Three or four die sets?

[jedi]

OK so then I'm doing it "OK" with using the lee FCD in terms of crimping. Must be that I'm not seating the bullet deep enough then in seating operation and thus the FCD is doing that for me as well to get me under the OAL.

 

[XtremeVel]

OK so then I'm doing it "OK" with using the lee FCD in terms of crimping. Must be that I'm not seating the bullet deep enough then in seating operation and thus the FCD is doing that for me as well to get me under the OAL.

You seem a bit uncertain on if your seating the bullet to correct depth. Having a gage is great, but you also need calipers.

Unless your dies are different than mine, your FCD will NOT fix your error in OAL. Next time pull the cartridge out after the 3rd die and caliper it. You will need your OAL right after this step prior to running it through the FCD.

Your FCD has a secondary carbide sizing insert. It can possibly resize your cartridge and as someone has already stated, also size down your bullet. It also crimps also, but will not " fix " a OAL error.

 

[miguel]

Before using the FCD, I had some 9mm rounds that were slightly larger in diameter than the rest. These would cause feeding issues in some chambers.

Were those rounds cast-lead ("home brew" if you will...) or major manufacturer rounds like Speer, Hornady, etc?

I personally like to to seat and crimp as seperate operations.

I have read a number of other forums' threads and heard the same thing. I feel like I've discoverd a variation of the 1911 vs. Glock debate, only reloading specific.

Would it be unreasonable to summarize this issue as, "Depending on how 'accurately' your bullet is seated and crimped by die #3 (in most sets) and if your OAL and gauging of reloaded rounds are GTG, die #4 (FDC) is not necesary unless your barrel won't consistently chamber them?"

And BTW, thanks for all the great input. After my initial reloading experience, I find myself being consumed by metrology and reloading theology!

 

[kludge]

You are right I do still have a "bell" after step 6. I guess my LEE die only seats then no crimp right? I have the LEE 4 set die. So I eitehr need to use the FCD to remove the "bell" in step 7 or use some other die that will crimp in step 7 to remove the bell right?

-Jedi

The Lee bullet seating pistol dies CAN seat and crimp in the same operation.

You just have to set it up based on whether or not you are crimping in a separate step.

www.leeprecision.com has some very useful how to videos, but here's how I set up my .40S&W bullet seating die (where I don't use the separate FCD).

I make a dummy round (no primer or powder) so when ever I use that bullet again it's easy to set up my dies.

Using an already flared case...

1. Put the brass - no bullet - in the shellholder and raise the ram (lower the handle) all the way.
2. Take the seating die and back off the lock nut a few turns. Back the bullet seater stem out as far as possible without falling out.
3. Screw the seating die into the press (ram still up) until you just feel the die touch the case mouth.
4. Back the die out 1/2 turn.
5. Tighten the locknut.
6. Now lower the ram and place a bullet in the case mouth. Raise the ram.
7. Screw in the bullet seating stem until it touches the bullet.
8. Lower the ram.
9. Screw in the bullet seater stem a few turns.
10. Raise the ram and seat the bullet.
11. Take the dummy round out of the press and measure with calipers.
12. Put the dummy round back in the press, turn the seating stem in a small amount (like 1/8 to 1/4 turn).
13. Repeat steps 10-12 until you get the desired COL for your cartridge, then proceed to the next step.
14. Measure the case mouth with your calipers and compare it to the data book. .40 S&W should be 0.423" at the case mouth.
15. Back the bullet seating stem out as far as possible.
16. Loosen the locknut and screw the die in 1/8 to 1/4 turn.
17. Tighten the locknut.
18. Place the dummy round in the press and raise the ram fully.
19. Lower the ram. Take the dummy round and measure the case mouth.
20. Repeat steps 16-19 until the case mouth diameter is in spec, then proceed to the next step.
21. With the COL and case mouth diameter correct, place the dummy round in a case gauge or REMOVE your barrel from your pistol and insert the case into the chamber of your gun. If everything looks good proceed. If not figure out what need to change and work on it.
22. Place the dummy round in the press and raise the ram.
23. Hold the lever down and screw in the bullet seater stem until it makes firm contact with the bullet.
24. Take the dummy round out, make a note card of everything about it (bullet weight, brand, COL, and put the bullet and its notes in a ziplock baggie and store until next time you use that bullet.
25. Now you can load your first round.
26. Take a resized, primed, flared, and charged case and set it in the press.
27. Set a bullet on the case.
28. Raise the ram fully and seat the bullet.
29. Measure COL, Measure case mouth diameter, check it in your case gauge or in your pistol barrel.
30. If everything is correct, start loading.

To set up the dies again...

1. Take out your dummy round and put it in the press.
2. Raise the ram fully.
3. Back out the seating stem as far as possible.
3. While holding the lever down firmly, screw the die body in until it makes firm contact with the case mouth.
4. Tighten the locknut. (see note)
5. Screw in the seating stem until it makes firm contact with the bullet.
6. Seat a bullet on a resized, primed, flared, and charged case.
7. Take the new round out, and with your calipers measure the COL and case mouth diameter and check it against the notes you made on the card you stored with the dummy round.
8. If everything matches your GTG, start loading. If not, adjust.

Note: You shouldn't have to touch the locknut even when changing bullets.

 

[kludge]

P.S. The Lee Factory Crimp Die may shave lead off the outer edge of lead bullets, YMMV.

No problem with revolver rounds though, IME.

 

[jedi]

You seem a bit uncertain on if your seating the bullet to correct depth. Having a gage is great, but you also need calipers.

Unless your dies are different than mine, your FCD will NOT fix your error in OAL. Next time pull the cartridge out after the 3rd die and caliper it. You will need your OAL right after this step prior to running it through the FCD.

Your FCD has a secondary carbide sizing insert. It can possibly resize your cartridge and as someone has already stated, also size down your bullet. It also crimps also, but will not " fix " a OAL error.

I dont have all my notes on me right now. However last night I did take a measurement right after step 3 (bullet seating no powder or primer) and the OAL was 1.269. After steap 4 (FCD) it was still 1.269.

Now after step 3 the round was still a bit "fat" at the mouth and thus when I would drop in into the case guage it would hang. I would use my finger and push it into the gauage and it would fit.

After step 4 re-dropping in to gauge it went in fine.
Step 4 is taking the belling out right? My bullet looks a little fatter after step 4 however.

-Jedi

 

[Broom_jm]

I dont have all my notes on me right now. However last night I did take a measurement right after step 3 (bullet seating no powder or primer) and the OAL was 1.269. After steap 4 (FCD) it was still 1.269.

Now after step 3 the round was still a bit "fat" at the mouth and thus when I would drop in into the case guage it would hang. I would use my finger and push it into the gauage and it would fit.

After step 4 re-dropping in to gauge it went in fine.
Step 4 is taking the belling out right? My bullet looks a little fatter after step 4 however.

-Jedi

Your process is perfectly sound and the gauge is proving that out. Your OAL is not being reduced by the FCD, and shouldn't be. Your seating die is adjusted to seat, only...not crimp. That's fine. You are using the FCD to crimp and using the case gauge to confirm everything is being loaded properly.

In other words, yer GTG!

P.S. Don't tell your bullet it looks fat, as long as it fits in the chamber it was designed for...the last thing you want is a self-conscious bullet!

 

[jedi]

Thank you! So it's just a get into a rthymn and work in batches of 50 or 100.
I have noticed that when hand priming my cases the FEDERAL cases are the easiest in terms of no resistance from the hand tool. WINCHESTER and some non-name brand from Europe seem to have a tighter fit for the primer. It goes in and it's OK just takes a bit more force than the FEDERAL one.