Unreasonable to ask for signed bill of sale on private gun sale?

[SmithGuy]

I have sold several guns privately in Indiana over the years, and each time I ask the buyer to sign a bill of sale which includes the date, purchase price, manufacturer, model, and serial number of the firearm. I do this for handguns and long guns as well. I know it is not required in Indiana for a purchaser in a private gun sale to sign anything. I require it so that in the unlikely event in the future that the police knock on my door and tell me a gun I owned was used in a crime, I can hand them something showing I do not own it anymore.

Most of the time the buyer kindly reminds me that a bill of sale is not required in Indiana on private gun sales, but I tell them I want it anyway and they have signed it every time. I do not go so far as to check their ID, so I have no idea if they are who they say they are but at least I would have something with their signature on it.

The only negative feedback I ever got asking for a signature was when I sold a gun to a police officer who was checking guns going into the 1500 a few years back. He gave me a dirty look and mumbled something under his breath, but he did sign it. I almost did not ask him to sign it, but I asked anyway since I had no idea if he would ever sell it in the future.

Am I being unreasonable asking for private gun buyers to sign a bill of sale? Are others doing this as well?

 

[hopper68]

If they want the gun bad enough they will sign. If they don't want to sign they can go elsewhere.

 

[BogWalker]

Some people hate the idea of a paper trail, but for the seller it really is a good idea. Can go a good ways to covering your rear if that gun ends up in a crime.

 

[LEaSH]

He was the short MCSD guy wasn't he?

 

[rollingblock]

Unless the person is a close friend, I too ask for a signed bill of sale. In today's litigious society to me it's a smart thing to do. If that gun is ever used in a crime and you were the last registered user life could get uncomfortable for you very quickly.

 

[JetGirl]

I haven't ever asked, but if I did it would be MY condition of the sale.
Don't want to sign? Don't. No gun for you.

 

[PistolBob]

Not unreasonable at all. I'd try to let them know about the requirement up front and not just spring it on them at the close of the sale. I did have a guy ask me to put my fingerprints on a bill of sale...he was pretty strange so I declined and let him keep his rifle.

 

[jwh20]

No, not unreasonable at all. It's a business transaction like any other. If you want a bill of sale, ask for it. Otherwise, no deal. The terms of sale are your. Just because there is no legal requirement for one, doesn't mean the law prohibits one either.

 

[pudly]

Not unreasonable at all. I'd try to let them know about the requirement up front and not just spring it on them at the close of the sale.

Definitely this. You will reduce your pool of buyers some, but it is your right. Just be clear up front about the requirement. I signed one BoS years ago, but would not do it any more. Don't waste the other person's time.

 

[looney2ns]

Most of the time the buyer kindly reminds me that a bill of sale is not required in Indiana on private gun sales, but I tell them I want it anyway and they have signed it every time. I do not go so far as to check their ID, so I have no idea if they are who they say they are but at least I would have something with their signature on it.

If it's a hand gun sale, it's probably more important that you do ask for their ID. To prove they are an Indiana resident.

Lots of us also ask to see their LTCH, as that give's you some comfort they are a proper person since it requires a background check to obtain.

 

[Liberty's Teeth]

The only person or entity who I don't feel has the right to know what I own is the .gov. If someone whats me to sign a bill of sale I don't have an issue with it. I would, however, tell them upfront.

 

[Walt_Jabsco]

As others have noted, it's your prerogative to have a bill of sale if you want. I've never used them myself, but I can understand doing so. What I don't really understand is people who refuse to sign them. Why do you need guns without a paper trail? Aside from paranoid "The guv'mints gonna take my guns!!" sort of attitude, I don't see any valid reason to be opposed to signing a bill of sale.

 

[mrortega]

I always ask for ID and Indiana LTCH and have them sign two papers with my signature, the date, model of gun, serial, price and any added features (laser sight, etc.) I keep one copy and they get the other. Usually I can read the signature but one guy signed his so sloppy that I'm sure it wouldn't stand up in court. (At lease his name was clearly printed on the paper.)

 

[JetGirl]

Why do you need guns without a paper trail?

Why is that anybody else's business?
Maybe somebody has a violent stalker with connections and they don't want them to know they bought a protection piece.

Aside from paranoid "The guv'mints gonna take my guns!!" sort of attitude,

"So what" to that, too. So what?

I don't see any valid reason to be opposed to signing a bill of sale.

How do I know what's gonna happen to my signature in your possession?
Scan? Photoshop? Attached to something bad?
If I don't want someone to have it, they won't. Pretty simple.

 

[mac45]

As long as you make it known that you require one, I don't see a problem at all.
Folks that don't like it can shop elsewhere.

 

[nm0369]

I've never asked for a bill of sale, but I do present my DL/LTCH and ask to see the same. If they don't have a LTCH I ask: "Are you legally able to own a firearm in IN"? I'm not going to jump through hoops that aren't required by law....my time is better spent elsewhere.

 

[jblomenberg16]

Unless the person is a close friend, I too ask for a signed bill of sale. In today's litigious society to me it's a smart thing to do. If that gun is ever used in a crime and you were the last registered user life could get uncomfortable for you very quickly.

Just a reminder, there is no such thing as a firearms registry (at least not yet). At best the serial number could be traced from the manufacturer to its original point of sale (presumably an FFL).

As far as I know (those that know for sure ... please jump in and comment) the FFL's records remain their private records and can only be searched by the BATFE.

I suppose it is possible that if the crime committed was serious enough, that the BATFE could try to trace the history of the weapon, at which point they could discover that at one point in time it was transferred to you.

I am like you, though, I prefer to have verified the person is an Indiana resident, ask for an LTCH (helps verify proper person) and ask for a signed bill of sale.

 

[churchmouse]

If they want the gun bad enough they will sign. If they don't want to sign they can go elsewhere.

This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^totally.

If you think it is needed, do it. If not....your call.

I do not ask for a signature on every FTF private sale. Depends on the person.

 

[ATM]

As long as you're OK with me signing using a fictitious name, I don't see anything unreasonable about wanting a signature on there.

 

[Classic]

No bill of sale = no sale. Simple.