Very Old Muzzle Loader - Trying to Determine Model and Value

[weezy]

This is a very old muzzle-loaded 12 Gauge Shot Gun. When you hold it, it is very clear that it is an old gun. The owner of the gun has had this gun in his family since the early 1950s. They got the gun at an auction when an old collector passed away. They were told the gun was brought over from Ireland.

I will try to add some more pictures tomorrow, but this is the only one I have right now. When I took the pictures I don't believe there was any serial number.

There is an engraving that says, "London Lane Twist," and a swirl-type design.

 

[indiucky]

More than likely Belgium made for the UK market.....(The locks look English style though)...The use of the term "London Lane Twist" to describe the wire twist barrels makes me think it was made on the Continent (probably Belgium).....In side by side shotguns the word "London" sells and many makers of these weapons utilized terms like these to sell their weapons...It doesn't mean it's a bad gun....It's just not a "London Best" i.e. a Purdey, Holland and Holland etc.....

Knock the wedge out and pull the barrels up and out of the stock...I would imagine you will find Belgium proof marks there...Good Luck and God Bless....

 

[Dosproduction]

I don't know what it is but I really like old muzzle loaders.

 

[jinks]

There is an engraving that says, "London Lane Twist," and a swirl-type design.

The shotgun probably has a Damascus barrel. This is manufactured using hammer welded twisted rods. This type of barrel was discontinued with the introduction of smokeless powder. This type of barrel is more susceptible to internal rusting and it can rust without surface rust showing.

 

[indy1919a4]

More than likely Belgium made for the UK market.....(The locks look English style though)...The use of the term "London Lane Twist" to describe the wire twist barrels makes me think it was made on the Continent (probably Belgium).....In side by side shotguns the word "London" sells and many makers of these weapons utilized terms like these to sell their weapons...It doesn't mean it's a bad gun....It's just not a "London Best" i.e. a Purdey, Holland and Holland etc.....

Knock the wedge out and pull the barrels up and out of the stock...I would imagine you will find Belgium proof marks there...Good Luck and God Bless....

Wow you talk about 2 areas of firearms that lack good, if any documentation.. Percussion cap Shotguns double barrel and Belgium firearms of the 1800s.. I shutter to think if the west could have been settled with out all the cheap import guns from Belgium...

 

[Kirk Freeman]

I had this exact problem with my great-great-greatgrandfather's shotgun. Had to take it to an expert to have him tell me what I had.

 

[indy1919a4]

This is one hell of a website for early shotgun information...

https://sites.google.com/a/damascusknowledge.com/www/home

 

[1775usmarine]

 

[chipbennett]

 

[indiucky]

I shutter to think if the west could have been settled with out all the cheap import guns from Belgium...

People will ask me, "What gun do you think won the west, Winchester, Colt, or Sharps?" I always answer, "Sod buster shotguns from Europe, mostly Belgium"...I sent Kirk some stats one time on the Oregon Trail.....As many people were shot in hunting accidents and pulling muzzle loading shotguns barrel first from the back of a wagon as were killed by Indians, river crossings and rattlesnakes combined....

Kirk shared with me some entries from an ancestors journal....

Day 1- Saw some sod buster do something stupid with his gun and we buried him this morning...
Day 2-Buried two emigrants that thought pulling their gun from the back of the wagon barrel first made them 'Mericans..
Day 4-Buried three today that went hunting and were shot when they came back at dusk because someone thought they were Indians..
Day 15- No one died today from a gun accident so we celebrated by firing our guns straight up in the air...
Day 16-Found two emigrant corpses this morning that were killed in their blankets from the celebratory gun fire last night...

Gun safety....It's not just for pioneers anymore....

 

[indy1919a4]

Indiucky.. one thing that is so overlooked in the guns of the West is the lack of firearms marksmanship. Some of the famous gun battles of the west were near all spray and Pray affairs..

Gunfight at OK Corral -- 6 feet apart and everyone empties there guns for 30 seconds

Battle little big Horn -- The army expends over 42,000 rounds in a 2 day running battle and may have inflicted 36 - 160 casualties

Battle of the Rosebud 6 hour battle, the army expends 25,000 rounds and only inflicts 70 - 140 casualties on the enemy.

​

Thank God for Wild Bill Hickok, even with failing eyesight he at least practiced each day and shot the people he aimed at, even if one was his deputy. I guess even the best can have friendly fire incidents.

 

[indiucky]

I guess even the best can have friendly fire incidents.

Indeed they can...Let's take doggydaddy shooting.

To the OP your shotgun is worth retail about $200-$300 if it is in working condition...If just a wall hanger $100-$150.....

 

[MrSmitty]

OP I would defer to Indiucky on anything antique firearms related......He's sickening with the knowledge he has........Just kidding Rick!

 

[indy1919a4]

More than likely Belgium made for the UK market.....

Not that one has to look hard to find Cheap Belgium copies of firearms... This one just popped up and caught my eye.. And heck at least this one is marked Belgium, Many were never marked Belgium...

ANTIQUE BELGIAN SMITH & WESSON TYPE REVOLVER-44/40 : Antique Guns at GunBroker.com

Now for fun When Custer rode into the Little Big Horn he has a pair of Double action British revolvers (So the rumors say). He was only given one from Berkeley Paget. Where could he have picked up another?? Custer stopped off in New York city on the way to destiny, and you have to wonder if he picked up another there. And because the RIC revolver was one of those pistols that Belgium Loved to bootleg.. Could Custer have rode into the battle with a Belgium bootleg pistol??

 

[mkress77]

When is it going up on the classified forum?

 

[nra4ever]

My neighbor had one just like yours. How long have you had that gun? In fact it looks identical to the one my neighbor had. He took it to a show in Kentukey and sold it for $6500. I wouldn't take any less than $6500 and that was 2 years ago. $8000 is probably a safe asking price.

 

[churchmouse]

My neighbor had one just like yours. How long have you had that gun? In fact it looks identical to the one my neighbor had. He took it to a show in Kentukey and sold it for $6500. I wouldn't take any less than $6500 and that was 2 years ago. $8000 is probably a safe asking price.

Please do not get OP excited again......

 

[indiucky]

My neighbor had one just like yours. How long have you had that gun? In fact it looks identical to the one my neighbor had. He took it to a show in Kentukey and sold it for $6500. I wouldn't take any less than $6500 and that was 2 years ago. $8000 is probably a safe asking price.

Please stop by the shop...I have an original Kentucky Long Rifle in original flint lock on consignment I have been unable to move for $1000 in three years......Finally a man who appreciates these old guns!!!!!!

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Indeed they can...Let's take doggydaddy shooting.

To the OP your shotgun is worth retail about $200-$300 if it is in working condition...If just a wall hanger $100-$150.....

Hey now!! Glad I happened into this little gem! Harumph!

 

[indiucky]

Hey now!! Glad I happened into this little gem! Harumph!

Thank You...I was afraid that you didn't notice...