Why the attitude that I owe the "R" party my vote??

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  • teddy12b

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    I'm going on a little rant and I don't want to take away/highjack another thread. My big complaint here is why do so called conservatives think I owe the Republican party my vote if my candidate doesn't win the nomination? I'm done with the idea of voting for the lesser of two evils, and if I think the rest of the "R" candidates are a bunch of two faced, back stabbing, needless war mongering, bailout loving D-bags then why the hell would I ever vote for them in good conscience? I have to live with the decisions I make at the voting booth like any other decision I make in life.

    I take it as an absolute insult to think that if I weren't to vote for Ron Paul that I owe my vote to the Republican Party. That's such a croc of BS and shows just how little people understand the difference between the two. I'm not trying to pick on anyone specifically, just the idea that if I don't automatically support the "R" nominated candidate that I'm the one screwing over the country.

    Lets look at the Republican party over the 8 "W" years and see what happened. Two wars, one of which shouldn't have been started and neither one should have lasted half as long as it has. Look at the spending and deficits, look at the birth of the TEA party back when TARP (bailout) was pushed through. Have all those government departments gotten bigger or smaller in their time? Honestly and without bias look at what they got done when they were in charge and ask yourself if you're proud of it. I'm not, and I'm ashamed that I've blindly pushed the "R" straight card button too many times.


    Please don't take that as an endorsement for Obama either. If anything we've gotten the same results, just in a lot quicker timeframe. Obama jacked up this country just as much as "W" did, but in half the time taking things from bad to worse. Look at how the "D's" behaved when they had control of all 3 branches. There's nothing to be proud of there either and I won't support Obama.

    But, just the idea of voting for either of those parties establishments "favorite son" just makes my stomach cringe. We haven't even met the real Romney yet. He plays to the crowd with whatever is popular that day and once he's in office, he gets to write his own ticket so who really knows what he's going to do. Romney is nothing more than a puppet. Supporting bailouts when someone with an "R" by their name does it but not when someone with a "D" by their name does it is just more DC BS. Newt's got enough skeletons in his closet that he could be disqualified immediately just from an ethical & moral standpoint. I think Newt has an incredible base of knowledge, but I don't think he has the moral character to deliver anything other than the same old BS we've seen in DC. For example when he's chastising the president for an affair while having one himself. Is that the guy you want as your leader? I don't.


    I keep hearing that a third party vote just puts Obama back in office. While the presidency today is more powerful than it was ever intended to be there's nothing to say that a conservative sweep in the other 2/3's of government wouldn't keep him constrained. If he chose to legislate by executive order, they could chose to evict him from the oval office. If the country hasn't woken up enough to have conservatives soundly own the other 2/3's of government next election aren't we pretty well hosed at that point anyway? Seriously if people don't realize the problems with spending and corruption by now there's really not much point in continuing the charade at this point is there?

    I will vote for Ron Paul regardless of any political parties endorsement or lack there of because because he has a consistent record of following the constitution and laws of the land. He's not a war monger, and he's actually proposed real cuts to the budget AND size of government.

    Take an honest look at the options out and tell me why on earth you consider voting for the other "R" candidates. I'm disgusted with them and if the country doesn't have good sense to elect a man like Ron Paul then as far as I'm concerned we deserve what's coming.


    I just get so tired of the idea that anyone owes their vote to any party just because and that if you don't vote for the establishment that you're somehow responsible for the decline of the nation.

     

    sepe

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    I don't understand why anyone ever gets into that line of thinking. Are they voting for what they were told they should when they first started? Do they think either main party of the "two" party system care about them? Do they think they're gaining something by voting for a party over principles? Anytime politics come up, you see the R and the D crowds foaming at the mouth about who they support but there are hardly ever any solid reasons why. Generic talking points from talking heads that could easily be substituted for the next talking head. Most people I've ever heard talk about politics know nothing about the people they vote for and they don't care to know...just as long as the vote R or D. Those that keep voting for the parties screwing the country up are the ones responsible for the decline of the nation. It is your guys doing it, you elected them.
     

    KG1

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    Vote or don't vote. Who cares. I don't let any of that stuff get to me. People have different reasons or separate issues that they are more concerned about than others for voting for certain candidates.

    I see no difference in what you are ranting about with people telling you that you owe a certain party your vote than you trying to tell someone else they should'nt vote vote for any old "R" just because they are no different than the other party. It goes both ways too. No one owes their vote to Ron Paul or a third party candidate either. Vote or don't vote for anybody you desire. No one cares.
     

    spec4

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    OP, you make some good points. While I would like to See Ron Paul get in, I don't think he could beat the Obama gang. The Dems would skillfully portray him as an out of touch old fool who would lead the country into disaster. Remember, the American electorate IMO doesn't have a lot of sense, or at least about half of them don't.

    So what do we do if its Mitt or Newt? Stay home? Obama would like that. He is in the fight of his incompetent life and needs all the help he can get. Many will flame me, but ultimately I am in the anybody but Obama camp. We have to stop the bleeding.
     

    ALB

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    OP, you make some good points. While I would like to See Ron Paul get in, I don't think he could beat the Obama gang. The Dems would skillfully portray him as an out of touch old fool who would lead the country into disaster. Remember, the American electorate IMO doesn't have a lot of sense, or at least about half of them don't.

    So what do we do if its Mitt or Newt? Stay home? Obama would like that. He is in the fight of his incompetent life and needs all the help he can get. Many will flame me, but ultimately I am in the anybody but Obama camp. We have to stop the bleeding.

    I'm the same way. I'll hold my nose and vote for Gingrich or Romney because a second Obama term will ruin the country.
     

    Blackhawk2001

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    OP, unfortunately, nowadays, we have a choice among voting for a party that has enshrined and celebrated statism - the Democrats - or voting for a party which defends the principles of a republic in word, but often doesn't live up to its promises - the Republicans - or several different splinter parties which generally don't influence enough of the Electorate to garner one Representative in Congress, much less any significant national representation in Congress.

    How you wish to vote in that calculus is up to you. Personally, I tend to vote against the Democrats if I'm not enthusiastic about the chosen Republican candidate. You and I have both seen what the Democrats do when they're totally in power; the Republicans are subject to our influence, however small it may be - the Democrats are against everything we believe in. If you can raise Americans' awareness to get Ron Paul nominated, congratulations to you, but it isn't looking likely. So which is the more "noble" course? Stay home and don't vote? Vote against the Democrats? Vote for a 3rd party which won't garner enough votes to represent you in any manner? It's your responsibility as a good citizen to vote, but how you vote is up to you.
     

    Baditude

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    Based upon the current state of things, I wish there was a 3rd lever: Vote against all incumbents - Time to throw out the cronies regardless of party since the majority are part of the problem
     

    ATM

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    The "anybody but Obama" camp already lost to the "any Democrat" camp.

    Why is it a winning strategy now? Losers gonna lose ...again.
     

    sepe

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    Vote or don't vote. Who cares. I don't let any of that stuff get to me. People have different reasons or separate issues that they are more concerned about than others for voting for certain candidates.

    I see no difference in what you are ranting about with people telling you that you owe a certain party your vote than you trying to tell someone else they should'nt vote vote for any old "R" just because they are no different than the other party. It goes both ways too. No one owes their vote to Ron Paul or a third party candidate either. Vote or don't vote for anybody you desire. No one cares.

    Vote for principles or don't vote. I'd much rather people vote based on principles and the actual issues than voting for who looks the best in a suit or who can read from a teleprompter the best. About the no one cares, that is why the country is in the state that it is...nobody cares. Keep voting for people that say they're going to do everything right by you and when they get in office, they do nothing but take, take, take...election comes up again, vote for them again because at least we know what we have.

    Blackhawk, you have got to be kidding me if you think Republicans are any better than Democrats. Both parties are professional liars and cheats. Neither has your best interest in mind. The most noble in your scenario would be to vote for the man with principles. If he doesn't win, you actually tried to do something that MIGHT bring change. If you vote for candidates you don't trust or agree with, you have no right to complain when they screw the country up. YOU said you wanted them in office when you voted for them. YOU picked the person adding to the screwed state of the country. If you can't vote for someone with principles, don't vote.
     

    KG1

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    Vote for principles or don't vote. I'd much rather people vote based on principles and the actual issues than voting for who looks the best in a suit or who can read from a teleprompter the best. About the no one cares, that is why the country is in the state that it is...nobody cares. Keep voting for people that say they're going to do everything right by you and when they get in office, they do nothing but take, take, take...election comes up again, vote for them again because at least we know what we have.

    Blackhawk, you have got to be kidding me if you think Republicans are any better than Democrats. Both parties are professional liars and cheats. Neither has your best interest in mind. The most noble in your scenario would be to vote for the man with principles. If he doesn't win, you actually tried to do something that MIGHT bring change. If you vote for candidates you don't trust or agree with, you have no right to complain when they screw the country up. YOU said you wanted them in office when you voted for them. YOU picked the person adding to the screwed state of the country. If you can't vote for someone with principles, don't vote.
    Seems to me you won't be voting alot if you are only looking to vote for a perfect candidate.
     

    John Galt

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    I'm the same way. I'll hold my nose and vote for Gingrich or Romney because a second Obama term will ruin the country.

    Given the amount of corruption, fraud, deceit and spending from both parties right now, it's not a matter of if, but when America is going to collapse. If we can't get a true Conservative in office and start leading the country, the end result is going to be the same, so what is there to lose? If a Conservative doesn't win, the good part about Obama winning is the country will crash that much sooner and we can get a quicker start on returning to the Constitution. I'm tired of compromising my principles, only to be continually lied to and used by the "Party". :patriot:
     
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    I'm the same way. I'll hold my nose and vote for Gingrich or Romney because a second Obama term will ruin the country.

    The second election of Bush already did that. The current pilot of the ship just continue the trek into the iceberg. What makes anyone think either side will be any different. They may have differing.views on social issues both dems and republicans are bought and paid for and neither really cares about us as long as their pockets get lined.

    Imo Paul is the only one who even semi gets it. Its time America worries about itself and worry less about everyone else. We are going broke because of it. End wars, cut finding to everyone unless it benefits us financially.
     

    Blackhawk2001

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    Given the amount of corruption, fraud, deceit and spending from both parties right now, it's not a matter of if, but when America is going to collapse. If we can't get a true Conservative in office and start leading the country, the end result is going to be the same, so what is there to lose? If a Conservative doesn't win, the good part about Obama winning is the country will crash that much sooner and we can get a quicker start on returning to the Constitution. I'm tired of compromising my principles, only to be continually lied to and used by the "Party". :patriot:
    So, basically, what you're saying is: "If I can't win, I'm not going to play?" "If I can't have what I want, I'm taking my vote and going home?" "It's not how you play the game, it's whether you are going to win or not?"
     

    sepe

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    Seems to me you won't be voting alot if you are only looking to vote for a perfect candidate.

    So wanting to vote for someone with principles means they're perfect? I didn't say that you have to agree with EVERYTHING someone says but you should be able to figure out if the person is a professional liar/thief by their previous actions. If you've voted them in once and they screw you, why are you going to vote for them again? If you're voting for a specific party and they keep screwing you (and everyone else in the country), why keep voting for them?

    If you're happy with the professional liars and thieves and the direction the country is headed, fine. Go vote for whatever talking head you're told to like. Don't complain when they screw the country.
     

    ATM

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    So many are satisfied with choosing between two available rulers these days.

    I am simply not satisfied with being ruled.
     

    John Galt

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    So, basically, what you're saying is: "If I can't win, I'm not going to play?" "If I can't have what I want, I'm taking my vote and going home?" "It's not how you play the game, it's whether you are going to win or not?"

    How did you get that out of what I just posted? Not play? Have you ever run for or hold an elected position, REALLY sticking your neck out for your beliefs? Let me spell it out for you - I WILL NO LONGER JUST BLINDLY VOTE REPUBLICAN UNLESS I BELIEVE IN THAT CANDIDATE! By having done so in the past has made me an accomplice in the mess we're in and I will no longer be a willing participant in a system that is enslaving my children. I will vote principle, and let the chips fall where they may. :patriot:

    "If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." - Thomas Paine
     

    inxs

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    People actually vote "for" something? I've been voting "against" for years. Haven't been able to find anything/one worth voting for...
     

    sepe

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    So many are satisfied with choosing between two available rulers these days.

    I am simply not satisfied with being ruled.

    Only way I want to be ruled is if it is by the sexual chocolate aka Black Walnut. Stupid me being a part of the wrong NRA, it never pays off. :(
     
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