Can You Kill Him?

[GuyRelford]

How Well Do You Know Indiana Gun Law?

Here's the scenario: You're at home with your wife and children. It's 2:00 am. Two masked, armed intruders break into your home. One has a loaded AK, the other a loaded sawed-off 12 ga. shotgun.

After a few seconds, your trusty labrador hears them in the home, and alerts you with aggressive barking, just as the pair of thugs enters your master bedroom.

You pull your handgun of choice from your nightstand and deliver two perfect center-of-mass shots to the first intruder as he appoaches the bed, and you retire him from the fight immediately.

Upon seeing his partner crumple, the other bad guy throws down his shotgun and runs for the front door, which is still open. You clear the corner of the room in time to see him in the foyer still 3 feet from the front door, with your grandmother's silver collection under his arm, screaming like a baby and running like hell for the door. You drop him with another perfectly-placed shot to the back of the head.

Your security system has captured every bit of the event on video.

Do you have any legal problems?

 

[colt45er]

I am far from a lawyer, but I would say you would have legal problems with the guy running for the door.

It would be understood under the castle doctrine that the first guy intended to do you harm.....I guess under the castle doctrine since the other guy was still in your house it could be assumed he intended to do you harm as well..

 

[jd3772000]

If he has anything in his hand that my grandmother gave me and is bout to get away with it its a wrap for him.

But i do belive that you will have a problem with shooting the guy considering he was retreating, even though he was originally armed.

 

[phil]

I would assume "yes" since he is no longer a threat. That being said, I also believe you have the right to protect your person and your belongings (I may be wrong). If he had the your collection in his arms and you ripped his face off the back of his head then you would be protecting your belongings.

I am very interested to hear the legalities of this scenario!

 

[GuyRelford]

But he is still in your "castle." What say ye, INGOers?

This is where the rubber hits the road.

 

[j706]

Legal problems? Yup-I think the potential is there. I will not shoot a human being for property. Even if totally legal. IMO #2 in beyond the threat stage even though still inside the home.

 

[K_W]

Going by your username, I'm going to say... I'm in trouble for both somehow.

 

[Bigum1969]

I would hope to have the calm nerves to let the second guy continue on his way out the door. But I think you could build an argument to shoot him as well. Are you really sure he's not going to turn around? Are you really sure he doesn't have some buddies out front that he is going to flag down? You just don't know.

 

[HandK]

If you shoot the guy running away from you after he dropped his weapon that could deliver deadly force to you or a family member you are in trouble my friend big trouble, although you might argue that the heat of the moment and the stress you were under made you over react, you would still be charged with a crime and to time!

On the other hand if you are in your home and someone tries to break down your door to gain entry you have the right to use what ever force necessary to repel the intruder this includes deadly force.

 

[Slab]

Im gonna go with:
he is still in your "castle" and clearly endangering safety. fire away until the threshold.

edit to add that i hope the OP waits an hour or so to put up the correct legal answer.

 

[ewoodworth1]

you absolutely have problems! you can not shoot someone in the back, as stupid as that is... apparently it has something to do with the fact that they are not a threat to you if their back is turned.

 

[phil]

GunLawyer
What's the verdict???

 

[techres]

1. You are gonna be in more trouble if you speak to anyone without your lawyer being present first.

That being said:

2. If he retired from the fight, there is no reason for shooting him in the back of the head.

3. If you thought that he was moving for the cover of your front door frame in order to turn and continue the fight, perhaps your shot was well placed.

Which leads to the questions that matter:

4. What will the DA think?

5. What will the jury think?


What do I think? I think I would be in for a lot of explaining and better have proof that there was a continuing threat. Without a continuing threat there is potential legal jeopardy.

All that being said, if I genuinely thought there was a continuing threat to my family - withdrawing to better cover, moving to a second firearm, screaming for backup from the guy in the getaway car, etc. I would defend my family. At the same time, he can have the silverwear - I'd rather have his AK and shotgun.

 

[danmdevries]

Any way you paint it, you're in trouble.

Partner in crime is killed in action, what makes you think the one that got away isn't going to come after you?

Stop him as he retreats, might have legal issues, might not. However, you WILL without a doubt end up with a civil suit that will ruin you for life because as we all know, criminals have the right to our property, we do not.

If it were me, as the situation is laid out, they would both have projectile-induced hemorrhage. In the real world however, I don't think I would pursue the second. First is down, I'm staying where I'm at unless there are others in the home that may be at risk. I'm not running out because I don't know if there's one, two, or ten waiting.

 

[Jay]

A shot in the back will not aid in a self-defense case. I would not take the shot at the guy running out the door. Video has captured all things relevant to intent.

To specifically answer the OP's question...... yes, the guy shot in the back of the head may very well generate charges. I'm thinking manslaughter..... but I'm no lawyer.

 

[GuyRelford]

GunLawyer
What's the verdict???

Phil - I am going to let this play out for a LOT longer. I am very, very interested in seeing how my fellow INGOers answer this question. If folks enjoy this exercise, I can post a different "legal quandry" every week or so.

 

[mrjarrell]

After I erase the security tape, it's my word against his.

 

[possum_128]

First guy....threat present.....legal
second guy......threat over, he is retreating ie. breaking it off....you shoot , you go to jail.

 

[phil]

Phil - I am going to let this play out for a LOT longer. I am very, very interested in seeing how my fellow INGOers answer this question. If folks enjoy this exercise, I can post a different "legal quandry" every week or so.

That would be great! Especially if there are definitive answers. I think we all need to be caught up on the legalities of these issues.

 

[techres]

After I erase the security tape, it's my word against his.

Wow!

Guys, the only thing that could make this scenario worse is a history of internet posts that indicate a potential for whatever the DA would like to say about you.