Army adopts M-17 and M-18 as new hand gun

[2A_Tom]

Should've stayed with the 1911A1.

John

Aaaah, the first handgun I ever laid my hands on. I had heard all of the neg rep, and believed it. Then I want to the range and shot it. I still believed that it was inaccrrate as could be. (It had nothing to do with my lack of ability or training) Then I was told there was plenty of ammo that had to be used and I could shoot as much as I wanted to. I shot several hundred rounds that day and still with a lack of training I became preddy accurate with it. Now with 45 years and 97% of all of my pistol shooting with it, I will mostlikely never change.


Note: I am happy that they say that the 9mm is far more deadly. They need to ban them and leave my inaccurate and ineffective 1911A1 alone

 

[IndyDave1776]

I never knew that GIs could throw 1911s with such deadly accuracy... do they still teach that in the military?

You are a real comedian! My personal dead stock Series 80 Colt is quite accurate, and it isn't even in the same zip code with the 1911s some others, like Churchmouse for example, are using.

 

[MarkC]

Why? Should we want our boys with reliable, accurate, and deadly weapons?

Half purple

Absolutely! Plenty of dead Germans and Japanese can attest to this!

Right? The M1911A1 I was issued in the early 80's was a worn out, shot out leftover from WWII. It is unfortunate there isn't a modern source for these weapons!



This was taken when my Marine friend sent a picture of her issued puny M9.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Right? The M1911A1 I was issued in the early 80's was a worn out, shot out leftover from WWII. It is unfortunate there isn't a modern source for these weapons!

View attachment 61364

This was taken when my Marine friend sent a picture of her issued puny M9.

Exactly. I used to work with a guy who was issued one in that time frame. He told me that you could chamber a round, point it downward, slap the back of the gun with your hand, and the entire cartridge would fly out the barrel. He managed to get a new barrel and bushing, and then it worked just like it's supposed to, accurately even.

 

[2A_Tom]

As a compamy armorer in the late 70's there is no way that actually could happen. Yes they would have entertained babys in the crib, but there is no way a barrel could ever be that shot out.

 

[Peacekeeper3073]

As a compamy armorer in the late 70's there is no way that actually could happen. Yes they would have entertained babys in the crib, but there is no way a barrel could ever be that shot out.

I would have to agree and have to see it first hand.

 

[OurDee]

I wish they would issue something in .454 Cassul.

 

[IndyDave1776]

As a compamy armorer in the late 70's there is no way that actually could happen. Yes they would have entertained babys in the crib, but there is no way a barrel could ever be that shot out.

I would have to agree and have to see it first hand.

I heard that from someone generally honest and not prone to exaggeration. Needless to say, I did not see the gun in question myself.

I wish they would issue something in .454 Cassul.

A former tanker of my acquaintance was of the opinion (expressed while we were discussing the relative merits of the M9 and the sainted John Moses Browning's 1911) that the best choice would be a double-action revolver in .44 mag.

 

[Floivanus]

Hey now, the army wanted a gun that had a certain capacity, chambered in 9mm and there's no such thing in a 1911 as we all know, high capacity for those is 8 rounds

 

[2A_Tom]

I will keep my 1911A1 you can keep your pea shooter.

 

[bgcatty]

The idiots at Yahoo reported that the M17&19 are more lethal than the M9! Imagine that?

 

[Peacekeeper3073]

The idiots at Yahoo reported that the M17&19 are more lethal than the M9! Imagine that?

They are correct. The M models such as M17/19, M2.0, and Glock M models are all more lethal. Sorry Glock Gen 5 guys your new pistol is worthless without that M !

 

[Spike Jones 5 2002]

More information.

https://www.americanrifleman.org/ar...wsletter&utm_medium=insider&utm_campaign=1217

 

[Peacekeeper3073]

Now that some of the Sig pistols are being issued what do you guys think will happen to the Glock 19's that are in use by some of the Rangers and others ?

 

[KellyinAvon]

They are correct. The M models such as M17/19, M2.0, and Glock M models are all more lethal. Sorry Glock Gen 5 guys your new pistol is worthless without that M !

The M is for mo lethal?

 

[sheepdog697]

hopefully these workout well for them

 

[OurDee]

P227FDE, just saying.

 

[Usmccookie]

I think all these 1911 fanboys on here that are in wonderment as to why we aren't issued 1911 since they're so accurate and reliable. Im not trying to hate on you just bringing some practical thinking to the discussion. While you may have thousands of rounds a year in range time. That is rarely the case in the military. I rated and was issued an m9 4.5 of my 5 years in. By the time i got out and bought my own, i had to youtube how to take it down to clean. I had maybe a total of 2-300 rounds over 4 .5 years. This is a very normal situation.
So if i have a kid that had no prior experience shooting relying in his sidearm for his life.... Give him as many rounds as i can with as little recoil as possible with a still effective round. This kid will be spraying and praying for his life. Not bragging about his 3 inch group at 15 yds to his buddy that he's been shooting with since the 60s or 70s.
Then there is the money aspect. A 1911 that is worth a damn starts at about $1000? M9... $600. P320... $500
.45= $.38/ round, 9x19= $.18/ round...
(Its been about a year since I've bought ammo so my prices, Im sure, are off)
Splurging an extra $500 to $3000 extra for a 1911 and $.20/round might be ok with you(pending the wife's permission).
Now Multiply It by just over a million service members. Of which a third, rate a side arm. *drops mic*
*picks up mic*
Let me know if you want my opinion on the glock vs. Sig.
*sets mic down gently*

 

[Peacekeeper3073]

I think all these 1911 fanboys on here that are in wonderment as to why we aren't issued 1911 since they're so accurate and reliable. Im not trying to hate on you just bringing some practical thinking to the discussion. While you may have thousands of rounds a year in range time. That is rarely the case in the military. I rated and was issued an m9 4.5 of my 5 years in. By the time i got out and bought my own, i had to youtube how to take it down to clean. I had maybe a total of 2-300 rounds over 4 .5 years. This is a very normal situation.
So if i have a kid that had no prior experience shooting relying in his sidearm for his life.... Give him as many rounds as i can with as little recoil as possible with a still effective round. This kid will be spraying and praying for his life. Not bragging about his 3 inch group at 15 yds to his buddy that he's been shooting with since the 60s or 70s.
Then there is the money aspect. A 1911 that is worth a damn starts at about $1000? M9... $600. P320... $500
.45= $.38/ round, 9x19= $.18/ round...
(Its been about a year since I've bought ammo so my prices, Im sure, are off)
Splurging an extra $500 to $3000 extra for a 1911 and $.20/round might be ok with you(pending the wife's permission).
Now Multiply It by just over a million service members. Of which a third, rate a side arm. *drops mic*
*picks up mic*
Let me know if you want my opinion on the glock vs. Sig.
*sets mic down gently*

Great post and that comes from an old 1911 guy who carries polymer everyday. I would like to hear your opinion on Glock vs Sig.

 

[2A_Tom]

Should've stayed with the 1911A1.

I think all these 1911 fanboys on here that are in wonderment as to why we aren't issued 1911 since they're so accurate and reliable. Im not trying to hate on you just bringing some practical thinking to the discussion. While you may have thousands of rounds a year in range time. That is rarely the case in the military. I rated and was issued an m9 4.5 of my 5 years in. By the time i got out and bought my own, i had to youtube how to take it down to clean. I had maybe a total of 2-300 rounds over 4 .5 years. This is a very normal situation.
So if i have a kid that had no prior experience shooting relying in his sidearm for his life.... Give him as many rounds as i can with as little recoil as possible with a still effective round. This kid will be spraying and praying for his life. Not bragging about his 3 inch group at 15 yds to his buddy that he's been shooting with since the 60s or 70s.
Then there is the money aspect. A 1911 that is worth a damn starts at about $1000? M9... $600. P320... $500
.45= $.38/ round, 9x19= $.18/ round...
(Its been about a year since I've bought ammo so my prices, Im sure, are off)
Splurging an extra $500 to $3000 extra for a 1911 and $.20/round might be ok with you(pending the wife's permission).
Now Multiply It by just over a million service members. Of which a third, rate a side arm. *drops mic*
*picks up mic*
Let me know if you want my opinion on the glock vs. Sig.
*sets mic down gently*

That is all well and good, I realize that firearms training in the military is lousy, as did Gen. Wingate, Col. Church and Gen. Burnside.

I use to have a link to a list of rounds to kill for past wars, but cannot find it. Basically the Civil War was horrendous but it gets worse war by war.

GAO: U.S. Has Fired 250,000 Rounds For Every Insurgent Killed
https://jonathanturley.org/2011/01/10/gao-u-s-has-fired-250000-rounds-for-every-insurgent-killed/

Poor marksmanship and adrenalin cost a lot of lives and treasure. So just give them more ammo and let them waste it, don't rethink training.

I am the ultimate 1911A1 lover. That being said I have no problem with the modern 9mm, athe ammo is deadly and the pistols are accurate.

I don't care how deadly the weapon is if you are not trained in the proper use of it.

ETA To kill a single terrorist a man/woman would have to carry 14705.5 magazines.