Breaking: Report of man w/ shotgun and ISIS flag holding hostages in Australia

[dusty88]

Well considering that Australia has a gun related homicide rate of .11 per 100,000 people and the US has 2.83 per 100,000, that argument will fall on deaf ears over there. There is little support over there to change the gun laws. Why do these incidents always come to this discussion? It's like you are saying," If you allow the Australians to own guns this would not have happened." It's a significantly oversimplified argument. Giving the unwilling a gun will not automatically turn sheep into sheep dogs. Overcoming anti-gun culture takes more than the introduction of guns into it. We have this issue here in the US and we are awash in guns. It's not a hardware problem. A true sheepdog is never "unarmed" regardless of availability of guns. Look at Flight 93, a plane of "unarmed" sheepdogs. Also, being armed in a hostage situation does not automatically mean you can use it. There are too many factors involved that makes a simple statement like that meaningless.

Your points are valid, but so is the point of gun control.

How often do you see something like this, or any lone person committing violence on a large number of people, in a US location where citizens are allowed to carry?

Predators go after prey. A group of people in an upscale coffeehouse in a city, in a locality where no lawful citizen can carry, are likely "prey" to a guy like this.


Or let's make a more specific analogy. Would the dude try this in a cafe in rural America? If he did, would the news report likely look different?

 

[ArcadiaGP]

"The gunman is down." - Australian reporter

 

[printcraft]

"The gunman is down." - Australian reporter

Gee.... I hope he's not dead.... or we'll never know why he did it.

Hopefully explosions (bang) was a flashbang going off before they stormed the shop.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Dammit....


BREAKING NEWS: REPORTS OF 2 KILLED IN SYDNEY SIEGE. 7 NEWS

RT @cnnbrk: 2 dead, 3 in serious condition after the #SydneySiege, Australia's ABC reports
cnn.it/1ITi3ON

 

[HoughMade]

That's the biggest threat to us in the US from ISIS. They inspire others to act. I think ISIS is a little busy with their current war, but their influence can cross any border.

What is more dangerous and incites more terror, a discrete, organized force with a central command structure operating under military-style control or, for the sake of argument, over a billion people sharing a common philosophy that involves the righteousness of killing unbelievers, many of whom not only share this belief, but want nothing more than to carry it out , independently and without orders or control from anyone?

 

[mbills2223]

What is more dangerous and incites more terror, a discrete, organized force with a central command structure operating under military-style control or, for the sake of argument, over a billion people sharing a common philosophy that involves the righteousness of killing unbelievers, many of whom not only share this belief, but want nothing more than to carry it out , independently and without orders or control from anyone?

 

[ArcadiaGP]

They're definitely saying he's dead. Curious who else was killed, and how...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2873855/Gunman-takes-hostages-cafe-Sydney.html

BBC has a profile of him

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-30484419?ocid=socialflow_twitter


Here's a statement that he posted online yesterday.

Not embedding it, as is does contain religious material. If you choose to read the religious material that was posted in this short statement, you can click this link to access the picture.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B46JSCTCQAAjo-d.png

 

[printcraft]

T.......Here's a statement that he posted online yesterday..........

Always the same "justification"

 

[ghuns]

IBTITW

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

people sharing a common philosophy that involves the righteousness of killing unbelievers,

In other words - people.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

IBTITW

I don't know what this one means....

I wonder, did Man Haron Monis have his hands up? Can we pretend he did so this can be a bigger story? :P

 

[HoughMade]

In other words - people.

I will agree that the killing of those who do not agree is not exclusive to one group. I reject that it is universal or endorsed in any fashion, by the vast, overwhelming, majority of the adherents of two of the world's other large philosophical systems.

 

[ghuns]

I don't know what this one means....

In Before The In Thread Warning.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

In case there's any doubt that this is a "terror attack"

Terrorist told hostages to inform media that “this is an attack on Australia by IS” in recordings he made with the hostages

http://www.truthrevolt.org/news/breaking-hostages-video-inside-sydneysiege

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

I will agree that the killing of those who do not agree is not exclusive to one group. I reject that it is universal or endorsed in any fashion, by the vast, overwhelming, majority of the adherents of two of the world's other large philosophical systems.

I guess I should say that my intention isn't to denigrate; but mostly just to try to really look at and think about it.

Yeah, there are big differences in the practiced or publicly spoken endorsement/acceptability, but It's hard to tell if there really is a big difference in the hearts and minds of people. That's because none of us seem to be totally honest in all things, especially controversial things. And I'm mostly convinced that the biggest things that separate people from each other has more to do with circumstances and perspective.

 

[Birds Away]

So, no "workplace violence"?

 

[ghuns]

In case there's any doubt that this is a "terror attack"...

Huh, I figured they just screwed up his order.

 

[olhorseman]

What is more dangerous and incites more terror, a discrete, organized force with a central command structure operating under military-style control or, for the sake of argument, over a billion people sharing a common philosophy that involves the righteousness of killing unbelievers, many of whom not only share this belief, but want nothing more than to carry it out , independently and without orders or control from anyone?

Wow, over a billion people with the same philosophy. BTW, did you personally interview all one billion or was this a random survey with proper statistical controls?

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Huh, I figured they just screwed up his order.

Haha, also possible.. Though ISIS members' grey matter makes an excellent wall accent for a hipster coffee shop.

 

[HoughMade]

Wow, over a billion people with the same philosophy. BTW, did you personally interview all one billion or was this a random survey with proper statistical controls?

[edited to stay wide of the rules...but quoted before the edit anyway]

No. I did not. At this point, I'll just quote George Patton (or at least George C. Scott) and let anyone they want draw a parallel if they can:

"Rommel, you magnificent b*****d, I read your book!"