Atf decides to redefine common pistols as aow

[Ingomike]

Doesn't work that way - dictatorship, I mean. Just because a law exists, does not mean that law is just. If you are a "law means it's right" person, I see your point, if you aren't you see mine.
Of the 3 branches of government, the "executive" is tasked to enforce the law. The head of the executive branch, the president, is given wide latitude in interpreting and enforcing those laws.

While presidents are given some latitude in enforcement of law, a legally passed law is law unless the courts say different and presidents take an oath to uphold those laws. Just or unjust requires changing or overturning the law not violating their oath.

 

[Kutnupe14]

While presidents are given some latitude in enforcement of law, a legally passed law is law unless the courts say different and presidents take an oath to uphold those laws. Just or unjust requires changing or overturning the law not violating their oath.

So would you violate an oath, to man, in order to do the just thing? I would, with no reservations.

 

[Leadeye]

I figure it's posturing by people in the ATF to gain attention and possible promotion from an incoming Biden administration.

 

[CampingJosh]

While presidents are given some latitude in enforcement of law, a legally passed law is law unless the courts say different and presidents take an oath to uphold those laws. Just or unjust requires changing or overturning the law not violating their oath.

The president has the authority to declare a law unconstitutional and therefore unenforceable. I mean, that power is written in the Constitution in the same paragraph where it says that SCOTUS can do so.

The president also has the authority to issue pardons for federal crimes. If one wanted, he could make a law toothless by consistently pardoning anyone who fell afoul of that law.

 

[Alpo]

Thanks for starting the thread Ggreen. It seems impossible for some on INGO to pass up an opportunity to bash the current administration and turn every thread into a Trump vs Obama debate. While gun owners are fighting amongst ourselves our rights are slipping away. It’s time to unite and contact our elected officials and take a stand together.

Focus. Whilst y'all point fingers, your rights are going down the drain. There is a better way to use your fingers.

 

[edwea]

So when does this change take effect? Immediately? Am I a felon yet? Sorry, I'm not going to read back through the whole thread right now.

 

[foszoe]

Maybe you should read here more. Shows a lack of knowledge on the topic. Trump just did an EO Wednesday to try to rein this crap in...

Well I will hold my tongue until he makes this an example by using that order to throw out the leaders at ATF

 

[Ingomike]

Military, not the same as civil service, when it comes to the directives of the President.

The NSA is not military but officers do retain rank, probably for pensions...

 

[foszoe]

What exactly are "rifle sights"? Don't all loaded magazines (and unloaded for that matter) contribute to the weight of the weapon? Is 60 ounces heavy? The Colt-Walker is over 150 years old. "Front heavy imbalance"? Has this bunch ever seen a gun?

In some of the new letters, ATF has begun listing the following “objective design features” when making its evaluations:

• Incorporation of rifle sights;
• Utilization of "rifle caliber ammunition" (both 5.56mm and 7.62mm have been considered as such);
• Incorporation of “rifle-length barrel;”[SUP]1[/SUP]
• The “weapon’s heavy weight;”
• Ability to accept magazines that range in capacity from 20 rounds to 100 rounds, “which will contribute to the overall weight of the firearm”; and
• Overall length of the weapon which “creates a front-heavy imbalance when held in one hand.”

I hope rifle sights don't mean adjustable

 

[foszoe]

Have you got a link for the highlighted part? Since there are about 2.1 million federal jobs total, are you saying that before Trump there were only 100K? Call me skeptical.

I am with you. Hadnt heard that one....not that it will change a single vote here...

 

[foszoe]

Since this isn't in the political forums, I will refrain from political discussion and say thanks for posting. I will be contacting my overseers, I mean legislators and my president.

 

[CampingJosh]

So when does this change take effect? Immediately? Am I a felon yet? Sorry, I'm not going to read back through the whole thread right now.

You probably are, whether this has taken effect or not. The primary problem we have with government right now is that the laws and regulations are so expansive that it's genuinely impossible to know them all.

I don't give Trump credit for much (mostly because I don't think much of what he has done is good), but I will say that he has worked to reduce regulation.

As to when this change will take effect, I don't know.

 

[tbhausen]

See gglass' post, you're doing exactly what they want lol.

I was going to quote and agree with gglass, but this is even better.

 

[bwframe]

Hard to separate the TDS from the content in here. Glad the TDS got Paul back though.

Welcome back Paul!

 

[Ruger_Ronin]

This isn't about braces anymore

What he said. Might as well merge rooms.

 

[Tombs]

So when does this change take effect? Immediately? Am I a felon yet? Sorry, I'm not going to read back through the whole thread right now.

Does it really matter if you are a felon? If you aren't yet, it's only a matter of time until they decide some other arbitrary thing will make you a felon. With this letter the ATF has decided to willingly make at least half of gun owners, felons. You have no hope of following the law when the law is a goal post that changes this frequently.

Live like an American.

 

[edwea]

Does it really matter if you are a felon? If you aren't yet, it's only a matter of time until they decide some other arbitrary thing will make you a felon. With this letter the ATF has decided to willingly make at least half of gun owners, felons. You have no hope of following the law when the law is a goal post that changes this frequently.

Live like an American.

I was halfway joking with the felon bit, but it does matter some. My oldest boy was going to hunt this year with my ar pistol because he is proficient and comfortable with it and he wants to. If it isn't going to be legal, it affects him. If it takes effect in the future, his hunting season doesn't change. I understand that this is small potatoes in the larger picture. Next time I will use purple.

 

[Ggreen]

I was halfway joking with the felon bit, but it does matter some. My oldest boy was going to hunt this year with my ar pistol because he is proficient and comfortable with it and he wants to. If it isn't going to be legal, it affects him. If it takes effect in the future, his hunting season doesn't change. I understand that this is small potatoes in the larger picture. Next time I will use purple.

This is a determination that has already been used by the atf to stop imports of braced pistols. So technically now, as they already have began calling pistols sbr's and aow's. If you don't have a specific letter for your pistol they can deem it an unregistered nfa item at their discretion based on rules they make up and change as they see fit.

 

[edwea]

Thank you for that answer.

 

[rosejm]

Is it time to start burying them?
Or time to start digging them up again?

Asking for a friend...