under a coat. At all times I try to be aware of my surroundings and don't have my face buried in my phone like most people. I don't think there is a right or wrong way to carry in general, as long as you use proper gear and all of that, it's just a personal choice each of us have to make, among many.

 

[brucecrain]

bacon sex tag? and as long as you carry i cant argue with how YOU can YOUR gun.

 

[protias]

bacon sex tag? and as long as you carry i cant argue with how YOU can YOUR gun.

I'm just curious if you read the first post or not and if you were drinking when you posted that?

This is what your sentence sounds like:

 

[R65]

I do not open carry because I understand it makes some people uncomfortable and I respect their concerns. In return, respect my right to CC.

 

[2A_Tom]

Did you even bother scanning the OP?

 

[LockStocksAndBarrel]

How does one respect your right that they don't know you're exercising?

 

[mntman0902]

I am so glad this thread came up. I carry a glock model 40 10mm. some might say over kill. but I open carry it. the person that stated I don't dress to open carry, I would agree with. I have tried to conceal it, while at home, trying to see how it would be. it isn't an optian for me. I don't mind open carring at all. but I also don't taunt or flaunt that I am open carring either. the last thing I want to do is pull my firearm when I'm out in the public. it would have to be a life threatning act or to help stop a life threating act on another person. but pulling your firearm and actually shooting your firearm, well thats a completely different animal now. I'm former military and have had to fire my firearm at someone before. thus the reason I wouldn't want to do the same in public. I carry to protect myself, and if put in a situation, to help another helpless person. but any carry option I think is good. I do agree, just carry if you feel comfortable doing so.

 

[LockStocksAndBarrel]

I am so glad this thread came up. I carry a glock model 40 10mm. some might say over kill. but I open carry it. the person that stated I don't dress to open carry, I would agree with. I have tried to conceal it, while at home, trying to see how it would be. it isn't an optian for me. I don't mind open carring at all. but I also don't taunt or flaunt that I am open carring either. the last thing I want to do is pull my firearm when I'm out in the public. it would have to be a life threatning act or to help stop a life threating act on another person. but pulling your firearm and actually shooting your firearm, well thats a completely different animal now. I'm former military and have had to fire my firearm at someone before. thus the reason I wouldn't want to do the same in public. I carry to protect myself, and if put in a situation, to help another helpless person. but any carry option I think is good. I do agree, just carry if you feel comfortable doing so.

Well said and welcome to INGO!

 

[Anima mundi]

I do not open carry because I understand it makes some people uncomfortable and I respect their concerns. In return, respect my right to CC.

thank you for sharing this expansive and cogent examination of the topic and your own habits. your posting really has injected a fresh and unique insight to the discussion.

 

[chipbennett]

I do not open carry because I understand it makes some people uncomfortable and I respect their concerns. In return, respect my right to CC.

I have a Sikh friend. It makes some people uncomfortable to see him wearing his turban. Should he refrain from wearing it, out of "respect" for their "concern"?

Should a homosexual (or an interracial) couple refrain from holding hands in public, because it makes some people uncomfortable - out of "respect" for their "concern"?

 

[chipbennett]

I am so glad this thread came up. I carry a glock model 40 10mm. some might say over kill. but I open carry it. the person that stated I don't dress to open carry, I would agree with. I have tried to conceal it, while at home, trying to see how it would be. it isn't an optian for me. I don't mind open carring at all. but I also don't taunt or flaunt that I am open carring either. the last thing I want to do is pull my firearm when I'm out in the public. it would have to be a life threatning act or to help stop a life threating act on another person. but pulling your firearm and actually shooting your firearm, well thats a completely different animal now. I'm former military and have had to fire my firearm at someone before. thus the reason I wouldn't want to do the same in public. I carry to protect myself, and if put in a situation, to help another helpless person. but any carry option I think is good. I do agree, just carry if you feel comfortable doing so.

Well said, and welcome to INGO and to the discussion.

I just want to point out that the calculus regarding the need/justification to draw one's firearm from its holstered position is the same whether one carries openly or concealed. (And I think most/all of us here agree with you on desiring never to need to draw our firearm.)

 

[Dead Duck]

I have a Sikh friend. It makes some people uncomfortable to see him wearing his turban. Should he refrain from wearing it, out of "respect" for their "concern"?

Should a homosexual (or an interracial) couple refrain from holding hands in public, because it makes some people uncomfortable - out of "respect" for their "concern"?

Sorry, I hope your friend feels better soon. Prayers sent.

 

[engi-ninja]

I've been thinking about this for some time; I think that if more people open carried, it would have a positive effect in the long run. I think the poor folks with irrational fears of inanimate objects would eventually get used to it, and they may start to see that people who carry guns aren't inherently dangerous. Also, if someone intends to commit a crime, and sees 10 people with guns on their hips, they will probably decide it's not worth it.

 

[rhino]

I've been thinking about this for some time; I think that if more people open carried, it would have a positive effect in the long run. I think the poor folks with irrational fears of inanimate objects would eventually get used to it, and they may start to see that people who carry guns aren't inherently dangerous. Also, if someone intends to commit a crime, and sees 10 people with guns on their hips, they will probably decide it's not worth it.

That was exactly one of the reasons in my mind when I started carrying openly.

 

[2A_Tom]

I've been thinking about this for some time; I think that if more people open carried, it would have a positive effect in the long run. I think the poor folks with irrational fears of inanimate objects would eventually get used to it, and they may start to see that people who carry guns aren't inherently dangerous. Also, if someone intends to commit a crime, and sees 10 people with guns on their hips, they will probably decide it's not worth it.

I expected to see another noob saying OC is stupid, but was pleasantly surprised. You are exactally correct sir, Repped.

That was exactly one of the reasons in my mind when I started carrying openly.

This^^^, not to mention it is more comfortable and less worrisome (I hope no one makes me).

 

[engi-ninja]

I expected to see another noob saying OC is stupid, but was pleasantly surprised. You are exactally correct sir, Repped.


This^^^, not to mention it is more comfortable and less worrisome (I hope no one makes me).

Haha, just because I'm a noob on this site doesn't mean I'm a noob to carrying ;-) And yes, ease and comfort of carrying is a major plus for open carry. The one downside, at least for now because there are so few open carry folks, is that you become a first strike target for the bad guys. If I'm the only one carrying, I'd rather the bad guys not know it till it's too late for them. But I guess someone has to start open carrying in order for it to catch on eventually.

 

[JettaKnight]

I'm a lot more comfortable in my OWB & OC configuration at my desk today - that's an argument in itself.


Plus, when someone newish here in the office says, "Are you carrying a gun?!"
"Why, yes... yes, I always have and always do."
Then they start thinking... guns dangerous... but... I've never noticed any danger before from him... and he had a gun....



Either their head explodes, or they smile and say, "well now I feel safer."