gun pawn

[hopper68]

houghmade
No guns for felons. Most of us are familiar with the rule that a convicted felon cannot possess a gun. The federal rule is found in one of the main firearm statutes, 18 U.S.C. § 922(g)(1). ... As a result, DWI convictions do not trigger the federal gun ban.

Yeah houghmade, you should ask a lawyer before trying to give legal advice!

 

[Sniper 79]

Nothing personal. Only business. Double the price you paid the guy for it and it goes in the for sale rack.

End of thread.

 

[shootersix]

no they are required to fill out and get an OK before they get the gun .Just like at a gun store .All FFL licensed persons must have a 4473 filled out by the person redeeming or buying a fire arm, and it must be OK by the feds , or the FFL holder has committed a felony

the reason I asked, is pre means before, so prepawn would mean before pawn, so if the question is not for returning a gun, what does "prepawn" mean?

 

[russc2542]

the reason I asked, is pre means before, so prepawn would mean before pawn, so if the question is not for returning a gun, what does "prepawn" mean?

It may be an option to run the 4473 before the shop takes the gun to check if it can be returned after the contract to prevent exactly the situation described in the OP. If run before the shop takes possession the shop doesn't have to hold the gun if the owner gets denied: because they haven't taken possession of it, they aren't transferring it back.

 

[Roland of Gilead]

It may be an option to run the 4473 before the shop takes the gun to check if it can be returned after the contract to prevent exactly the situation described in the OP. If run before the shop takes possession the shop doesn't have to hold the gun if the owner gets denied: because they haven't taken possession of it, they aren't transferring it back.

That would eliminate the chances of the pawn shop keeping a valuable and collectable gun for pennies on the dollar, that's not good for business.

Purple somewhere^

 

[russc2542]

That would eliminate the chances of the pawn shop keeping a valuable and collectable gun for pennies on the dollar, that's not good for business.

Purple somewhere^

Said nothing about how often the option's used. Obviously it's not well published and besides it's just a guess based on the wording.

Sounds like the OP's story the shop felt bad about it and might have done better to do so since they gave the guy his pennies back.

 

[Beemer]

I worked at a pawnshop for several years. I am not 100% positive with weapons, but with all other items whoever has the pawn ticket is legally allowed to pick up the item. For example if I pawn a guitar and I know I can not pay to pick it up I can give you the ticket and you can go and retrieve it. I believe the same is true of the rifle, he could have just given the ticket to someone else, they go in pick it up. Again, legally he would not be allowed to get it back, but someone in the family could. Just my 2 cents.

 

[HoughMade]

Yeah houghmade, you should ask a lawyer before trying to give legal advice!

Honestly, I don't even know what he was responding to, my incredulity (expressed in gif) about asking for morality advise from a lawyer (morality and legality at times intersect and often don't....but why consult a lawyer regarding "morality") or my statement that ownership and possession are 2 different things....which they are.

 

[shootersix]

I worked at a pawnshop for several years. I am not 100% positive with weapons, but with all other items whoever has the pawn ticket is legally allowed to pick up the item. For example if I pawn a guitar and I know I can not pay to pick it up I can give you the ticket and you can go and retrieve it. I believe the same is true of the rifle, he could have just given the ticket to someone else, they go in pick it up. Again, legally he would not be allowed to get it back, but someone in the family could. Just my 2 cents.

that's a touchy subject, because the original person who pawned it and is the rightful owner, cant own it, so if he gives the ticket to someone else to pick up, AND the shop gives it to them, knowing the owner cant have it, it could be a straw purchase, because they returned the gun, knowing that the person who picked it up, will return it to the original owner.

its the same as the lady, playing on her phone while the husband looks at guns asks all the questions, and when the time comes to fill out the 4473. hubby call's the wife over to fill out the paperwork!

let me tell you a story (yes this happened)
a person special ordered a gun, came in to pick it up and had lost his billfold along with his drivers license, when we told him we have to see it(the license) he got upset, and went to get a temp license, well a temp license wont work for a gun sale, when we told him that he got mad and sent the wife to pick it up, well at that point its a straw sale! (at least till he gets his real license), because he couldn't buy a firearm, and knowing that she was going to give it to him, we could be in trouble. (this was a few years ago, and I think he filled out the paperwork, got delayed, and between the sale, and when he was supposed to pick it up, is when he lost his billfold, and we have to see his license again)

I don't work in a pawn shop, but do work in a gun shop, and if this happened to me, i'd pass the whole mess over to the person who owned the shop! that's why they make the big bucks!

 

[HoughMade]

I am familiar with the law about felons not possessing a gun. Is there a law that says a felon cannot own a gun?

 

[shootersix]

I am familiar with the law about felons not possessing a gun. Is there a law that says a felon cannot own a gun?

is there a difference between owning and possessing?

 

[Cameramonkey]

is there a difference between owning and possessing?

IANAL but I'd say yes.

I own a minivan. My wife drives it. At this time I am the owner and do not possess said van. She has possession of said van.

 

[HoughMade]

is there a difference between owning and possessing?

There is. Possession as to personal property is the actual ability to physically access and control something.

Ownership is simply....ownership. You are the legal owner. Just as you can possess something you do not own, you can own something you do not possess.

Oh, and as an example, ask the guy getting divorced who's wife is living in the house about the difference between ownership and possession. He'll know the difference.

 

[shootersix]

There is. Possession as to personal property is the actual ability to physically access and control something.

Ownership is simply....ownership. You are the legal owner. Just as you can possess something you do not own, you can own something you do not possess.

Oh, and as an example, ask the guy getting divorced who's wife is living in the house about the difference between ownership and possession. He'll know the difference.

ok gotcha!......BUT let me ask you a question, when the person the op saw, comes into HoughMade, Cheatem, and Howe, law office, how do you handle the case? I know your a lawyer, and I guessing on your partners names (lol kidding I don't hate EVERY lawyer)

 

[WebSnyper]

ok gotcha!......BUT let me ask you a question, when the person the op saw, comes into HoughMade, Cheatem, and Howe, law office, how do you handle the case? I know your a lawyer, and I guessing on your partners names (lol kidding I don't hate EVERY lawyer)

I'm guessing as far as the contract portion of the dispute, he would ask for the Pawn contract, which hopefully spells out these aspects and then compares it to pertinent Indiana law, etc and sees if he has any recourse.

 

[HoughMade]

I'm guessing as far as the contract portion of the dispute, he would ask for the Pawn contract, which hopefully spells out these aspects and then compares it to pertinent Indiana law, etc and sees if he has any recourse.

Well, there's that...and it's pretty important.

The guy who owns the gun can sell it or give it to whoever he wants who is a "proper person" and with sufficient paperwork showing that the proper person owns what was that person's interest in the gun, with a 4473 and paying what the shop is owed, the pawn shop should release it to that person. If need be, bring a small claims action ($6,000 limit in Indiana, so even a pretty rare model '94 should come in under that) and get a court's blessing- just so the felon never takes possession.

i am just spitballing here on a hypothetical and real gun lawyer may know a better way or know why this wouldn't work. I am not a gun lawyer, nor am I giving anyone legal advice on this situation- purely hypothetical. The nice part about the small claims route is that the shop now had a judge telling them what they need to do...which would seem to add a measure of protection. Of course, an opinion from the ATF wouldn't hurt either.

 

[walt o]

Hope this will help
As spelled out in Chapter 44 of Title 18 of the United States Code (U.S.C.), federal law bans convicted felons from possessing firearms or ammunition. (The U.S.C. is a compilation of congressional laws organized by topic and subtopic: Title 18 defines federal crimes and criminal procedure, and Chapter 44 (Sections 921-931) covers firearms.) It sounds straightforward enough, but when you unpack how that federal law works and factor in the complexities added by state laws and high court rulings, a much more complicated picture begins to emerge.

According to Section 922(g)(9), no one "who has been convicted in any court of a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year" may own or possess a gun. This rule covers all felonies, but does not apply to state misdemeanors that carry less than a two-year sentence. It also exempts several kinds of felonious white-collar crime, as well as felony convictions handed down in foreign countries [sources: 18 U.S.C. § 921; 544 U.S. 385;
Another question asked can he give the gun to a relative.YES but in this case his only living relative lives in the same house as the felon so he cant live in the house with a gun or ammunition.
Sure, federal law bans felon firearm possession, but what does "possession" mean? Does the gun have to be on your person (actual possession), or can the feds bust you merely for having one in your house or car? The answer is both.
Constructive possession occurs when a person does not physically possess something but knows about it and can control it. Like actual possession, it can land you in hot water [sources: Black's Law Dictionary; Rhode Island Probation].