When your J Frame isn't enough

[BehindBlueI's]

Going on stats, odds, probability and "being realistic," why waist the effort to carry at all. With a bit of situational awareness the chances of needing a firearm are darn near nil, correct?

Especially if you aren't slinging dope or hanging out with gang bangers, then yes, your odds are pretty darned low of being the victim of violent crime.

Whatever pistol you carry I can come up with a scenario where its insufficient. What if you were in the bank during the famous LA Bank Robbery and they started shooting customers in the bank? No pistol in the world is going to matter against two heavily armored bad guys armed with long guns, right? Realistically if you are to have a chance you would need not only your own armor and long gun, but probably a buddy with the same.

My point is simply you can't prepare for any imaginable situation, or every situation that's ever occurred anywhere in the world. Different people are going to decide to dedicate different amounts of time, money, and comfort level based on their own calculus of risk vs reward, and for the vast majority of us a 5 shot revolver will do everything we'll ever be called on to do with a pistol.

 

[Fargo]

snubbies are only good for one thing - muggings. can ANYone really pattern 5 shots in center mass at more than 10 yards? i really dont think i can, but admittedly ive not tried.

while i agree with the premise of the article, in the real world we have to think of a lot more things. am i on a date, where a full frame gun would be unseemly, or in some other situation where a full-size or even compact would be bulky, noticeable, etc.

hell, if you wanted to cover all bases, including armed robbers at 100yards holding up a store with body armor, why not just pack an M14?

Actually, once you get one broken in and put the time in to get used to the long pull, it is surprisingly easy to shoot a snubbie accurately. I'm no high-speed type, but I can ring steel plates at 50 yards pretty regularly with my 442. Then again i've shot it alot and dry fired it much much more.

In slow fire, if you wait for the click of the cylinder locking up, you know you are maybe an ounce from the trigger breaking and it is actually pretty easy to shoot quite accurately. In rapid fire, you just have to have the muscle memory down on that looooooong pull.

Best,

Joe

 

[Bosshoss]

Especially if you aren't slinging dope or hanging out with gang bangers, then yes, your odds are pretty darned low of being the victim of violent crime.

Whatever pistol you carry I can come up with a scenario where its insufficient. What if you were in the bank during the famous LA Bank Robbery and they started shooting customers in the bank? No pistol in the world is going to matter against two heavily armored bad guys armed with long guns, right? Realistically if you are to have a chance you would need not only your own armor and long gun, but probably a buddy with the same.

My point is simply you can't prepare for any imaginable situation, or every situation that's ever occurred anywhere in the world. Different people are going to decide to dedicate different amounts of time, money, and comfort level based on their own calculus of risk vs reward, and for the vast majority of us a 5 shot revolver will do everything we'll ever be called on to do with a pistol.

Well said Thank You.
Carry what you are good with and be good with what you carry.

 

[bwframe]

...My point is simply you can't prepare for any imaginable situation, or every situation that's ever occurred anywhere in the world. Different people are going to decide to dedicate different amounts of time, money, and comfort level based on their own calculus of risk vs reward, and for the vast majority of us a 5 shot revolver will do everything we'll ever be called on to do with a pistol.

If your plan is for no one to ever be shooting at you, then your five rounds is optimal. I agree.
I try to plan on living through being shot at. Train for the worst and be happy with whatever less.

 

[danmdevries]

The bone I have to pick with the article is the glock. I've tried to get on board. I've owned a 22, 36, 27, 26, 19, 17, and 23. They've all been sold or traded. Some were repeat purchases: 36, 22, 27, and 23 I've owned more than once.

Thing is, I really like revolvers. A lot. And after really thinking it through, its the grip. I realized that except for a few double stacks, the only autos I own are single file. This led to my third Glock 36 and the conclusion that unless I train with a Glock the grip angle is wrong.

I own several wheel guns. Some fit in belt holsters, some iwb, some pocket. But, they're with me more often than not.

I'd say the evolution of the pocket .380 is a bigger deal than a j frame. The p3at and lcp more or less have rendered the .38 revolver irrelevant. The baby glocks paved the way no doubt. But as far as more modern innovation the pocket .380 and the 9's that followed are in the running to take out the j frame.

But they'll lose. The snubnose is going nowhere. Well, save for our collective pockets, its a classic with unfailing reliability, universally standard controls and great accuracy (if you do your part).

It does boil down to convenience like the article said. But other than the newest pocket .380's and 9's, nothing beats the ease and convenience of a snubby. They fit the pocket better than the baby Glock. I'll admit the round count is a major limiting factor. If I choose wrong and bring 5rds to a 10rd gunfight, who's to say 10rds would've changed the outcome? Or maybe my 5rds deployed faster than a 10rd rig from a pocket and took care of the problem.

I disagree, j frames are still viable, still relevant and except for (slightly finicky and marginally more prone to failure) recent pocket autos, without equal.

 

[.452browning]

I carry a G17 as my EDC. A Smith & Wesson M37 chiefs special .38 is my back up. I never leave home without both.

 

[indiucky]

I really don't like that argument and I hear it all the time.

I am sorry...I thought it was an opinion and I thought I made that clear in my one paragraph clarification (paragraph 3 of my small opinion piece).

I had lost sleep over whether you would like that opinion and now my darkest fears have come to fruitation...Someone on the internet "gasps" disagrees with me...My word Jeeves whatever shall I do now....

 

[indiucky]

First, lets clear up a misunderstanding, the author of the article, Suarez Staff Instructor Jon Payne, is a friend of mine, and is not bald. The owner of our company, Gabe Suarez, is clean shaven. Not sure how this is relevant

Me neither...I have tried to understand the connection between Glocks as the end all weapon and shaved heads for quite sometime...I have yet to understand the connection but they seem to go together like biscuits and gravy...We will leave it for future anthropologists to unravel this great mystery...It is nice to know that someome else is trying to find the relevancy between the two...There has to be a connection...Maybe the simplicity??? I.E. A shaved head and a Glock are two things that require little care or maintenance...It is also good that he talks about his resume' and the number of gunfights he was involved in...Most guys I know are very sheepish about the lives they have took and the gunfights they were in...I know one is still wrestling with it after 30 years....I guess if everyone was like that then there would be no "must have" training classes to prepare one for what nothing can truly prepare you for (emotionally that is)...My salute to Mr. Suarez and his openess to share what is really a very personal and life changing experience with the world so that others may have some of that knowledge...

 

[BehindBlueI's]

If your plan is for no one to ever be shooting at you, then your five rounds is optimal. I agree.
I try to plan on living through being shot at. Train for the worst and be happy with whatever less.

Seems like a lot of assumptions there about me and my plans. If you didn't mean to be condescending, I apologize, but it sure seems that way.

I've been on the two way range. I've had death threats and a bounty on my head. I don't go to my mailbox without a firearm, but I'm also not kitting up with an AR and body armor to mow my lawn.

Do your own risk calculus, but just because someone doesn't come up with the same answer you do don't mistake them for prey.

 

[Hookeye]

6 rounds only, makes for an odd feeling when there are 3 bad guys (but thankfully I didn't even burn one).
Experienced it many moons ago.
I feel more comfy with 8 (and downright soothed by 16).

 

[jballs]

I've carried a S&W 642 J frame for years and always felt adequate with it. My first tool is situational awareness. My second is my running skills.

 

[led4thehed2]

I agree, a J-frame revolver has limitations. It also has lots of benefits that I feel equally balance its limitations. IE- I can pocket carry a J-frame, can't pocket carry a GLOCK.

In my humble experience as a probation officer, plenty of bad guys DO carry .22s, .25s, .32s, and .380s. My experience is not a scientific measure of every firearm-carrying criminal is this country, but to say the bad guys will always have large caliber, high-capacity handguns (GLOCK 23) is just not true.

My experience also indicates that encountering a single criminal is just as likely, even more likely, than encountering multiple offenders. It depends on the crime, but most robberies, for instance, that I encounter include a single offender. I have had cases where several people in small groups rob people, but these cases are not the norm.

In the end, I believe we all carry a firearm as a protection against "what if." I suppose it is up to each of us to decide how for we're willing to go to protect against "what if" and what we think we need to get through the day.

 

[g00n24]

I am sorry...I thought it was an opinion and I thought I made that clear in my one paragraph clarification (paragraph 3 of my small opinion piece).

I had lost sleep over whether you would like that opinion and now my darkest fears have come to fruitation...Someone on the internet "gasps" disagrees with me...My word Jeeves whatever shall I do now....

hahahaha...I would hope you would be awaken by my post about disagreeing with your opinion. Clearly you should change your lifestyle because someone on the interwebz doesn't think as you do.

My main point is if you carry to be able to protect yourself against almost every life-or-death scenario you could encounter a j-frame (or comparable firearm would be adequate) but if you would want to be better prepared for more violent encounters then more firepower would be warranted.

Now that I have retorted to your retort you should know internet rulez make me the victor, and anything you say from now on is meaningless.

 

[wally05]

I love little revolvers... nothing like em. But, I do plan on picking up a G27 as a backup since we carry G23s. If I wasn't doing police work, I'd probably pick up a revolver as my second. Whatever. Buy with it, train with it, and make sure you make it home.

 

[Jeremiah]

I actually carry my g35, and today is the first time I've carried a spare mag with it, feels good,

My pockets are big enough to carry a g19, it is fairly obvious something is in there, but I can do it. I am looking at a j frame or a khar for a back up though. I miss my m37, and am contemplating one of the 6 shot 3" guns in .327

 

[jve153]

i have a "modern pocket pistol" in .380. its the s/w bodyguard. i carry it in my front pocket every day. it gets full of lint and dirt, and when i take it to the range, i do not clean it first, i fire off the carry ammo that is in it, then switch to fmj until i am done. never had an issue. after firing, i do clean it and put it back in the pocket holster and back in the pocket. it is nowhere near as accurate (for me) as my compact m&p 9mm, but it is convenient to toss it in the pocket with 2-3 spare mags in that little pocket above your right side main pocket. some days it is the only gun i have on me, others, it is the back up for the m&p. depends on the mood and where i am going, really.
carry what you want, what you are comfortable with and what you train with. i dont care if it is a .22lr. just carry it and be sure you can hit what you are aiming at.

 

[mike63502]

I only need enough rounds to scare them away or get away myself. I don't plan on Ana extended gun battle

 

[littletommy]

I only need enough rounds to scare them away or get away myself. I don't plan on Ana extended gun battle

I hope that works out well for you. Really, I do.

 

[cedartop]

I only need enough rounds to scare them away or get away myself. I don't plan on Ana extended gun battle

Please tell me that was said in Jest.

 

[snapping turtle]

I love a good handgun be it a full size double stack, single stack auto or revolver. A handgun is just for easy of carry and to get you to a primary weapon.

For me the model 66 2 inch 6 shot 357 is my carry piece. Heavy enough to shoot well and pistol whip. light enought to pocket carry (Jacket pocket). Accurate with adjustable target sights (No kentucky windage here) Several holsters allow hip.IWB (I don't like IWB) ankle carry (Loose pants at cuff only) and shoulder holster. I seem to like the shoulder holster best as I can get in and out of the car/truck and not remove the gun. Plus it has the speed loader holders on the other side.

Need more rounds a speed loader. If going into a bad situation a second pistol and access to a shotgun/rifle with multiple other good guys.. I don't go into bad situations, I am not a cop/LEO. I am not providing covering fire, I am not going to be slinging it out with the Zeta's on the border.