Garfield Park Confederate Memorial--Its now an issue in our backyard

[Dddrees]

How many people knew it was there a week ago? Now it's more important than everything that should be in focus.

Yes, yes unfortunately this is the new thing.

 

[indiucky]

I could be wrong but I think this maybe the labels which were discussed which might not be helpful.

Lilly?

White?

Liberal?

Guilt???

Which one?????


He asked a question and I answered with nary an asterick, name calling or foul language...

 

[Trigger Time]

Im gonna pop in my CD of reenactment "songs of the south" today and celebrate my southern heritage. I'm not a kkk or any other fag group member. Nor have I ever enslaved or oppressed anyone of a different color or killed them for it, just like neither did the majority of the people who faught for the confederacy. I respect someone willing to lay down their life when their state calls for help. It wasn't about slavery especialy for the men and women on the battlefield who werr mostly too poor to own anything and anyone saying so is flat wrong.

 

[Trigger Time]

Lilly?

White?

Liberal?

Guilt???

Which one?????


He asked a question and I answered with nary an asterick, name calling or foul language...

You might as well go talk to a rock

 

[HoughMade]

Many of these memorials and statues stem from a time when there was much pain, division and anger over the war. They were memorials, sure, but an effort at unity, realizing that there was tremendous loss everywhere.

Even Germany, with anti-Nazi laws so strict that they don't have a freedom of speech even close to what we have here, remembers their war dead.

German military cemetery in Normandy:

This is a German U-Boat memorial, originally constructed for WWI, but with addition of WWII names.

http://uboat.net/history/moeltenort.htm

There are loads more.

 

[Lelliott8]

I could be wrong but I think this maybe the labels which were discussed which might not be helpful.

Okay, so let's describe it rather than label it. Leftism is the most violent ideology in the history of humanity, and you push it here in this forum with the most vile, smug assuredness of your moral superiority. You believe in a set of ideas that has resulted in the death of nearly 262 million people in the past century, yet somehow have convinced yourself, or were deceived into believing, that this is the path we should take. Don't run away this time, DDDDDDDreeees, because we would all like to discuss this and watch you attempt to defend your beliefs before we tear them down right in front of you again.

 

[foszoe]

I think the common foot soldier dies to defend the guy next to him, the people he loves at home, and his homeland. Wonder if there are any studies on this from the Nazi period? Sure there are the true believers, but I would believe the heart of the bell curve is an average joe doing the above.

 

[Jludo]

I think the common foot soldier dies to defend the guy next to him, the people he loves at home, and his homeland. Wonder if there are any studies on this from the Nazi period? Sure there are the true believers, but I would believe the heart of the bell curve is an average joe doing the above.

Average Joes are capable of horrendous things, I think is the lesson to be taken from the nazi period. Ordinary men could be made into executioners of the final solution. It showed that they didn't have to be nazi zealots to be made to do the worst work for the nazi zealots.

 

[Dddrees]

Lilly?

White?

Liberal?

Guilt???

Which one?????


He asked a question and I answered with nary an asterick, name calling or foul language...

All of them combined together.

 

[Jludo]

Okay, so let's describe it rather than label it. Leftism is the most violent ideology in the history of humanity, and you push it here in this forum with the most vile, smug assuredness of your moral superiority. You believe in a set of ideas that has resulted in the death of nearly 262 million people in the past century, yet somehow have convinced yourself, or were deceived into believing, that this is the path we should take. Don't run away this time, DDDDDDDreeees, because we would all like to discuss this and watch you attempt to defend your beliefs before we tear them down right in front of you again.

Speaking of smug assuredness of moral superiority.

 

[Dddrees]

Many of these memorials and statues stem from a time when there was much pain, division and anger over the war. They were memorials, sure, but an effort at unity, realizing that there was tremendous loss everywhere.

Even Germany, with anti-Nazi laws so strict that they don't have a freedom of speech even close to what we have here, remembers their war dead.

German military cemetery in Normandy:

This is a German U-Boat memorial, originally constructed for WWI, but with addition of WWII names.

uboat.net - Articles

There are loads more.

But as noted none of these memorials celebrate any of their generals.

 

[halfmileharry]

Ya do realize that if this crap keeps up then ALL the pigeons will vote Republican.
There's some sorry SOBs coming out of the woodwork.
They'll end up destroying this country so they don't have to work or put anything into it.
They'll get what they deserve.

 

[foszoe]

Average Joes are capable of horrendous things, I think is the lesson to be taken from the nazi period. Ordinary men could be made into executioners of the final solution. It showed that they didn't have to be nazi zealots to be made to do the worst work for the nazi zealots.

I think I said as much in the post you quoted

 

[HoughMade]

But as noted none of these memorials celebrate any of their generals.

Um....so? What thread are we in?

 

[Jludo]

I think I said as much in the post you quoted

Ah I thought it sounded like they were just soldiers in the trenches trying to survive, which I would argue is different from executing innocent people.

 

[Dddrees]

Um....so? What thread are we in?

Well if the Nazis and their generals and how we hold them accountable versus how we don't hold the Southern Generals accountable wasn't discussed in this thread I appolozize. I have been going back and forth a bit. But I swore it was brought up in this thread.

 

[rob63]

I wonder if we also need to destroy this memorial to one of those Confederate Generals, can it stay? I have no problem with cities moving statues around if they think it is appropriate, but history can be pretty convoluted when you are looking for simple ideas about who was good and who was bad.

Church window illuminates complexity of past | Webmin | roanoke.com

"Not slavery, nor war. Not segregation, nor civil rights. Not even fire could destroy the bonds forged more than 150 years ago between a group of Virginia slaves and a Confederate general.

It remains enshrined in a stained glass window honoring Lt. Gen. Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson that has looked out on the predominantly black worshippers of Fifth Avenue Presbyterian Church in Roanoke since before 1937, and is featured in a new illustrated history of the Civil War written by eminent scholar James "Bud" Robertson.

"There's nothing else like it," the retired Virginia Tech professor said of the relic and its story. "I fought like the devil to keep it in [the book], and the congregation will be so happy."

Depicting soldiers camped by a river, the window behind the altar is dedicated to Jackson, and features his dying words: "Let us cross the river and rest in the shade of the trees."

It was designed and ordered installed by the Rev. Lylburn Liggins Downing, the son of two former slaves who attended a Sunday school class taught by Jackson at Lexington Presbyterian Church in the 1850s.

In doing so, Jackson, then a Virginia Military Institute professor, skirted laws of the day banning education for blacks, Robertson said, and Downing's parents instilled in him gratitude for that act of courage.

The window has remained, cherished by a congregation that bore the humiliations of segregation, yet resisted efforts by civil rights activists to remove it, Robertson said."

 

[foszoe]

Ah I thought it sounded like they were just soldiers in the trenches trying to survive, which I would argue is different from executing innocent people.

It's why I referenced the bell curve. To acknowledge the various groups.

 

[Trigger Time]

Well if the Nazis and their generals and how we hold them accountable versus how we don't hold the Southern Generals accountable wasn't discussed in this thread I appolozize. I have been going back and forth a bit. But I swore it was brought up in this thread.

They're all dead. No one needs you all to do anything.
The left reminds me of these militia types that promote themselves to majors and captains but no one is a private lol. MUST FEEL IMPORTANT AND RELEVANT

 

[JTScribe]

Seems like historical revision to get rid of a memorial reminding us of the fact that the Union killed almost 2,000 POWs at Camp Morton.