Forward Assist - Do you "need" it. Why?

[Usmccookie]

Ill be the one to say it. I just think it looks the way i want my ar to look... No other reason for it. Never force a round that doesnt want to go. A wasted round is better than a wasted face.

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[Drail]

I think usually the problem is not the round. The problem is a filthy gun that got filthy because it runs on direct impingement. That's fine on a range. In a battle - not so much. Attempting to solve the filthy gun problem by adding a slush pump was beyond stupid. They did not even issue cleaning kits with the first M 16 rifles. They told the troops they were "self cleaning". They refused to chrome line the chambers because "it costs too much". But those were the days of Robert McNamara (may he burn in Hell forever). He got a lot of good men killed to save a few bucks. He was also they guy who started this madness of "why can't just one aircraft do everything?" Because it can't you twit. We are still fighting that stupidity today.

 

[rhino]

I think usually the problem is not the round. The problem is a filthy gun that got filthy because it runs on direct impingement. That's fine on a range. In a battle - not so much.

If it's wet with lube, it should fix most of that too. I haven't cleaned my AR for years, but it's always wet and it always works. Dirty and wet works better than clean and dry.

Most AR malfunctions are either the magazine or the bolt carrier group/bolt being too dry.

 

[Drail]

But you can't really run it that wet in a sandbox. And we seem to be crawling around in a lot of sandboxes today. But you are correct - most problems are magazine related.

 

[rhino]

But you can't really run it that wet in a sandbox. And we seem to be crawling around in a lot of sandboxes today. But you are correct - most problems are magazine related.

Uh... I'll defer to you if you've been there, but the people I know who were there (both military and contractors) have had much better luck running them wet in Iraq.

Either way, for *us* it's not an issue.

 

[GIJEW]

This thread in a round-about way shows up the main flaw in the M16/AR15 design: the charging handle is not a very good tool for manually controlling the ammo going either in or out of the chamber, whether it's closing the bolt while doing a chamber check or extracting a stuck case.

I'm NOT trying to make a case against a "tap rack bang" drill through. When I was in the regular infantry (IDF) we were issued the Galil, with it's stout charging handle, and were trained to cycle the bolt if it didn't fire. Having said that, once on maneuvers a soldier had a case head sheared off during extraction; the Lt. put the flash hider on a rock and used the charging handle to stomp a cartridge into the chamber and then turned it around, stomped on the handle to extract the torn case. Can't do that field improv with an M16. The AK design is just more rugged.

Anyway, using an M16A1 as a reservist, I never used the FA except for a chamber check and any malf's I had were mag related. With both rifle designs, we ran them lubed, even in the powder-fine dust of the Negev, without issues.

 

[Bigtanker]

Is KF correct?


[video=youtube_share;JHSSO-vJTSs]http://youtu.be/JHSSO-vJTSs[/video]

 

[tv1217]

I've maybe had one occasion where I could have tried it and I wanna say I just kind open palmed the left side and that did it.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Is KF correct?


[video=youtube_share;JHSSO-vJTSs]http://youtu.be/JHSSO-vJTSs[/video]

Yes, the Exploder is a silly and dangerous invention. However, Big Army buys guns by the warehouse. Remember the Golden Rule: he that has the gold makes the rules.

 

[Kirk Freeman]

"THIS" can be done with a finger with the original forward assist Stoner devised (the depression in the bcg).

The forward assist is Big Army's fidget spinner. People want a gadget, a geegaw, a button to push (we as primates love toys) and Stoner, with objection, gave them one.

The designer of the weapon saw no use for it. USMC and USAF did not want it, but Big Army was buying in warehouses so it exists. It's not needed; it is politics.

It can be harmful to you and the weapon. But if the fidget spinner makes people feel better, have at it.

The Exploder is just a toy, a talisman but Big Army knows the value of distraction.

 

[Robert Richardson]

I always smack it just out of habit.

 

[Fixer]

I have never used it on any of my AR's. I would not even think about trying to coerce a round into the chamber that didn't go freely. No means No!
If your AR doesn't go back into battery after a check, then there might be something else wrong that should be investigated. I wouldn't trust mine and my families life to a rifle that needed assistance in chambering rounds.

 

[DadSmith]

If you fire your AR or M4 enough it gets dirty and dry it will at times require a push on the FA. If you don't plan on being in a prolonged battle and having your rifle running dry and or dirty you may not need one. I've used them many time throughout my life.

 

[johntheplinker]

I use one on a regular basis. I coyote hunt with a AR. When I get to my hunting area, I ease a round into the chamber with the charging handle, then ensure the bolt is closed with the FA. The AR I use for that usually closes the bolt on its own, but the one time it didn't was all it took for me learn that lesson. I could use the carrier cut out, but with gloved hands it isn't that easy. That was another lesson learned the hard way.

 

[eddiehelm]

8 years in the Army multiple deployments and a good deal of shooting and might have used it once. I have several ARs with them and without but regardless they never get used. Better to just clear the malfunction and move on.

 

[eddiehelm]

I use one on a regular basis. I coyote hunt with a AR. When I get to my hunting area, I ease a round into the chamber with the charging handle, then ensure the bolt is closed with the FA. The AR I use for that usually closes the bolt on its own, but the one time it didn't was all it took for me learn that lesson. I could use the carrier cut out, but with gloved hands it isn't that easy. That was another lesson learned the hard way.

This^^ makes more sense to me though. I can see how it would come in handy for situations like this.

 

[1nderbeard]

I have a cheap AR in 7.62x39 that use for steel cased plinking. I required the FA to close the bolt, so that I could clear a malfunction. The charging handle wouldn't budge on a half closed BCG.
I could have probably pounded the charging handle to the rear but I was at a public range and didn't want to monkey around with a loaded rifle.

 

[Dean C.]

If a round will not go willingly into the chamber I want to get it out as fast as possible and a new round in the chamber to replace it. Nothing good comes from stuffing a case into the chamber forcefully

 

[Tombs]

I use it any time I feel like I mistakenly rode the charging handle.

It's probably accomplishing nothing, but I don't feel like it's causing a problem being there. In all honesty I'd rather have it and not need it, since it's pretty easy to ignore.
I know that's not the popular take of the day, but I think any firearm with a non-reciprocating charging handle should have some method to push the bolt forward. It sure would be nice to have on a G3/HK91 where it's a much bigger problem than it is on an AR. It's especially a problem there since there's no way to quietly close the bolt if you need to.
I know in a military context, silently closing the bolt isn't really a big deal, but in a civilian context it is a massive advantage.

As far as using the dust cover cuts to push the bolt forward, that's nice if the gun is cool or if you have gloves on. If you don't, then you're going to have a bad day.

 

[DadSmith]

I've noticed years ago a lot of guys would hit it after every mag change. It was out of habit. I wonder if some still do that.