Home Defense and Kids...

[Hoosierkav]

There are plenty of solutions for pistols, not so many for a shotgun or rifle. It would be nice if there were a bedside safe/case designed for the long gun--slender, push button/biometric. Even being able to retrofit a cheap Stack-on with a push button would be an option (though the way those locks clang, it would be just as noisy as racking the gun...)

Edit: Just found this

The Sentry safe is nice, but clearly they are going after the demand side of the equation with the price.

 

[JMWetzel89]

Growing up my dads guns were never locked up to this day he does not have a save. I always new where they were, but my dad tought me about them. Took me shooting to show the power they have and explained to me not to ever mess with them unless he was there. This worked for me, I give great credit to it because the one and only time I told my dad "no" when he told me to do something, he broke my nose.

My first child is due in less than a week, I have a safe my HD guns are not in it. They are out of sight. I plan to do the same as my dad did. Teach and demonstrate. I will not be breaking any noses though. A sore rear end sends the same message in my experience.

 

[Hoosierkav]

The issue goes beyond simply training kids in the way they should go... some kids/adults have substantial impulse/aggression issues, and it would be unconscionable to leave a weapon where they could grab it and do something without thinking about cause:effect.

 

[Cameramonkey]

The issue goes beyond simply training kids in the way they should go... some kids/adults have substantial impulse/aggression issues, and it would be unconscionable to leave a weapon where they could grab it and do something without thinking about cause:effect.

Or what about the neighbor kid, cousin, etc that come to play that are NOT instilled with that understanding.

Failure to keep guns LOCKED UP (and not just hidden... they WILL find them) is outright negligence.

 

[88GT]

I agree with you that when your weapon is not under your control and there are younger children around it should be locked up. There is a difference between educating your children with safe firearms handling and not teaching them how to be safe. Personally I prefer my son to know how to properly deal with firearms when I'm not around. I also want him to be self-assured that he will not harm himself or another if he followed the rules of being around firearms.

Taking the mystery out of something and laying the foundation for behavior helps your children when they are not around you.

Why?

That's really dangerous, I really, honestly hope I don't read a news article about you.

OP - Kids change things. You can't go to the movies anymore, restaurants are a challenge, and you HAVE to lock your guns up. To leave it high on a shelf, especially the way kids can climb is inviting an accident.

I have a 1 1/2 year old boy, they're all locked up. 1 in a quick-combo safe in my night stand with the big guns in a big safe upstairs.

And to people who say "just expose them to guns and they won't be curious" is a load of bullcrap. LOCK 'EM UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Or what about the neighbor kid, cousin, etc that come to play that are NOT instilled with that understanding.

Failure to keep guns LOCKED UP (and not just hidden... they WILL find them) is outright negligence.

To you all: explain to me how generations of families raised children without firearms accident and no safe to lock up the guns.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

To you all: explain to me how generations of families raised children without firearms accident and no safe to lock up the guns.

They died for not wearing their helmets while riding their bicycles long before they found dad's gun?

 

[Dobber]

COMPLETELY off topic.....
I built a bed frame for our bed recently. I used these plans which are an adaptation of queen bed plans that I got when I googled "king size storage bed plans." After I built the base for our new king mattress I built my own headboard.

The headboard has a shelf just high enough to provide a backstop (pun intended) for our pillows which also provides for the space of three cubbies. I put a power strip in there and also cut a hole for our iphone cords to come out of. REALLY convenient. On the sides I got creative with some additional "decorative" moulding outlining "empty space" on both sides of the headboard. I was going to make more cubbies but we don't have anything 28" long or 10" tall that we'd want to keep stored in a 7" wide space....so I just decorated the front, top and neglected to install those ugly visible hinges which anybody can associate with a door.

Best of luck finding a safe and unassuming place close to where you sleep to store your firearms. Let me know if you find a place....I'm still looking. Or, you could always PM me if you want to share specific ideas of special places to hide weapons.

-Dobber

 

[ljk]

Why?
To you all: explain to me how generations of families raised children without firearms accident and no safe to lock up the guns.

do you want take your chances? have you seen much of the signs of personal responsibility among today's youth? I work with 17-20 year old ones, I can tell you, not much.

it only takes a fraction of a second for something bad to happen which you would regret for the rest of your life. they are kids, you can't just trust them on this. yes, adults do stupid things, but kids do more stupid things.

I understand every kid is different. bottom line is, I will be responsible for my kids' actions. I let my kids be kids and I take care of the adult matters.

Justin Stanfield Thomas' death is just another sad reminder.

 

[88GT]

do you want take your chances?

Take my chances with what? The same chances that millions of families took before there were locking devices available?

have you seen much of the signs of personal responsibility among today's youth? I work with 17-20 year old ones, I can tell you, not much.

I'm not raising today's youth. Just my own sons. The shortcomings of other parents is not my concern.

it only takes a fraction of a second for something bad to happen which you would regret for the rest of your life. they are kids, you can't just trust them on this. yes, adults do stupid things, but kids do more stupid things.

How do you know I can't trust them? Have you met my children? Do you know the rules/discipline that we have enacted to teach them safety and responsibility?

I understand every kid is different. bottom line is, I will be responsible for my kids' actions. I let my kids be kids and I take care of the adult matters.

I let my kids play, if that's what you mean by kids being kids. However, I also expect them to follow the rules and be responsible for the obligations they have been given. The two are not mutually exclusive. Perhaps one of the reasons we have accidents is because we don't take the time to expect more of our children. I'll ask it again: how did generations of families make do without locking devices for their firearms?

 

[Cameramonkey]

I'm not raising today's youth. Just my own sons. The shortcomings of other parents is not my concern.

Until the other parents' stupid ass kids finds your "hidden" gun before your well trained kid(s) can stop them... such as a game of hide and seek when they choose to hide under the bed with the 870 locked and loaded...

Today is not yesterday. Guns are not as ubiquitous as a hammer, Wii, cell phone, etc for everyone like it used to be when EVERYONE had a shotgun because, well, thats what you used to help put food on the table.

Times change.

 

[ru44mag]

Well my wife and I have no kids of our own, but my nephews come over a lot. They have been coming to spend the night and weekends with us since they were around 8 years old. In my younger days I worked armed security for 18 years so I always had a gun handy. Now days with all the home invasions happening even in broad daylight, I open carry at home ALL the time. When going away I CC so as not to make others nervous or cause a situation with some bada$$ redneck saying "look at the show off with big ole gun" or some crap like that. Bottom line is, your kids are used to seeing you armed because of your job. Why un-arm yourself at home? Carry ALL the time. Teach them gun safety, but carry even at home. You cant get any faster path to your weapon, than carrying all the time.

This would be my solution during the day. But I don't keep a pistol/revolver on me while I sleep. It's on my nightstand.

Take my chances with what? The same chances that millions of families took before there were locking devices available?


I'm not raising today's youth. Just my own sons. The shortcomings of other parents is not my concern.


How do you know I can't trust them? Have you met my children? Do you know the rules/discipline that we have enacted to teach them safety and responsibility?


I let my kids play, if that's what you mean by kids being kids. However, I also expect them to follow the rules and be responsible for the obligations they have been given. The two are not mutually exclusive. Perhaps one of the reasons we have accidents is because we don't take the time to expect more of our children. I'll ask it again: how did generations of families make do without locking devices for their firearms?

I agree when it concerns (your) children, but what do you do when their ignorant friends come over. Not trying to be harsh about your kid's friends, but do their parents teach them, the way you teach your own children. I have started locking everything that is not on me unless It's just my wife and I at home by ourselves. Then the safe is usually open because I'm in and out of it so much. I lock it before I go to bed at night. We never had children of our own, but have lots of neices and nephews. When they got to a certain age, I taught them, the best I could with the limited time I had, not being my own. As far as history goes, most taught their children the way you do now. As far as present day goes, you are a minority.

 

[88GT]

Until the other parents' stupid ass kids finds your "hidden" gun before your well trained kid(s) can stop them... such as a game of hide and seek when they choose to hide under the bed with the 870 locked and loaded...

Today is not yesterday. Guns are not as ubiquitous as a hammer, Wii, cell phone, etc for everyone like it used to be when EVERYONE had a shotgun because, well, thats what you used to help put food on the table.

Times change.

You are making a crapload of assumptions that have no basis in fact.

I agree when it concerns (your) children, but what do you do when their ignorant friends come over. Not trying to be harsh about your kid's friends, but do their parents teach them, the way you teach your own children. I have started locking everything that is not on me unless It's just my wife and I at home by ourselves. Then the safe is usually open because I'm in and out of it so much. I lock it before I go to bed at night. We never had children of our own, but have lots of neices and nephews. When they got to a certain age, I taught them, the best I could with the limited time I had, not being my own. As far as history goes, most taught their children the way you do now. As far as present day goes, you are a minority.

I never said I don't secure them at all. I said it was not inherently negligent for firearms to be unsecured simply because children were present.

You'll notice the evolution of the argument has gone from 'children = locked guns" to "not your children = locked guns." Why do you think that is?

 

[Hohn]

88GT gets me thinking about something:

We should probably be careful that we aren't condemning other gun owners by granting the Liberal premise that guns are inherently dangerous, rather than the view of many gun owners that firearms are inanimate tools no more dangerous than the person using them.

So I think we have to grant 88's point that un unsecured firearm is NOT *inherently* a safety risk, even with kids in the house. A gun with no ammo is a fancy pointing object. Ammo with no gun is similarly innocuous.

We all learned back in the day that fire needs three things: oxygen, fuel, and heat. Take away any of those things and you have no fire.

Similarly, every firearm mishap has common ingredients which, if any of them is removed, would have prevented the mishap. Every ND or AD has a gun, some ammo, and a person. Take away any of those and you have complete safety 100% of the time.

So if a person decided that they can do a great job of managing the "person" element of the recipe, then they not necessarily manage the gun or ammo elements.

For me, though, the availability of relatively certain preventions for the gun or ammo make managing the person ingredient the less desireable approach. No matter how good I am with my kids, stuff still happens.

And yes, 88-- in the old West, kids died via AD/ND. Grownups did, too. I don't think that human nature has changed and that the same imperfect people now were perfect people back then. Perhaps back then the risk was more acceptable because many folks lived in places where the the law was whatever they could personally enforce, or they liven in proximity to wild animals that posed existential threats.

I don't think that it's necessarily valid to look back 150 years because the relative tradeoffs have changed in weight on either side. One could argue that modern weapons are more lethal than older ones-- after all, a .357 mag packs a good bit more punch than a blackpowder .45 Colt SAA. One could also argue that medical technology has drastically increased the survivability of a GSW and that it's now safer than ever to leave a gun out and unsecured.

And so it could go, back and forth.

But let's not sit in judgement of other gun owners using Liberal reasoning....

 

[ljk]

Take my chances with what?

your answer:

My 2 boys are 6 months and 3 years...

 

[cintile]

I have a quick access safe under my bed. I pull it out and open it when I go to bed, and then close it when I get up. This was the best thing I could come up with, to keep guns secured from child but still be able to get to it quickly in the event that I needed it ..

 

[Tyler-The-Piker]

mostly carry but sometimes quick access safe = when at home, during the day, when my daughter is around.

HD pistol is hidden within arms reach = when I'm in bed
(easily accessible, affixed holster- securely screwed into the back of the nightstand)

 

[Street Howitzer]

My wife and I have a 2yr old daughter. My daily carry pistol is in a drawer she can't reach yet with a magnetically activated baby-proof latch. The HD shotgun is hidden 2 steps from our bed in the master closet in a custom cabinet. When I take my pistol off each night and put it in the drawer, I open the door to the cabinet and leave it open. When I get up in the morning, I close the door on the cabinet. This method will work until she's big enough to be out of her crib into a "big girl bed". Then I'll have to keep the cabinet closed, or switch to a biometric activated latch or something.

 

[mjpell]

I will be doing that as soon as my son is old enough. He's only 4.

We started our son at age 4 1/2 with a BB gun. By 6 he was shooting a .22 rifle and at 7 a .22 hand gun. All with strict supervision of course. Now at age 14, he's very capable of safely handling any of our firearms (although still only with adult supervision).

Ditto on the comments above, we shoot as a family on a fairly regular basis, so his curiosity factor is greatly reduced. And we hunt, so he knows what death and destruction is on the recieving end. I believe these to be valuable life lessons.

 

[Jack Burton]

My headboard came with a built in hidden compartment. A good smack on a decorative panel releases the magnetic catch and my hd gun has been behind there for years. A quick toss of the room such as a burglar will do will never reveal it but the gun is as handy as it it was sitting on the dresser top.

Perhaps you can call a custom cabinet maker and see what he can do for you. Putting a false side in a dresser or headstand is not that hard for someone who knows what they are doing. Older kids still need to be gun proofed with this method "just in case" but the actual chances of them stumbling across the firearm is pretty slim.

There are numerous examples on the 'net also of furniture that hides firearms.