So, you got nothing? Figures.
I know I got some green coffee beans for storage, even though I don't drink it myself, now the freeze dry people are coming out with cans of them, touting them as barter goods. I feel so far ahead of the curve!
Oh, I don't pretend to be a climatologist.
So? 100+ years of increasing CO2 concentrations and what do we have to show for it? Remember it wasn't all that long ago that a global cooling scare was the talk of the town. If the trend is so strong and the relationship is so clear, not a single person should have entertained the idea that the earth could be cooling.The evidence that they have is the amount of CO2 in the last century has spiked. And based on what C or CO2 contributes in reflecting solar heat back to earth, it definitely raises some concern.
No worries. Though, and we've had this discussion here before, the melting of some polar ice is irrelevant. We've also discussed the amounts of the water trapped in non-floating ice relative to the total volume of oceanic water. The difference is staggering and it strains credulity to think that any one can seriously argue a global increase in ocean levels on the order of "feet" when I seriously doubt it will amount to inches. There is a metric crap-ton surface area of water to spread out the piddly volume of ice that could potentially melt. Topography will largely determine whether a 3-6" rise in sea levels (and I feel I'm being generous) will actually translate to much in terms of loss of coastal land. I have my doubts about that as well. Not all places will feel the rise, if any, the same.My mistake on the CO2 in water, I meant to say water helps in getting rid of CO2. With the rising temp, water also absorbs heat, which in turn raises temp of the water. It might be minute but enough to show changes on polar caps.
I'd bet money we aren't not going have an extreme temp increase in a time frame that can't be handled by the mammal with a well developed cerebellum.What if there's rise in temp? If it's extreme enough, it can destabilize crops and the eco system. Just look at places where it's constantly hot. Hydration will be a problem.
The whole global warming farce is about control and control.For what its worth, these people are making these finding for the good of the planet, not taking over it. Our planet is taken for granted everyday. If it makes the future habitable for the next generation, why not find ways to do it, right?
We have over 100 years of global temperature data that show decreasing temperatures as well.Fact: We have over 100 years of global temperature data that shows rising temperatures. The data just doesn't lie.
We have historical data of 100's of years' worth of decreasing global CO2 levels.Fact: We have 100's of years worth of data of the rise in global CO2 levels (through atmospheric sampling and ice cores). They show a sharp rise in CO2 over the last century.
We have decades of data showing a decrease in CO2 and temperature.Fact: We have decades of data showing a rise in CO2 and temperatures in the worlds oceans (as well as rising acidification, which is another related issue).
This may be. But the argument then requires a premise to be set that influence is immediate. (Incidentally, I'd like to point out that solar output was lower in earth's earlier history. And CO2 levels were as high or higher than current levels.)Fact: We have solar data going back decades and there has been no increase in solar output.
I've said it before. Most of you have gotten the bulk of your climate science knowledge from political sources.
And getting your science information from political sources is like ordering a pizza at a Chinese restaurant. Sure, you might get one, just don't be surprised if it has a little squid on it.
And yet, there it is.
A hyperlink to the Birchers and Powerline.
Amazing.
Why not take a look at the facts?
Fact: We have over 100 years of global temperature data that shows rising temperatures. The data just doesn't lie.
Fact: We have 100's of years worth of data of the rise in global CO2 levels (through atmospheric sampling and ice cores). They show a sharp rise in CO2 over the last century.
Fact: We have decades of data showing a rise in CO2 and temperatures in the worlds oceans (as well as rising acidification, which is another related issue).
Fact: We have solar data going back decades and there has been no increase in solar output.
The facts are there for anyone willing to look at the data. What has most folks upset over the issue is its politicisation. The politicians have muddied the water and the talking heads that too many people are willing to listen to have, as usual, gone into opposition mode. It's the politics that are diverting people from the facts. The permafrost in Alaska is melting, releasing even more greenhouse gas (methane) into the atmosphere. Eventually, if we do not take the decision to actually tackle the problem it will enter a loop and we may well find ourselves at a point of no return. Our children and grandchildren will be the ones suffering for our refusal to accept the facts. We need to look beyond the politicians and their rhetoric and get with the people who are actively fighting this problem. If not we are going to be screwed. We need to change to cleaner power. We have lots of options at our disposal. Wind, water, solar, nuclear, geothermal....all are at our disposal and are carbon neutral. Coal does have to take the hit, sorry to say. But as someone who's lived downwind of coal generating plants of the type China uses, I won't be sad to see it go. My local plant (about 2 miles up the road) made the switch to NG and it's been a blessing for the air quality. Can't say my bills went up any more either. We can do it. We just have to have the will.
And, one last thing. Don't confuse climate with weather. All too many people in this thread are doing it. They are not the same.
But I thought we were talking about electricity generation....
[video=youtube_share;H_iGaQglnKg]http://youtu.be/H_iGaQglnKg[/video]But I thought we were talking about electricity generation....
Somewhere, the ghost of P. T. Barnum is shedding a sentimental tear.
But they sound so confident in their denial, don't they? Never an ounce of doubt when discussing one of the most complex subjects known to man.
Yes, it's enough to convince me in the absence of any other contrary evidence based on data. We know what CO2 does in an atmosphere. Do you have any other variables that influence it that might account for the rise in temperature? The current evidence is really incontrovertible. You have any other suspects that would account for the rise?
Interesting point.
I've expressed plenty of doubt. I have no idea what factors have affected global climate for the past few centuries. CO2 seems to be a factor. The significance of this factor will never be quantified. The significance of the human contribution to this factor will never be quantified.
The only folks simplifying one of the most complex subjects known to man are the ones claiming that it must have all been caused by man-made CO2.
This kind of argument right here:
I've seen several interesting statistics showing a society where gun control legislation was enacted and crime rates dropped simultaneously.
Should I assume that gun control caused the crime rates to drop, and wait to provide an alternate cause? Of course not.
This is no less absurd. We will never understand all of the variables of human behavior enough to make this sort of assumption. Predicting or explaining global climate trends is not really any less complicated.
FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, in fact they ARE at the service of people who are trying to take over the economy, and the good of the planet has nothing to do with it. What they say is wrong, it is false, it is in error, it consists of lies. Doing this crap just in case it's the right thing is almost as bleeding stupid as doing it knowing full well it's based on lies. The temperature of our atmosphere hasn't risen in the last 15 years despite the horrific predictions of the climate cultists, because the high priests of the climate cult have been LYING. And you've been believing them, which makes you a fool. The reason is a different debate entirely, one I won't address here. Since the atmosphere isn't getting hotter, it's almost entertaining to watch the cultists chase around trying to find where the supposed heat is hiding, get stuck in the ice that's presumed to be melting, get eaten by the polar bears that aren't dying. Did you know the polar bear population projections were ENTIRELY MADE UP and they're in fact thriving? It was a LIE. It was one small lie of many that you have been told, and upon which you've based an entirely invalid opinion. I don't care what you think of me, because I have no respect for your opinion. I've totally had it with the stupidity of the climate cultists, and I'm not gonna pull any punches anymore. Think the climate is in crisis? You are effin STUPID. Think it's humanity's fault? HOW DO YOU EVEN REMEMBER TO BREATHE? I need to go soak in my hot tub. This stupidity tasks me.
Correlation does not equal causation. Nevermind that you're only using data from a minuscule section of the planet's life.Why not take a look at the facts?
Fact: We have over 100 years of global temperature data that shows rising temperatures. The data just doesn't lie.
Fact: We have 100's of years worth of data of the rise in global CO2 levels (through atmospheric sampling and ice cores). They show a sharp rise in CO2 over the last century.
Fact: We have decades of data showing a rise in CO2 and temperatures in the worlds oceans (as well as rising acidification, which is another related issue).
Fact: We have solar data going back decades and there has been no increase in solar output.