Competition will get you.............

[Cynical]

No incoming fire but 15 other competitors watching and a timer running. Amusing to watch those who think they are good to go fold like a cheap lawn chair

That would be me. Every stage I go into it with a plan. As soon as the timer goes off I forget the plan and start banging away. I have gotten much better at not running my pistol dry but it’s not as easy as the really goods shooters make it out to. Be, the word humbling as mentioned up thread is truth.

 

[cedartop]

I have played various action pistol games since the 1970's. (I really liked bowling pin matches with my .44 haven't seen one in years) There is nothing that will show weakness in a shooter or his equipment like a course of fire set up by someone else and a stop watch. Even my "games guns" are pretty plain, not wanting to grow dependent on narrow focus, specialized gear.

The guys that run unlimited with all the specialized gear ARE amazing to watch.

I am already signed up. 2024 Pin Shoot.

 

[bwframe]

…kilt onnah skreetz!

Comps validate training. Shoot them. They’re fun (and eye opening). I’ve always been one to work through problems, but early this year I had the front sight take a hike mid-stage and it stopped me in my tracks. I didn’t know what to do without a sight, so I just kinda admitted defeat and took a 0 on the stage. If I’d just finished, I surely would have scored better than a 0.

I took that as a wakeup call, and now I’m working on training back up to my “old” standard of fighting through whatever comes up. I’d way rather hit such “walls” at a comp so I can focus my training efforts than have it happen when I don’t get a second chance…

I was ROing an unknown yet experienced young fellow at a USPSA match. Big complicated stage with foot pad swinger that had caused a couple of reshoots. This guy is quickly blasting through the stage, stomps the footpad and it fails to actuate the swinger. Without thought, the shooter reached out with his other foot and kicked the cable to actuate the swinger and proceeded through the COF.

Of course, I offered the guy a reshoot. He said, "Nah, we're good."

 

[Trapper Jim]

Bowling Pins start out as predictive targets and instantly turn into Reactive targets. Not so with paper on sticks.

 

[racegunz]

After reading the article from OP it brings back to memory what I tell people that carry a gun or want to carry a gun “ the stress you feel in competition and the level of self awareness it takes to deploy a firearm and stay safe with dozens of people in close proximity is the best training you can get” it’s also really fun!

 

[Basher]

I was ROing an unknown yet experienced young fellow at a USPSA match. Big complicated stage with foot pad swinger that had caused a couple of reshoots. This guy is quickly blasting through the stage, stomps the footpad and it fails to actuate the swinger. Without thought, the shooter reached out with his other foot and kicked the cable to actuate the swinger and proceeded through the COF.

Of course, I offered the guy a reshoot. He said, "Nah, we're good."

Problem solvin’ skeelz.

 

[bwframe]

After reading the article from OP it brings back to memory what I tell people that carry a gun or want to carry a gun “ the stress you feel in competition and the level of self awareness it takes to deploy a firearm and stay safe with dozens of people in close proximity is the best training you can get” it’s also really fun!

Never forget the sharp first time shooter at another USPSA match, clearly well practiced in the backyard. Second stage in was a memory stage that he shot exceptionally well.

Problem came at "unload and show clear." The gent ended the stage facing ~160 degrees to the line. He done the cool guy flip and caught the last round in the air with his weak hand, bringing the pistol muzzle down, pointed at the RO's belly (all of us in the squad behind him.)

 

[Michigan Slim]

I thought I was an OK CAS shooter. My 12 year old (at the time) daughter beat me in her first match. THAT made me better.

 

[Bosshoss]

You also learn how little you need actual sights on pistol to hit decent size targets. Lol

I never learned this. IMO anyone not using there sights will never become a decent competition shooter.
Accuracy by volume and spray and pray techniques doesn't really work in the shooting games or real life I suppose.

 

[Bosshoss]

Some interesting reply's.
First I would like to comment that we like to make fun of the overconfident egos the get crushed at their first match. This actually rarely happens. Most come to the match and do ok and find out they have a lot to learn and not just the rules of the game but their shooting techniques and maybe their equipment limitations.
This is what shooting competitions is all about learning and getting better and having fun.
Even the very best shooters had a first match and went through the same process.
It is also common to mistake someone's talent or ability with the equipment they are using. "So and so is great but they are shooting a race gun so that must be it". Really? do you really think that the gun is the reason someone is a good shooter?
Everyone shoots different guns to different levels but thinking that they are only good with that platform would be very wrong.
Shooting competition is a great way to learn gun handling and thinking on your feet. Every stage is different and every time you make a mistake it will be different and you will learn something every time you make a mistake and it will be fun on top of that.
You can shoot matches and decide to get serious and start training or just shoot the match and have fun and you will still get better but at a slower pace. That's the beauty of shooting competition.
USPSA has 6 classifications D,C,B,A,M,GM with D class being the lowest classification.
A USPSA D class shooter is better than 95% of the shooters that are going to the range and just shooting static paper from one position. This is after a few matches they have learned a lot about not only shooting but draws and reloads and movement and focus and watching the sights or finding that dot.
I have heard just about every excuse for why someone hasn't shot a match and excuses are a very important part of competition but save them for the match. We promise we won't laugh when you have a miss or tag a no shoot or forget a target so make sure you have your excuses memorized.
A funny story we had a new shooter on our squad and he had a disaster of a stage and he came up to me with a serious look on his face and said "I thought everyone would give me a hard time because I messed up. You guy's do that to each other so I was expecting it" I told him we are all friends and know each other well but sorry for the oversight and it won't happen again and by the way welcome to the squad. He smiled and was happy the rest of the day.

 

[Goodcat]

I never learned this. IMO anyone not using there sights will never become a decent competition shooter.
Accuracy by volume and spray and pray techniques doesn't really work in the shooting games or real life I suppose.

I don’t understand your reply. But if you are implying my statement of learning how little you need pistol sights to hit a mid sized pistol target after having a failure during competition, that somehow I am an inexperienced shooter using “spray and pray techniques” or advocate for this, your assumptions are miscalculated. Many advanced pistol courses have you tape your sights off entirely, purely to learn this concept of trigger control being 95 of shooting. Instinctive pointing is a very real thing, that combined with sights (preferably RDS), can make you a much faster and more accurate shooter. Everything else besides trigger control, including stance and grip are mechanisms for recoil management and follow up. If you haven’t shot pistol without sights out to 25 yards, I would highly encourage you to do so. But what do I know.

 

[Twangbanger]

I don’t understand your reply. But if you are implying my statement of learning how little you need pistol sights to hit a mid sized pistol target after having a failure during competition, that somehow I am an inexperienced shooter using “spray and pray techniques” or advocate for this, your assumptions are miscalculated. Many advanced pistol courses have you tape your sights off entirely, purely to learn this concept of trigger control being 95 of shooting. Instinctive pointing is a very real thing, that combined with sights (preferably RDS), can make you a much faster and more accurate shooter. Everything else besides trigger control, including stance and grip are mechanisms for recoil management and follow up. If you haven’t shot pistol without sights out to 25 yards, I would highly encourage you to do so. But what do I know.

At 5-7 yards target focus is the fastest method, if the targets aren't technical or small.

But out to 25 yards?

Yah

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I don’t understand your reply. But if you are implying my statement of learning how little you need pistol sights to hit a mid sized pistol target after having a failure during competition, that somehow I am an inexperienced shooter using “spray and pray techniques” or advocate for this, your assumptions are miscalculated. Many advanced pistol courses have you tape your sights off entirely, purely to learn this concept of trigger control being 95 of shooting. Instinctive pointing is a very real thing, that combined with sights (preferably RDS), can make you a much faster and more accurate shooter. Everything else besides trigger control, including stance and grip are mechanisms for recoil management and follow up. If you haven’t shot pistol without sights out to 25 yards, I would highly encourage you to do so. But what do I know.

FWIW, Ernest Langdon talks about making good hits out to 25y with no sights *until* movement is introduced. Then the wheels fall off. So it depends on what your goals are. If it's training for an event where you know where the targets will be, you are stationary, they are stationary, and nothing changes then muscle memory and slide indexing/etc will absolutely get you through the game if you're good enough.

But when you start moving and/or the target starts moving, muscle memory is out the window because it no longer is the same motion as you've spent all that time perfecting. A good index is certainly important, a base to build on, but folks need to be realistic about the limitations.

 

[Bosshoss]

I don’t understand your reply. But if you are implying my statement of learning how little you need pistol sights to hit a mid sized pistol target after having a failure during competition, that somehow I am an inexperienced shooter using “spray and pray techniques” or advocate for this, your assumptions are miscalculated. Many advanced pistol courses have you tape your sights off entirely, purely to learn this concept of trigger control being 95 of shooting. Instinctive pointing is a very real thing, that combined with sights (preferably RDS), can make you a much faster and more accurate shooter. Everything else besides trigger control, including stance and grip are mechanisms for recoil management and follow up. If you haven’t shot pistol without sights out to 25 yards, I would highly encourage you to do so. But what do I know.

You said "You also learn how little you need actual sights on pistol to hit decent size targets"
I disagreed.
Sorry if that hurt your feelings.
Your statement sounds like you don't need to use the sights and that is just untrue.
You are right about trigger control. It doesn't matter how well the sights/dot are lined up if you can't pull the trigger without disturbing the sight picture.
BUT it also doesn't matter how well you can pull the trigger if the sights aren't where they need to be you still won't hit the target.
Point shooting is rarely, rarely, ever used in competition. I see maybe 2 or 3 targets a year that can be shot at 2-5 feet and be point shot. If it is such a great idea to point shoot all the time the top shooters would all be doing it.
I don't even know what Instinctive pointing even is and how it relates to competition shooting.
I can't think of one good reason to tape up my sights and shoot at a target 25 yards away except to waste some ammo.

 

[Goodcat]

You said "You also learn how little you need actual sights on pistol to hit decent size targets"
I disagreed.
Sorry if that hurt your feelings.
Your statement sounds like you don't need to use the sights and that is just untrue.
You are right about trigger control. It doesn't matter how well the sights/dot are lined up if you can't pull the trigger without disturbing the sight picture.
BUT it also doesn't matter how well you can pull the trigger if the sights aren't where they need to be you still won't hit the target.
Point shooting is rarely, rarely, ever used in competition. I see maybe 2 or 3 targets a year that can be shot at 2-5 feet and be point shot. If it is such a great idea to point shoot all the time the top shooters would all be doing it.
I don't even know what Instinctive pointing even is and how it relates to competition shooting.
I can't think of one good reason to tape up my sights and shoot at a target 25 yards away except to waste some ammo.

I understand you misinterpreted what I said, that’s why I clarified. I am not saying it’s a good idea to shoot without sights, it’s not. I am not saying you should not use sights. You should use sights. If you continue to double down that you believe I’m saying people shouldn’t use sights, I don’t know what else to say, because you keep trying to emphasize that I am advocating for not using sights and prove me wrong, which is not true. It’s not what I believe, and it’s not what I said. I don’t know why you keep wanting it to be what I said.

I am saying that when your sights go down, you do learn that they aren’t necessary to hit, we’ll say, a reasonably sized target, like A zone at 10 yards. I do believe it’s a good idea to shoot a gun with taped sights as an exercise to figure out how it’s done, and to use the geometry of the firearm to figure it out.

I’m sorry if my words weren’t phrased properly, but you continuing to pretend like I believe everyone should be point shooting without sights, and this is just not true.