Cop abuses nurse for protecting patient and following the law

[Kutnupe14]

So if I have PC that a person is impaired above the legal limit, all he has to do is say "no I'm not" and that somehow makes it so?

***hiccup***. Yes!

 

[VUPDblue]

I thought that was an automatic go to jail card.

That's usually how it works...

 

[churchmouse]

That's usually how it works...

Do not pass go do not collect $200

 

[jkaetz]

Just to be most clear, you are saying that the ability to answer a question indicates the absence of impairment beyond the legal limit? I'm not sure I can wrap my head around that.

I think what he was going for is "Can an intoxicated person give concent?" Presumably building on some form of sound mind and body to understand and make an informed decision.

 

[VUPDblue]

I think what he was going for is "Can an intoxicated person give concent?" Presumably building on some form of sound mind and body to understand and make an informed decision.

Still not sure how the ability to answer a yes/no question translates to the lack of impairment of psychomotor skills....

 

[Gabriel]

And the uniformed cop there didn't even pull him aside to say hey bro let's think about this, your being a dumb **** .

I actually watched the video a few times to see if those other uniformed individuals were police and I agree with you (around here most hospital security are off duty or retired officers). I've seen a few officers on the verge of "losing it" on someone and stepped in before that happened. Cops are people too and, occasionally, might need someone to just tell them to knock it off or to leave the scene and have someone else take care of the situation. Usually all it takes is a quick "hey, dumbass." to correct the problem.

And trust me, if you're an a-hole to paramedics or nurses, there are some among them who will get back at you in ways you can't prove. Just a thought guys, but if someone has the authority to insert a catheter in you, be real nice to them.

I've seen the results of this on more than a few occasions. Lube is nice, but not necessary.

 

[Alamo]

Unfortunately, 1 idiot with a badge, can ruining for the exponentially higher numbers of officers that serve honorably. Very rarely do cops get credit for the things they do day in and day out.
Did you see the guy in Cobb, GA who told the scared driver "we only shoot black people." I understand it was sarcasm, but it's an absolutely idiotic thing to say, and definitely doesn't inspire confidence from the public.

In my military days, we there was a saying that "one dums**t erases a whole lotta attaboys." In this case there was more than one idiot, there were several cops standing around who did nothing while this guy threw a temper tantrum using his police powers. The fact that the department was seemingly soft-pedaling this expands it significantly beyond one idiot as well. That cop and his department took the general sympathy that law abiding people have for the difficulty of police work and wiped their butts with it.

And, Mr. "I AM THE LAW" further illustrated his penchant for using power provided to him to protect the public for his personal revenge tendencies:

As he stands in the hospital parking lot after the arrest, Payne says to another officer that he wonders how this event will affect an off-duty job transporting patients for an ambulance company.

“I’ll bring them all the transients and take good patients elsewhere,” Payne says.

Nice.
Video shows Utah nurse screaming, being handcuffed after refusing to take blood from unconscious victim - The Salt Lake Tribune

 

[Bill of Rights]

I had the displeasure of placing a 24Fr catheter in a patient recently. For reference, imagine a bic pen. Yes, about that big around and about the length of my forearm, from elbow to fingertip. He was not pleased, nor was I.... I still shudder at the thought of it.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[churchmouse]

I had the displeasure of placing a 24Fr catheter in a patient recently. For reference, imagine a bic pen. Yes, about that big around and about the length of my forearm, from elbow to fingertip. He was not pleased, nor was I.... I still shudder at the thought of it.

Blessings,
Bill

Thanks Bill...........Ugh

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I had the displeasure of placing a 24Fr catheter in a patient recently. For reference, imagine a bic pen. Yes, about that big around and about the length of my forearm, from elbow to fingertip. He was not pleased, nor was I.... I still shudder at the thought of it.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[Gabriel]

I had the displeasure of placing a 24Fr catheter in a patient recently. For reference, imagine a bic pen. Yes, about that big around and about the length of my forearm, from elbow to fingertip. He was not pleased, nor was I.... I still shudder at the thought of it.

Blessings,
Bill

 

[BugI02]

Eeeewww!

 

[BigBoxaJunk]

The real part about this that interests me is the appearance that the officer "arrested" the nurse as part of his counter-argument in favor of getting what he wanted, more so than because he lost his temper. I mean, it did look like he lost his temper, but maybe that's all part of selling the "arrest".

In one video, you can see another officer kneeling by the open car door talking to the nurse, in his words to explain why she should do (or have done) the blood draw. More than once he tells her basically that it was her fault that she got arrested. He said something like "......we were discussing it with you, but when you just keep saying no, no, no, no, then we come to this point". It seemed clear to me that the only thing that ended the calm discussion about the blood draw was when the officer grabbed her.

Why else would Mr. good cop so gently be kneeling there "explaining the situation" to the nurse if not to get her to re-think her refusal, given that she was now handcuffed and sitting in a police car?

Once the officer told her that she was under arrest, cuffed her, and put her in the car, the nurse should have stopped talking. What more needed to be said if the matter was closed and the officer was "done here" like he said. I don't think they got a sudden feeling of magnanimity and were just trying to sooth her nerves before they took her downtown. Are there any INGO Attorneys who would advise anyone to talk to police AFTER they are placed under arrest?

It makes one wonder how many times police officers do tell people "You're under arrest", not because they are under arrest, but as a tool to further their "investigation". The lack of reaction on the part of the other officers might indicate that it could be more common that I would have thought.

 

[VUPDblue]

I had occasion to talk a lot about this incident last night while I was at the hospital myself doing a warranted blood draw of an unconscious person. The consensus on both sides of the Cop/RN aisle is that the officer in this incident acted inappropriately and was poorly trained. The interesting part of the conversation came when we started talking about the other Officers who were just standing around and spectating while this was occurring. Initially it made me wonder, much like a lot of other folks, why they didn't jump in and try to calm Officer Arrestypants. This angle, which I believe is a valid one came up and should be considered: Officer Arrestypants was on a specialty unit that performs blood draws on impaired driving/SBI/Fatal traffic incidents. Those units are typically very small and the Officers involved highly trained. As a patrolman, when there is an incident where you need this kind of unit, they arrive and are in charge and often have much more expertise and knowledge than the street cops first on scene. So I say that to say this, perhaps the street cops on scene simply did not have the knowledge to understand that Officer Arrestypants was incorrect and making a bad arrest? Simply making a vocal arrest and being an ass may lack style points but is not in and of itself incorrect. Basically I'd hesitate to place too much blame on the uniform guys because they likely didn't understand the totality of what was going on.

 

[Fargo]

I had occasion to talk a lot about this incident last night while I was at the hospital myself doing a warranted blood draw of an unconscious person. The consensus on both sides of the Cop/RN aisle is that the officer in this incident acted inappropriately and was poorly trained. The interesting part of the conversation came when we started talking about the other Officers who were just standing around and spectating while this was occurring. Initially it made me wonder, much like a lot of other folks, why they didn't jump in and try to calm Officer Arrestypants. This angle, which I believe is a valid one came up and should be considered: Officer Arrestypants was on a specialty unit that performs blood draws on impaired driving/SBI/Fatal traffic incidents. Those units are typically very small and the Officers involved highly trained. As a patrolman, when there is an incident where you need this kind of unit, they arrive and are in charge and often have much more expertise and knowledge than the street cops first on scene. So I say that to say this, perhaps the street cops on scene simply did not have the knowledge to understand that Officer Arrestypants was incorrect and making a bad arrest? Simply making a vocal arrest and being an ass may lack style points but is not in and of itself incorrect. Basically I'd hesitate to place too much blame on the uniform guys because they likely didn't understand the totality of what was going on.

If this was an overzealous cop trying to A. obtain evidence of a crime B. against a suspect in a C. criminal investigation, I would be more open to the idea of "poorly trained".

Since, at least as it is reported, it looks like this was the opposite of A,B, and C, I don't know that I give him the benefit of the "poorly trained" explanation. This looks to me like something quite different.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

So I say that to say this, perhaps the street cops on scene simply did not have the knowledge to understand that Officer Arrestypants was incorrect and making a bad arrest? Simply making a vocal arrest and being an ass may lack style points but is not in and of itself incorrect. Basically I'd hesitate to place too much blame on the uniform guys because they likely didn't understand the totality of what was going on.

I've already said I'm fuzzy on the current state of our own state law. I woudn't step in as I'd figure you know more than I do on the topic. However, I have no problem addressing issues with searches, etc. that are within my area of expertise.

I think most laymen have zero idea how complicated procedural law becomes, and the fact it is constantly changing. Case law is always evolving, some lawyer is always trying some until-now-unheard-of twist, etc. Like any complicated body of knowledge, people become specialized. I can't do a DUI arrest today because the whole process has changed since I left the street. I read a different Juvenile Waiver form today then I did as a new detective because of one court's interpretation of wording on the old one, etc. etc.

Much like the nurse, if you're a cop who's going to object to an arrest by another cop...you better be right. Particularly if you don't outrank him/her.

 

[VUPDblue]

If this was an overzealous cop trying to A. obtain evidence of a crime B. against a suspect in a C. criminal investigation, I would be more open to the idea of "poorly trained".

Since, at least as it is reported, it looks like this was the opposite of A,B, and C, I don't know that I give him the benefit of the "poorly trained" explanation. This looks to me like something quite different.

If he is assigned to a specialty unit dealing with blood draws as they pertain to major traffic incidents and he was blissfully unaware of a 2 year old change of procedural law in that area, not only is he negligent, but he is also poorly trained because his department did not address the law change within the specialty unit dealing with such things.

 

[Fargo]

If he is assigned to a specialty unit dealing with blood draws as they pertain to major traffic incidents and he was blissfully unaware of a 2 year old change of procedural law in that area, not only is he negligent, but he is also poorly trained because his department did not address the law change within the specialty unit dealing with such things.

I am going to go out on a limb here, and say that I'm pretty certain he was trained that his police powers and the coercive abilities that they bring with them only apply to actually investigating crimes, not to some sort of fanciful chase for exculpatory evidence for another cop who is not even the target of a criminal investigation.

As I understand it, his own statement is that he knew he wasn't investigating a criminal suspect. His ability to even have a right to be in the hospital, much less force anyone to do anything is nonexistent at that point. This behavior fails on so many levels even without the McNeely case.

 

[VUPDblue]

I am going to go out on a limb here, and say that I'm pretty certain he was trained that his police powers and the coercive abilities that they bring with them only apply to actually investigating crimes, not to some sort of fanciful chase for exculpatory evidence for another cop who is not even the target of a criminal investigation.

As I understand it, his own statement is that he knew he wasn't investigating a criminal suspect. His ability to even have a right to be in the hospital, much less force anyone to do anything is nonexistent at that point. This behavior fails on so many levels even without the McNeely case.

Absolutely correct.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Hospital Bans Cops from Contact With Nurses After Tyrannical Arrest Caught on Video

Well this has absolutely no chance of backfiring.