Absolute Frustration! An OC experience...

[Hayseed_40]

Back in the Roman days, an engineer had to stand under the bridge he designed while the first weight went across. SO if it failed he died. We need to bring this back.

Lot of good young engineers but a lot of cocky arrognt ones who are not ready for the real world.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Back in the Roman days, an engineer had to stand under the bridge he designed while the first weight went across. SO if it failed he died. We need to bring this back.

Lot of good young engineers but a lot of cocky arrognt ones who are not ready for the real world.

A few years ago an electrical contractor asked me about scheduling our plant electricians to do some substation switching after they got a project done...I told them, I think if they do the work, it would be a good idea if they had to turn it back on (do the switching). He kinda looked at me funny for a second, but after he thought about it, he was ok with the idea.

 

[mrortega]

This is so true. If it looks good on paper it has to work. Even with architects, on a job there 4 or 5 revised prints going around and you always have make sure you got the right one. Then mistakes are made and things get held up. One print we had the architect was missing about 8ft of floorspace!

We did a new Jr. high school years ago. The arch and eng evidently didn't coordinate a huge supply air duct coming down from an air handler over the stage in the "cafetorium". The architect cried about having to build up a 3 foot deep ceiling bulkhead at the back of the stage. I about sh** at the open house 6 months later when I heard several people talking about the beautiful way the planners "designed" the rear of the stage ceiling so that the music was projected out into the audience better. "Look how they stepped it up. That's so the music and voices are projected out. It's wonderful." NO, DAMMIT. IT'S A GIANT SCREW UP.

Ortega just took a couple deep breaths and everything is better now. Ohmmm. Ohmmm.

 

[looney2ns]

I think it should be required that all Eng's, and Arc's have to work in their choosen field for two years before they can graduate. And by that I mean they should have to build or repair what has been designed by their own hands on a real job.

But then again, that should be required of the professors as well, some of them have zero real world experience.

 

[looney2ns]

The worst part of it, and I'm sure BlueEagle can confirm, is I go to school with several womanizers. Seriously, that's the only way to classify them. And I've said it once, I've said it at least a hundred times, that I will play dirty back and pick at my own gender. Part of that is my nature of enjoying the attention, and shock-and-awe of 'YOUJUSTTOLDAWOMANINTHEKITCHENJOKEHOWDAREYOU!' moments.

It really frustrates me at some times, and it's usually when it's so condescending, or just flat out rude, or these *ahem* boys, treating me like I'm something less than they are. Half the time my internal monologue, yes in a British accent because everything sounds better, is something along the lines of 'Are you kidding me?! I could flip you over and hold you to the ground with my foot on your throat before you knew what happened.... and you're going to degrade me to more stupid blonde and women in the kitchen jokes?!'

I know the real world is, obviously, full of idiots. But I keep finding the bigtime ones apparently. I feel for your daughter, boys, not men, are pigs. (Sorry guys, I had to take it there...)



Here is where I wish I could explain to them my story, of which, to keep this relatively short, I will only share a small part of. It explains a lot of the reason as to why I kept up with my martial arts training and now own a gun that I plan to carry daily. (Provided nitwits don't get in the way.)

I have been stalked. By two different individuals.
Catch that line, by two different individuals at two separate times.

BlueEagle is witness to one of those, as in I called him freaking out. He offered, and I'm sure was almost ready to come pick me up and cause a scene. I'm positive if it were to happen again and I wasn't prepared he would without a second thought.

Now, I do go to engineering school and I'm surrounded by a bunch of boys, and some men, every day. I'm used to the stupid flirting and the guys I spend a majority of my time with are very protective of me. I still feel as if I haven't thanked them enough times after this last year...

This whole debacle started at the beginning of the summer term of last year, right in the beginning of May. I started this pain of a class that had only 12 students, one of which I marked as a creeper the first time I saw him. I don't know what it was, maybe the way he looked at me, or attempted to talk to me, or the fact that he stared at me the whole 2 hour plus class. I made a point to be on guard more, after the next few classes. This class was paired with a lab, that a majority of the time ran laaaaate into the night. My two partners and I always worked together, but sometimes one would have to leave, or one would go get food and it'd be a bit more uncomfortable. He always stayed extra late, and wanted to be nearest to me... Then he started following me...

When I realized he was following me it was the first bit of June because I had a new class on the other side of campus. He followed me from one side of campus to the other, and try as he might it was very obvious.... From that point on, I started telling those I considered close to me and asked them to walk with me to class, and not leave me alone.

It got really bad in the middle of June, to the point I almost confronted him with one of the bigger and meaner guys for backup. I hid in my advisor's office after explaining the situation. He made quite a few passes by her office, and she went out and asked him 'What are you doing up here?!' to which he responded, 'Looking for a girl, she's in my class, I want to see her...'
THAT was the day I absolutely lost it. From then on, I made sure someone knew where I was, how long I was going to be there, and when I moved. I made the women's restroom on my engineering floor a new hideout! Between that, and my adivsor's office, and the guys I was with I felt a little better, but the threat didn't stop.

I honestly worry about going back to campus this summer. I haven't heard any updates about that kid, and honestly, I hope to all things he has since graduated....

/end storytime

That was longer than I planned, but that was just one of the two stalkers. The other one was a bit before this guy, and never escalated to what I feel that this guy was at.

It's what made me realize, even though this guy was 'smaller' than me, that a form of martial arts isn't exactly my best option. I do not want to have to hold someone long enough for cops to respond. They're always to far away... especially when it really matters.



And to answer the other part, because I'm not going to double post this, and I kinda got sidetracked by my storytime... My confidence level is not shallow by any means, really, I posted a photo of myself on a forum with people I will probably never meet!, plus, I'm a bit headstrong in general. Due to that, and my parents always telling me I have to be confident to get what I want, that trait is already there.

Being stepped on by people like this, is something I think will become quite common, and if this continues to happen on a regular basis, I'm going to end up in the 'I CC because....' camp. I won't stop trying to 'win them over' even though I kinda see it being impossible, they're pretty set in their ways...

Sorry that you've had to go through all that.

Couple of points:
Some guys like to torment and tease just to get a rise out of a female. They think its funny. IF you can get your mindset to the point you don't give them the satisfaction of getting upset at their moronic behavior, just have a good comeback line, or ignore it all together, this will sometimes stop or lessen the behavior of the man-child. Getting upset just fuels the fire. Yes, I know, easier said then done.

I'm sorry you have had to deal with stalkers, my daughter has as well, it's a horrible experience. Some guys will take any attention from a female and twist into thinking that the girl is interested in them. Maybe weigh guys a little more first before you decide to be friendly with them.

Be proud of the fact that you have taken the steps to improve your chances of staying safe and deciding to not be a victim. Major kudos to you. Keep it up.

 

[Hookeye]

Poor engineers become Program Managers


Must say, quite a few engineering school graduates are pretty inept. A degree.... Bach, Masters or PHD. is no guarantee.

Seen some idiots with those, and some very good "non degreed" engineers.

FWIW my buddy, lead engineer in our lab, was pretty vocal about engineering school grads being automatically called "engineers".

He was a "Registered Engineer".

 

[radar8756]

Here is where I wish I could explain to them my story, of which, to keep this relatively short, I will only share a small part of. It explains a lot of the reason as to why I kept up with my martial arts training and now own a gun that I plan to carry daily. (Provided nitwits don't get in the way.)

I have been stalked.

This type of behavior needs to be reported to the PO PO and a restraining order taken out ... in the unlikely event you do have to defend yourself ... a paper trail is your best defense in a He Said / She Said scenario

 

[Caleb]

This type of behavior needs to be reported to the PO PO and a restraining order taken out ... in the unlikely event you do have to defend yourself ... a paper trail is your best defense in a He Said / She Said scenario

I second this...Get a no contact order, not a protective order

 

[Mr. Habib]

I've always said if a engineer had to work on things they designed, then they would be built different.

Amen!

A sad thing I've noticed is many of the younger engineers really avoid getting their hands dirty. I know several that do not even do simple repairs around their house or maintenance on their cars.

The best engineers I've ever worked with were the ones that fixed their own stuff, even if it was stuff that was outside their chosen field.

Poor engineers become Program Managers
Very true.

Must say, quite a few engineering school graduates are pretty inept. A degree.... Bach, Masters or PHD. is no guarantee.

Some of the most stupid and inept people that I have ever meet had the letters PhD after their names.

 

[catielynnb]

I'm sectioning this response, because it has two main points...

I think it should be required that all Eng's, and Arc's have to work in their choosen field for two years before they can graduate. And by that I mean they should have to build or repair what has been designed by their own hands on a real job.

But then again, that should be required of the professors as well, some of them have zero real world experience.

I've always said if a engineer had to work on things they designed, then they would be built different.

Amen!

You are so right, hence the reason I appreciate my employer. I worked in our 'panel shop' and I've got the scars to prove it. It's quite an eye opener and I agree wholeheartedly.

Must say, quite a few engineering school graduates are pretty inept. A degree.... Bach, Masters or PHD. is no guarantee.

Some of the most stupid and inept people that I have ever meet had the letters PhD after their names.

I know some of those people, and then I know some who have their PhD that completely rock. It's a 50/50 shot....

Second part....

Sorry that you've had to go through all that.

Couple of points:
Some guys like to torment and tease just to get a rise out of a female. They think its funny. IF you can get your mindset to the point you don't give them the satisfaction of getting upset at their moronic behavior, just have a good comeback line, or ignore it all together, this will sometimes stop or lessen the behavior of the man-child. Getting upset just fuels the fire. Yes, I know, easier said then done.

I wish it was that, because honestly I never once made a move to this guy, or anything like that. I never even introduced myself! I never got upset that he could see, I did when I hid, or whatever... but that's between me and mainly my advisor and some of the guys who knew. I did my best to ignore it all.

Be proud of the fact that you have taken the steps to improve your chances of staying safe and deciding to not be a victim. Major kudos to you. Keep it up.

I've done my best. I carry a kubaton on my key chain, I make it a point to thread my keys through my fingers when walking to my car, I don't listen to music when leaving classes, or anytime other than when I'm studying... It's become a habit.

Right after all this escalated, last June, I almost flipped a classmate over when he grabbed me to hug me from behind. I was terrified, and when I realized who it was, I apologized profusely. He never even knew, and he was one of the first to offer to walk me to classes. He took that better than I expected...

This type of behavior needs to be reported to the PO PO and a restraining order taken out ... in the unlikely event you do have to defend yourself ... a paper trail is your best defense in a He Said / She Said scenario

I second this...Get a no contact order, not a protective order

How would I do that on campus, provided he is still there? Anyone have any ideas... I don't think our classes mix, but I'm not sure they can actually keep us away from one another. I've looked before, but never found anything substantial.

 

[IndyGunner]

Sounds to me like your male co-workers are a tad insecure around a strong, confident, and well-armed woman! Fail on their part.

^that!

You're welcome to come to lunch with me and OC anytime!

 

[ocsdor]

Should have told them "What? You think I'm riding with you perverts without my gun?"

 

[Caleb]

I'm sectioning this response, because it has two main points...





You are so right, hence the reason I appreciate my employer. I worked in our 'panel shop' and I've got the scars to prove it. It's quite an eye opener and I agree wholeheartedly.



I know some of those people, and then I know some who have their PhD that completely rock. It's a 50/50 shot....

Second part....



I wish it was that, because honestly I never once made a move to this guy, or anything like that. I never even introduced myself! I never got upset that he could see, I did when I hid, or whatever... but that's between me and mainly my advisor and some of the guys who knew. I did my best to ignore it all.



I've done my best. I carry a kubaton on my key chain, I make it a point to thread my keys through my fingers when walking to my car, I don't listen to music when leaving classes, or anytime other than when I'm studying... It's become a habit.

Right after all this escalated, last June, I almost flipped a classmate over when he grabbed me to hug me from behind. I was terrified, and when I realized who it was, I apologized profusely. He never even knew, and he was one of the first to offer to walk me to classes. He took that better than I expected...



How would I do that on campus, provided he is still there? Anyone have any ideas... I don't think our classes mix, but I'm not sure they can actually keep us away from one another. I've looked before, but never found anything substantial.

You go to the courthouse and file out some paperwork...no contact is just that(communication, physical, etc) and the protection order generally need evidence of threat(physical abuse, threatened with a weapon, etc)...I believe you will more likely get a no contact than a protective order.

You could also call police to leave a paper trail of the harassment....harassment is a crime.

 

[catielynnb]

You go to the courthouse and file out some paperwork...no contact is just that(communication, physical, etc) and the protection order generally need evidence of threat(physical abuse, threatened with a weapon, etc)...I believe you will more likely get a no contact than a protective order.

You could also call police to leave a paper trail of the harassment....harassment is a crime.

I keep thinking I'd have to go through the University, because that's where all contact has originated. But then again I could just talk to LMPD... I need to find out again. :/

I think it will come down to the factor of if he is still on campus, if not, there's nothing I could do... at least, I don't think I could.

 

[Caleb]

I keep thinking I'd have to go through the University, because that's where all contact has originated. But then again I could just talk to LMPD... I need to find out again. :/

I think it will come down to the factor of if he is still on campus, if not, there's nothing I could do... at least, I don't think I could.

The campus has nothing to do with a no-contact order

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

Catielynn -

My daughter went through this with a kid at high school. He couldn't take "no" for an answer and it escalated. Threats were made, expulsions happened, etc. In my case, we got the Protective Order for the exact reasons mentioned. It's a LOT different for you, but still not a bad idea. No one seems to have a problem when a gal like yourself is forced to take action. But when a Dad the size of me (too many cheeseburgers!) is forced to take action to prevent a threat, I REALLY NEED the paper trail. Fortunately, it's not come to that, and I pray it never does. What sucks is that there is no statute of limitations for Cretans like this. And there can never really be "closure" until you or they are six feet under. Harsh - but true.

Here's the lessons that I've learned thus far - and they are worth exactly what you paid for them!
1) You need a paper trail in any case. Establish the chain of what has gone on and get it ON PAPER. Could be via the people you've talked with, or whatever. But get it on PAPER! Make sure those close to you know what's going on.
2) YOU ARE NOT ALONE. I can't count the number of times my family second guessed ourselves while going through this.
3) It sounds like you are doing this - but surround yourself with good friends. They are the BEST defense.
4) Protective orders cover everywhere - not just the University. Get one. They don't stop anything, but they sure help you if YOU have to stop something! Side benefit - they alert others around you to the danger and provide validation. If I tried to explain to folks what happened with my daughter - I got blank stares. Once the Protective Order was in hand, people immediate said, "oh crap" and took what we said MUCH more seriously. Stupid - but dang sure true.
5) Do NOT listen to any of the voices (or PEOPLE) that say that it's your fault or any of that horse ! I have ZERO patience for that crap after going through what our family did.

Lastly - know that there's at least one family out there praying for you. It sounds like you've done many of the right things - keep doing them and be careful.

 

[catielynnb]

The campus has nothing to do with a no-contact order

Good. I've done a fair bit of searching, just to see what all the legal definitions are... because, there was never any physical contact between this boy and I.

So far, all I've found is,

508.130 Definitions for KRS 508.130 to 508.150.
As used in KRS 508.130 to 508.150, unless the context requires otherwise:
(1) (a) To "stalk" means to engage in an intentional course of conduct:
1. Directed at a specific person or persons;
2. Which seriously alarms, annoys, intimidates, or harasses the person or
persons; and
3. Which serves no legitimate purpose.
(b) The course of conduct shall be that which would cause a reasonable person to
suffer substantial mental distress.

and the explanation of Stalking in the First Degree and Second Degree...

I'm going to make a few calls and find out if this kid is on campus still, and if so how he will react to me returning to campus.

I also think I may be over-reacting a bit, but I think I'm allowed to due to the circumstances. :/ I've never had to do this before... and being away for two semesters made me sort of forget that feeling that I'm being followed. I honestly fear going back to campus more than people realize... and all my boys who helped me through it have since graduated.

...It's a LOT different for you, but still not a bad idea.
What sucks is that there is no statute of limitations for Cretans like this. And there can never really be "closure" until you or they are six feet under. Harsh - but true.

Here's the lessons that I've learned thus far - and they are worth exactly what you paid for them!
1) You need a paper trail in any case. Establish the chain of what has gone on and get it ON PAPER. Could be via the people you've talked with, or whatever. But get it on PAPER! Make sure those close to you know what's going on.
2) YOU ARE NOT ALONE. I can't count the number of times my family second guessed ourselves while going through this.
3) It sounds like you are doing this - but surround yourself with good friends. They are the BEST defense.
4) Protective orders cover everywhere - not just the University. Get one. They don't stop anything, but they sure help you if YOU have to stop something! Side benefit - they alert others around you to the danger and provide validation. If I tried to explain to folks what happened with my daughter - I got blank stares. Once the Protective Order was in hand, people immediate said, "oh crap" and took what we said MUCH more seriously. Stupid - but dang sure true.
5) Do NOT listen to any of the voices (or PEOPLE) that say that it's your fault or any of that horse ! I have ZERO patience for that crap after going through what our family did.

Lastly - know that there's at least one family out there praying for you. It sounds like you've done many of the right things - keep doing them and be careful.

I appreciate the prayers, they've be needed as I return to school. I'm actually quite nervous because those friends are mostly gone ^^I said that up there too.

I know I'd have the support of my department, they do not look highly on anyone coming after their so few women. I've worked really hard to stay in college, and that's a whole other conversation and a half, and I don't want to have to move schools or whatever because of this kind of situation. I just want the threat gone. :/ I want to not walk in excess fear on my campus.... I have enough of that with it being so close to the 'ghetto' and all the rape/assult/robberies they have. I hate my campus, I just want my degree and I want to leave...

 

[Caleb]

Catielynn -

My daughter went through this with a kid at high school. He couldn't take "no" for an answer and it escalated. Threats were made, expulsions happened, etc. In my case, we got the Protective Order for the exact reasons mentioned. It's a LOT different for you, but still not a bad idea. No one seems to have a problem when a gal like yourself is forced to take action. But when a Dad the size of me (too many cheeseburgers!) is forced to take action to prevent a threat, I REALLY NEED the paper trail. Fortunately, it's not come to that, and I pray it never does. What sucks is that there is no statute of limitations for Cretans like this. And there can never really be "closure" until you or they are six feet under. Harsh - but true.

Here's the lessons that I've learned thus far - and they are worth exactly what you paid for them!
1) You need a paper trail in any case. Establish the chain of what has gone on and get it ON PAPER. Could be via the people you've talked with, or whatever. But get it on PAPER! Make sure those close to you know what's going on.
2) YOU ARE NOT ALONE. I can't count the number of times my family second guessed ourselves while going through this.
3) It sounds like you are doing this - but surround yourself with good friends. They are the BEST defense.
4) Protective orders cover everywhere - not just the University. Get one. They don't stop anything, but they sure help you if YOU have to stop something! Side benefit - they alert others around you to the danger and provide validation. If I tried to explain to folks what happened with my daughter - I got blank stares. Once the Protective Order was in hand, people immediate said, "oh crap" and took what we said MUCH more seriously. Stupid - but dang sure true.
5) Do NOT listen to any of the voices (or PEOPLE) that say that it's your fault or any of that horse ! I have ZERO patience for that crap after going through what our family did.

Lastly - know that there's at least one family out there praying for you. It sounds like you've done many of the right things - keep doing them and be careful.

My wife and I tried to get a no-contact order against my wife's ex boyfriend(harassment, sending naked pictures) but Elizabeth wanted the protection order instead of the no-contact order....the judge denied us. I really think had we just gotten the no-contact order, the judge would have been more likely approved it.

 

[JoshuaRWhite]

So, here's the deal, I OC'd while on lunch from work today. Went to a local deli and had a good lunch.

I was not the one driving, I have a tiny car, and before leaving I grabbed my gun and holster out of the car to take with me. I saw nothing wrong with this. I knew where we were going, what we were doing and about how long we were going to be gone, and I've done it before... They almost left me here, but whatever, that's nothing to do with the story.

We get to the deli, everyone gets out, walks in, stands in line, normal dealio. My gun was pretty obvious considering the odd stares I got as we were walking in and standing in line. I've chalked that up to nothing worthwhile anymore... (Aren't you guys proud?! I learned!) and paid, sat down outside and ate.

There's this nifty little cupcake place next door, and I was really craving something sweet, and seeing as I finished before everyone else, walked off the patio to go see what they had. On my way around another customer asked me 'Hey, miss, what caliber is that?' We had a very civil, and rather plesant conversation about it. I didn't think anything of it. Went in, got my cupcake, got another compliment and left.

While I was walking back to our table no one said anything, other customer wise, but the guys were talking about something with this monster job we're working on. I had just sat down with my cupcake and it got really quiet. I knew something rather unpleasant was about to happen.

One of my coworkers (the driver), flipped out. He actually spoke to me like I was a child, specifically his child. (for emphasis, but most people he yelled these words at me) "YOU have YOUR GUN on you?! WHY?!" at which point I felt like I had done something wrong.

Ouch.

I nicely responded, "Yeah, it goes with me pretty much everywhere. Is that strange?"

My other coworker, who had remained silent, goes "She's just all gun happy and wanting to show off," completely ignoring the fact that I'm sitting right there. He proceeds to turn to me, and goes, "What, you think you're going to get attacked while we're on lunch. What's wrong with you?!" I said the same thing to him, with a bit more emphasis, along with "... You never know. I've been in bad situations with lots of people before, doesn't change the mental...." I got cut off (which really upsets me!) by the driver, "You know it's illegal to have that on company property, where'd you even get it from?!" At this point, I was a bit more than slightly frustrated and I was doing my best not to let it show.

He didn't even let me finish my statement, and continued with the, why do you need that, what makes it worth it, it's not allowed on company property bulk. (I really didn't want to get into the reasons behind why I bought and carry one, because honestly, it's none of his business)

I did ask him where it said that we're not 'allowed' to have firearms on the property. This is a pretty small business, in the sticks, and I've seen people walking around with shotguns pretty regularly. So why, am I, not allowed to keep my pistol in my glove box? They never really came up with a good answer, just that it was word of mouth and that my car counts as company property when it's parked here.

I see a big hole in that argument, because my car doors are locked, my glove box is shut and my windows are rolled up. You don't belong in my car unless you have a specific reason to be searching it, right? As in, a search warrant or my explicit permission.

Needless to say, I had other crap arguments thrown at me from the two guys and the other coworker there just smiled and nodded. Frustrating! SO FLIPPING FRUSTRATING! Makes me not want to wait for my permit to get here! (for those of you who don't know, I'm an KY resident. I can OC without a license just for clarification.)

Honestly, after the last experience, I don't think I want to OC anymore. Check the thread here. Each time it seems to leave a bad taste in my mouth...
Really ruined my whole last half of my day. That, and the other work related drama. Somewhere around 500 pages, that have to be organized, bound and cleaned up before Monday, dropped on my desk an hour before I am to leave...

I don't know if this is just a rant, or a question... I'm sure someone will find something in there somewhere...

Pretty much why I try not to OC. Draws too much attention from anti-gun people and people who don't understand the mindset. Just fire the question back "Do you carry a condom". lol That's what I do, carrying a gun and a condom are at the basics for the same reason, just in case.

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

Caleb -

I won't go into details in a public forum. But in our case, I certainly believe that the Protective Order was warranted. And it was received.

If you ever want to compare notes, (goes for anyone out there) PM me and I'll be glad to discuss in more detail.


Bottom line - even though you feel helpless in many ways. You are NOT ALONE. There's a LOT of people out here who've had to deal with this lunacy. It's unfortunate that there's that much of it happening - but at least it helps to know that others are out there.