Who is John Galt? Bakery forced to bake same-sex wedding cake stops baking cakes

[Smokepole]

When I said, "Want one with two men on the top tier? Buy two cakes and move it yourself.", I meant move the topper.

My way they are only out the cost of one cake and topper. Not two.

 

[HeadlessRoland]

Do we or do we not have freedom of association in this country? If so, then there can be no coercion or forcing someone to sell to anyone of whom they disapprove. If not, then let us stop pretending we live in a free nation.

 

[Smokepole]

Do we or do we not have freedom of association in this country? If so, then there can be no coercion or forcing someone to sell to anyone of whom they disapprove. If not, then let us stop pretending we live in a free nation.

So then given the preponderance of evidence, we do not. Live in a FREE country. As if we didn't already know the answer to that. We are just Free'er (for now and by less than 20 or 30 years ago) than most other places.

 

[Smokepole]

I have had a question that hasn't yet been posed. What if the owners of the bakery were Muslim and refused to make the cake? Would the gay guys have sued them? What would the verdict have been? And what would have been the aftermath had they been sued and the same verdict been rendered? Given that most all of the political correctness that is foisted upon Christians is wholly absent where followers of Islam are concerned, I must wonder about this. And I would love to see how this would turn out. The potential for mind bending hypocrisy appears to be great.

 

[sb0]

I have had a question that hasn't yet been posed. What if the owners of the bakery were Muslim and refused to make the cake? Would the gay guys have sued them? What would the verdict have been? And what would have been the aftermath had they been sued and the same verdict been rendered? Given that most all of the political correctness that is foisted upon Christians is wholly absent where followers of Islam are concerned, I must wonder about this. And I would love to see how this would turn out. The potential for mind bending hypocrisy appears to be great.

Legally? Not sure why you'd expect any difference there. The law doesn't make any exceptions for Muslims.

 

[Vigilant]

Legally? Not sure why you'd expect any difference there. The law doesn't make any exceptions for Muslims.

no, but political correctness usually does!

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Okay, this is something I've thought about in our ongoing battle against zoning in Montgomery County.

I don't think it's okay. And yes, I think business owners should be allowed to choose if they allow/disallow smoking, shooting, talking, stinking, whatever in their own business.

My take is this: if the guy next to does something on his property that offends you, you have choices:

1. Get over it
2. Ask him to stop
3. Move
4. Buy his property (if he will sell)

None of those violate his rights or yours.

It's never going to happen again that way in good ol' America, but that's the way I think it should work

5. Sue him for the damages in small claims court.

I'm not actually recommending this one, but if there really is harm as Kirk claims, then this is the manner it should be addressed.

6) Cut it for him/her. Sometimes people get busy or just need help. I did this for my next door neighbor a few years ago. His mower broke down and he had a hard time saving up the money to get it fixed. By the time he did, it had gotten away from him so he asked if he could pay me to come bush-hog it for him. I did but didn't charge him a dime. Sometimes neighbors do that sort of thing for one another.

 

[steveh_131]

6) Cut it for him/her. Sometimes people get busy or just need help. I did this for my next door neighbor a few years ago. His mower broke down and he had a hard time saving up the money to get it fixed. By the time he did, it had gotten away from him so he asked if he could pay me to come bush-hog it for him. I did but didn't charge him a dime. Sometimes neighbors do that sort of thing for one another.

This right here ^

The government is the wrong solution for nearly every problem. Individual and community actions should be our focus.

 

[JetGirl]

My way they are only out the cost of one cake and topper. Not two.

I'm aware of that and still stand by the "be an ass, pay for two" option.

 

[sb0]

A government big enough to dictate the condition of your lawn is big enough to dictate how you run your business.

He just said he doesn't think that would be okay...

 

[rhino]

A government big enough to dictate the condition of your lawn is big enough to dictate how you run your business.

Yep, and it's wrong in both cases.

If I had my druthers, things would be a lot different.

5. Sue him for the damages in small claims court.

I'm not actually recommending this one, but if there really is harm as Kirk claims, then this is the manner it should be addressed.

Well, yeah, if there is actual harm or damage done to my property or the rights associated with it. But then what he's doing (or allowing to be done) has crossed the boundary of actually affecting me. His shadow boxing punches have started hitting my nose.

I have had a question that hasn't yet been posed. What if the owners of the bakery were Muslim and refused to make the cake? Would the gay guys have sued them? What would the verdict have been? And what would have been the aftermath had they been sued and the same verdict been rendered? Given that most all of the political correctness that is foisted upon Christians is wholly absent where followers of Islam are concerned, I must wonder about this. And I would love to see how this would turn out. The potential for mind bending hypocrisy appears to be great.

Legally? Not sure why you'd expect any difference there. The law doesn't make any exceptions for Muslims.

The law on paper does not and in some jurisdictions, I'd be willing to believe they are impartial. In reality in many areas, though, the political agenda will trump fair application of the law.

 

[88GT]

6) Cut it for him/her. Sometimes people get busy or just need help. I did this for my next door neighbor a few years ago. His mower broke down and he had a hard time saving up the money to get it fixed. By the time he did, it had gotten away from him so he asked if he could pay me to come bush-hog it for him. I did but didn't charge him a dime. Sometimes neighbors do that sort of thing for one another.

1-5 are for neighbor who says, "I can, I don't intend to."

Your solution is for a neighbor who says, "I intend to, but I can't."

 

[sb0]

The law on paper does not and in some jurisdictions, I'd be willing to believe they are impartial. In reality in many areas, though, the political agenda will trump fair application of the law.

Yeah, fine, but in this scenario we're talking about an open and shut case based on the law.

 

[Bollorollo]

If someone doesn't want my business I will go else were and tell other not to shop there. Me personally I could care less who the people are or if they were gay because I would be in business to make money not judge peoples life style although I would kick Bloomturd or Monsanto Watts out if they came in lol...

 

[hornadylnl]

How many here have posted that businesses shouldn't be able to tell gun owners they can't carry in their business? How many here support the guns in parking lots law? Why is it okay to force our will on businesses regarding those issues?

 

[Snapdragon]

How many here have posted that businesses shouldn't be able to tell gun owners they can't carry in their business? How many here support the guns in parking lots law? Why is it okay to force our will on businesses regarding those issues?

Crap. Rep nazi's won't let me. I'd ask someone else to get him for me, but we might be eating ice cream with the devil first.

 

[sb0]

How many here have posted that businesses shouldn't be able to tell gun owners they can't carry in their business? How many here support the guns in parking lots law? Why is it okay to force our will on businesses regarding those issues?

I don't think it's okay.

Forcing businesses to allow carry by law is not a popular idea. I've never seen that suggested here (well, maybe I have, but not that I remember), and despite my 300 posts, I've been on here quite a bit. I read 100 posts for every one I make.

The parking lot laws are slightly more popular, but have plenty of opposition on principle.

But your typical right winger is not extreme libertarian enough to be in opposition to anti discrimination laws. You're talking to the wrong crowd here.

And you seem more focused on identifying non-existent hypocrisy than making an actual argument.

That being said, if we're going to throw out the idea of property rights, you really can't blame the people who decide to use it to their advantage, even if they do oppose the underlying principles of all of this.

They're playing the game by the rules that have already been made.

 

[hornadylnl]

I don't think it's okay.

Forcing businesses to allow carry by law is not a popular idea. I've never seen that suggested here (well, maybe I have, but not that I remember), and despite my 300 posts, I've been on here quite a bit. I read 100 posts for every one I make.

The parking lot laws are slightly more popular, but have plenty of opposition on principle.

But your typical right winger is not extreme libertarian enough to be in opposition to anti discrimination laws. You're talking to the wrong crowd here.

And you seem more focused on identifying non-existent hypocrisy than making an actual argument.

That being said, if we're going to throw out the idea of property rights, you really can't blame the people who decide to use it to their advantage, even if they do oppose the underlying principles of all of this.

They're playing the game by the rules that have already been made.

And why all the anger at the couple who wanted the cake? They played the same game as the parking lot crowd.

The points I've made here have all been discussed on this forum.

 

[sb0]

And why all the anger at the couple who wanted the cake? They played the same game as the parking lot crowd.

I'm not "angry" at the couple who wanted the cake. This is hardly about them, I would think that would be obvious.

I don't see any anger here directed at this couple in particular, and I suspect that's just another theme you've pulled out of a couple of cherry picked posts and are now attempting to portray as some type of common sentiment, just like you're trying to do with these other ideas you've referenced.

The points I've made here have all been discussed on this forum.

I'm sure your points have all been discussed on this forum (which, by the way, doesn't exactly make them a majority opinion or anything close to it). I'm sure all types of ridiculous nonsense has been discussed on this forum. Can I use all of that against you?

Throwing out hypotheticals intended to make us look like hypocrites might work on some, but it won't work on others, nor will it invalidate the arguments being made.

I'll lay this out clearly - tall grass laws, guns in parking lot laws, bake cakes for gay couple laws, abolish it all.

 

[hornadylnl]

I'm not "angry" at the couple who wanted the cake. This is hardly about them, I would think that would be obvious.

I don't see any anger here directed at this couple in particular, and I suspect that's just another theme you've pulled out of a couple of cherry picked posts and are now attempting to portray as some type of common sentiment, just like you're trying to do with these other ideas you've referenced.



I'm sure your points have all been discussed on this forum (which, by the way, doesn't exactly make them a majority opinion or anything close to it). I'm sure all types of ridiculous nonsense has been discussed on this forum. Can I use all of that against you?

Throwing out hypotheticals intended to make us look like hypocrites might work on some, but it won't work on others, nor will it invalidate the arguments being made.

I'll lay this out clearly - tall grass laws, guns in parking lot laws, bake cakes for gay couple laws, abolish it all.

I want to abolish it all as well. Truth is too many love the government gun when they get to be the one pointing it.

Code enforcement, the parking lot law and banning business owners from banning guns on their property supporters are hardly a tiny fraction here. I'm not digging through all the threads to find them and you can choose to not believe me.