Youth Shooting Challenge-do something

[shibumiseeker]

With dozens of threads whining about the lack of availability of .22lr and bemoaning how "it's for the children" because it's hard for youth shooting groups to get ammo, I'm making a challenge. It bugs me that so many people seem to think the only way to learn to shoot well is with a firearm. My very first gun I owned was a bb gun. It was cheaply constructed and not very accurate, but I shot tens of thousands of BBs and pellets with it and my very first squirrel kill was with it.

Many of us remember the cheap POS air guns we learned to shoot with, and we did just fine. The good news is that since then, airgun technology has improved dramatically to where what used to take a thousand bucks or more to start getting good quality, is now much cheaper. A really good beginner air rifle can be had for a couple of hundred bucks and even the medium quality ones are under $500.

I have lately become a fan of the PCP (PreChargedPneumatic) rifles and pistols as they are really good value for the money, and surprisingly, not new technology as many of us are familiar with the story of Lewis and Clark taking some on their expedition and them performing well.

PyramidAir is running a special on the Benjamin Discovery in .177 and .22 for a rifle and a hand pump for $400. The pump runs over a hundred and fifty so this is a pretty good deal for an excellent beginner rifle. You can buy one of the packages, and once a youth group has a pump or two, additional rifles or even pistols are much cheaper. There are other options for airguns of course, but I feel the PCP gives the closest approximation of shooting a .22lr.

Benjamin Discovery Rifle & Pump. Air rifles - PyramydAir.com

I challenge the members here who feel strongly that youth involvement in shooting sports is critical to the future of shooting to buy one in .22 and donate it to your youth shooting group along with a few tins of .22 pellets. These guns are as accurate as most .22lr and are immune to ammo shortages as you can buy molds or presses to make pellets out of lead or tin. Pellets run about $8-10/500 so even when .22lr becomes widely available it will still cost a third to a quarter to shoot. If you can afford to buy 2 cases of .22lr to donate to a youth group, you can afford to buy one of these and a bunch of pellets. I will add, before you just go out and do this, talk with whomever runs the group if they are willing to accept airguns and add them to their program. If they are not, seek out a youth group that will.

So, is anyone willing to take the challenge? Who is with me on this?

Anyone? Or is "it's for the children" really a disguise for "I'm mostly worried because I can't find .22lr for me but I don't want to sound like I'm whining?"

 

[Mgderf]

This is a great idea, and I would love to participate, but this is not the time for me financially.
I have recently donated at least 1k rounds of .22lr to youth shooting programs, but the bricks I donated had price tags of $13-$14.
I bought them long ago, along with a lot more. I will have .22 for myself for some years to come.
I help teach the NSSF's "First-Shots" program at my local range when they hold them.
I've donated more than one Crickett .22Lr rifle on this very forum. Actually, it's been more like 5 or 6.
I really wish I could do it, or this idea again, but now it's just not feasible.

My first long gun was a Daisy Red Ryder. Next was a Crosman pump .177 pellet gun.
I now have a Crosman .177 break-barrel that was just under $100. It will throw an alloy pellet at 1100fps! It has taken more than a few (dozen) tree rats.

Pellet guns, .22 or .177cal would be a fantastic alternative when ammo is unavailable for rfim-fire.

Do be sure to check your local ordinances. Many municipalities restrict their usage.

 

[shibumiseeker]

This is a great idea, and I would love to participate, but this is not the time for me financially.

That occurred to me too. If you are associated with a youth group get other folks to kick in a few bucks as well. $50 is easier to come up with than $400 for many folks, but it can still be done! It is much better to come up with "how can we do this" than "we can't do this." You can challenge your buddies to help with this. If you belong to any type of organization of people who hunt or shoot, make it an in-house challenge, or start a fundraiser. Even folks with no money can do that!

 

[Mgderf]

... or start a fundraiser. Even folks with no money can do that!

You just gave me a "Kickstarter" idea.
Thank you!

 

[shibumiseeker]

You just gave me a "Kickstarter" idea.
Thank you!

Oh! Great idea there too! Thanks for brainstorming it.

 

[BE Mike]

Why not contact your local 4H and see how you can be a sponsor, rather than offering them equipment that might not be suitable? National 4-H Shooting Sports

 

[shibumiseeker]

Why not contact your local 4H and see how you can be a sponsor, rather than offering them equipment that might not be suitable? National 4-H Shooting Sports

Because my mission is not to continue the focus on .22lr. Any organization that is so firmly entrenched in one type of way of teaching that they will not consider excellent alternatives is not one I want to throw my support behind (I'm not saying 4H is, this is a general statement). I'm trying to create a paradigm shifting movement, not continue with the same old same old that has proven in the last 5-6 years to be sensitive to the ammo situation. Moreover, 4H is not the only program out there, there are lots of smaller ones that will be more than happy to try new things. I trust that anyone who is involved with a youth shooting group who would be inspired to do this will know if it would be received well, or if a different set of airgun gear would more closely match that particular group.

My goal is not to replace youth .22lr shooting, but to push for a more robust and flexible set of options. In short, instead of continuing to whine about lack of .22lr availability hurting the children's ability to learn to shoot, I want to do something that creates more opportunity.

Nonetheless, you bring up a good point and I will edit my original challenge to reflect this.

 

[Mgderf]

My first thought, and the one I think I'll pursue, is to try talking my local conservation club into letting me install an airgun range.
They already have a firearms range in 25,50,and 100 yards, but I would rather not try to monopolize these with pellet guns. I'm sure that wouldn't go over well with the club's shooting population.

There is plenty of room, however, to install an airgun range far away from anything else on the property.
It would not take up much space, and would provide not only an alternative to the gun range, but would also be a great place to introduce new shooters to the sport.

 

[BE Mike]

Because my mission is not to continue the focus on .22lr. Any organization that is so firmly entrenched in one type of way of teaching that they will not consider excellent alternatives is not one I want to throw my support behind (I'm not saying 4H is, this is a general statement). I'm trying to create a paradigm shifting movement, not continue with the same old same old that has proven in the last 5-6 years to be sensitive to the ammo situation. Moreover, 4H is not the only program out there, there are lots of smaller ones that will be more than happy to try new things. I trust that anyone who is involved with a youth shooting group who would be inspired to do this will know if it would be received well, or if a different set of airgun gear would more closely match that particular group.

My goal is not to replace youth .22lr shooting, but to push for a more robust and flexible set of options. In short, instead of continuing to whine about lack of .22lr availability hurting the children's ability to learn to shoot, I want to do something that creates more opportunity.

Nonetheless, you bring up a good point and I will edit my original challenge to reflect this.

There are currently air gun programs for youth at schools in my area. There are also NRA approved air gun matches that are well attended by youth, not far away from you at Hoosier Hills Gun Club in Columbus. If you aren't a member of the Indiana State Rifle and Pistol Assn. (ISRPA Home) you might want to join and find out about the air gun opportunities for youth. You might even want to sponsor some air gun matches in your area.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Excellent information Mike! I know there are youth airgun programs, what I would like to see are mixed ones, that's not something I've seen nearly as much. I'd rather see a program say "well, we're having trouble getting .22lr right now so we're going to focus more on the airguns for a while." Instead I've seen a lot of the smaller programs just cutting back their classes and competitions rather than come up with alternatives.

 

[BogWalker]

When I was in 4-H safe shooters the rifle range was so short it was honestly a waste of ammunition. Air guns would have been much more practical.

I think one could go so far as to say air rifles would be better for youth groups than .22s. Much cheaper ammunition, rifles can be had for similar costs, you can put a range almost anywhere, and there are fewer legal restrictions on the guns themselves.

Air rifles just aren't given enough credit for what they can do. I think shooting sports as a whole seems to have a bit of a stigma on the use of air rifles by adults as many seem to regard them as toys. I think I might get a decent rifle for use at ranges <25 yards as really that small a range ends up being a bit of a waste of .22 when you're just punching paper. For target use there is pretty much zero difference except for the cost.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Just as an FYI, I just ordered one to donate and they have a 10% off deal until July 31, AND when I added it to my shopping cart it included 2 tins of pellets free. My total, shipped to my door was $371.26.

 

[BogWalker]

Why so expensive? CO2 and single stroke can be easily had for a third of the cost. $400/rifle would be hard to justify cost wise to many when the $100 .22 rifle is standard. The cost would even out after a few thousand rounds, but if the cost to adopt the rifle in the first place keeps it from being adopted that won't matter much.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Why so expensive? CO2 and single stroke can be easily had for a third of the cost. $400/rifle would be hard to justify cost wise to many when the $100 .22 rifle is standard. The cost would even out after a few thousand rounds, but if the cost to adopt the rifle in the first place keeps it from being adopted that won't matter much.

The rifle itself isn't that expensive, about $260. You need high pressure air or CO2 and the pump adds another $160 to the cost. But you only need one pump for several rifles, and they can be filled off SCUBA or SCBA (or use bulk CO2 as well).

Spring air is fine, but has an odd recoil compared to a .22lr, and the small cylinder CO2 require purchasing the CO2 cartridges which ups the cost.

I shoot all of them and of all of them the PCP are the most like real rifles in several ways. But if someone wanted to go with a cheaper option and do more of them, hey more's the better.

And the point of my challenge addresses your comment about if the rifles cost more then they won't be adopted. If each group had even one for every 4-5 .22lr they have a viable option which saves money in the long run. Donating several $100 rifles which use ammo that costs 4-5x is being penny wise and pound foolish.

 

[CountryBoy19]

Gah, you just cost me money Shibumiseeker... lol, thanks!!!

Awe, shucks... after I ordered yesterday they offer free shipping PLUS 10% off today only ... could have saved myself $16 if I had waited ... oh well, still a good thing to have... not to mention the ability to have an air-pump that will pump 3600 psi! Think of the uses for that... you can fill small CO2 tanks with air and use them anywhere you need compressed air in a small package (think tire repair kit for larger tires, or just general compressed air needs where the air compressor is too big/heavy)...