How a Bachelors degree only gets you $12.00 an hour

[HoughMade]

$5/hour? You could buy a Colt Peacemaker after 3 hours and 10 minutes in those days

I shopped in the wrong places in 1992.

 

[rkwhyte2]

I shopped in the wrong places in 1992.

I'm pretty sure Kelly confused you with Churchmouse.

 

[HoughMade]

Trade school is a great option for many people. Probably way more people than choose it.

However, that cartoon is misleading on both ends and after 7 years of post high-school education and 19 years of practice....what I started out at, even after law school, is completely irrelevant. Assuming that welder estimate is right, I made less than that as a new attorney. As a new ​attorney. I wasn't new for very long.

 

[KellyinAvon]

I shopped in the wrong places in 1892.

FIFY

 

[actaeon277]

Trade school is a great option for many people. Probably way more people than choose it.

However, that cartoon is misleading on both ends and after 7 years of post high-school education and 19 years of practice....what I started out at, even after law school, is completely irrelevant. Assuming that welder estimate is right, I made less than that as a new attorney. As a new ​attorney. I wasn't new for very long.

A new hire at the mill will make twice that, with overtime once he's done with his apprenticeship.

 

[jagee]

I'm in the wrong business.

 

[churchmouse]

Trade school is a great option for many people. Probably way more people than choose it.

However, that cartoon is misleading on both ends and after 7 years of post high-school education and 19 years of practice....what I started out at, even after law school, is completely irrelevant. Assuming that welder estimate is right, I made less than that as a new attorney. As a new ​attorney. I wasn't new for very long.

Upon graduating from a trade school or an apprenticeship depending on where one chooses to go the pay is pretty good. Usually north of the 50K mark. Especially if it is an apprenticeship they go through. $75K is not beyond reach with no OT. If one lands in the right job and the right project $100K is within reach if OT is worked regularly. Fitters make these numbers regularly.

It is hard work. It is not for everyone. It can beat you down.

 

[KellyinAvon]

I'm pretty sure Kelly confused you with Churchmouse.

Everybody age-griefs CM. He ain't that much older than me and I age-grief him too but I gotta spread it around. HM might (by his next post) actually be younger than me, but when you invoke $5/hour I might go cleared-hot on the target, it's just my nature. That is all.

 

[Hawkeye7br]

I can't find it, but there was one that showed a woman, pointing to a garbage man, telling her kid to study or he'll be like that.
Next frame, a woman points at the garbage man and tells her son, look at that man, he has a job, supports his family, etc.

Ditto.

Going into my senior year of high school, Dad had me & a friend bury a water line (digging a ditch by hand) 30 inches deep and 100 feet long. I asked him why we didn't rent a trencher. He replied "I want you to have something to fall back on in case that whole college education thing doesn't work out."

Forty years later, I can still handle a shovel as well as anyone, but it was a great lesson in the contrast of working hard vs. working smart.

 

[churchmouse]

Ditto.

Going into my senior year of high school, Dad had me & a friend bury a water line (digging a ditch by hand) 30 inches deep and 100 feet long. I asked him why we didn't rent a trencher. He replied "I want you to have something to fall back on in case that whole college education thing doesn't work out."

Forty years later, I can still handle a shovel as well as anyone, but it was a great lesson in the contrast of working hard vs. working smart.

I have told all my kids and any others who will listen that in most jobs the harder you work the less you might make. Work smart.

 

[rkwhyte2]

Everybody age-griefs CM. He ain't that much older than me and I age-grief him too but I gotta spread it around. HM might (by his next post) actually be younger than me, but when you invoke $5/hour I might go cleared-hot on the target, it's just my nature. That is all.

He is just a couple of years older than I am. I saw the opportunity and took it. I remember making $2/hr but of course a pack of smokes was $.25 at the time.

 

[Bfish]

I am also sure the is filling the jobs with kids who got crappy degrees too. If you are going to go to college at least make sure you are coming out qualified to do something (and will). Not just "have a degree" that is how you get stuck being a CSR for $12 an hour. I have never thought my bachelors degree is special. In my opinion they are not even all that hard to get depending on what you choose to study.

This brings up another one of my biggest issues. 2 of the 4 years are spent giving you absolutely no skills that will be valuable to you when you graduate. Sure you have a piece of paper (and everyone gets one), but you've got to come out with a skill or ability from college no different than a kid in a trade school. That's the key, otherwise college is pointless.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

If it's on Facebook, it's got to be true...

Call centers pay in Rupees, not Dollars.

 

[Hookeye]

Liberal arts degree on borrowed money..........no sympathy.
Some folks will get the same fluff degree, but make the connections while at school, and land a pretty decent gig.
It can be what you got, and how you got it.
Also factor in where you got it.

"college" alone doesn't mean diddly.

75% of jobs are gotten through connections.
Not blind applications.

This "anti college" crap is as bad as the "gotta have college" crap.

 

[Libertarian01]

I don't think this is a "college / no college" issue. I think it is a retard employer issue and I don't mean that in a kind way.

The whole bit about debt and hoping to be able to take advantage of someone honestly sickens me. This is an employer who will be left scratching his head at the massive turnover or why on earth his employees would want to unionize, or why productivity/morale is so low...?

This isn't about the value of a degree, this is about how stupid their HR staff is.

#1) Get a job description;
#2) Itemize the skills that would be required to do the job;
#3) Hire people based upon those skill requirements, period!

If a degree is necessary, great! Require the degree. But if a degree is not necessary, then F* it, simply list the skills as you did and hire based upon those skills.

An employer like this obviously doesn't care about his people, and we wonder why employees don't care about their company.

Regards,

Doug

 

[Kutnupe14]

I may be in the minority on this, but a degree still gives you a leg up on the competition. College graduates still make more money over the course of their lifetimes than HS/trade school folks, something like a $1M more. People that go into the trade professions, often don't have many options if they should lose their employment, conversely a college grade can move seamlessly (regardless of major) into a variety of "degree required" fields. That's not a knock on the non-degreed folks, you obviously can be very successful in the trade fields, but a degree in most instances is more valuable.

 

[thunderchicken]

Obviously in large part it depends on what an individual wants to do. But I think part of the problem is so many kids these days either just don't know what they want to do and somehow think they are going to find their calling in college..or they come from situations where they have lacked the push to do something better by a parent and they lack self worth.
Kut made a good point about salaries being tied to education level and job options if a person losses employment. I'm not convinced of that completely. Lots of people get stuck looking at gross income and fail to look at/ realize how much value is in their benefits. You have to look at the total picture when you do that, those certified welders working as a union employee with their benefits package their employment value exceeds 75k to start. Lots of good trades with exceptional benefits...and that can make up for less "pay rate"

 

[wtburnette]

I have told all my kids and any others who will listen that in most jobs the harder you work the less you might make. Work smart.

My Dad told me that when I was working warehouse jobs back in my 20's. I took that to heart and got an associates degree, which got me into computers, where I made decent money. He was right of course...

I may be in the minority on this, but a degree still gives you a leg up on the competition. College graduates still make more money over the course of their lifetimes than HS/trade school folks, something like a $1M more. People that go into the trade professions, often don't have many options if they should lose their employment, conversely a college grade can move seamlessly (regardless of major) into a variety of "degree required" fields. That's not a knock on the non-degreed folks, you obviously can be very successful in the trade fields, but a degree in most instances is more valuable.

I hit a wall in my career field with my associates degree and went back to school to get my bachelors degree. Helped me to get my current position, which I would not have gotten without that degree. I now make ~$40/hr and work zero overtime. While there are too many young people going to college getting liberal arts degrees, there are also those who need the degree to get ahead. Now on top of my career I have a professional certification I'm studying for that I need to get soon, in order to continue moving ahead.

 

[PistolBob]

Ancient History Perspective: I graduated from High School in the mid 1970's, in Indy

Shadeland Avenue had Western Electric, Jenn Air, and Chrysler....then we also had Allison Transmission, Detroit Diesel, Bridgeport Brass, Ford Motor Company, Cummins was in Columbus, International Harvester was in Ft Wayne and Indy, Chrysler had plants in New Castle, Kokomo, Marion had Fisher Body, Anderson thrived on the General Motors and Guide Lamp jobs

So when I was in High School, my buddies had dads that worked in the plants. They had two cars, motorcycles, a boat or two, a decent home, enjoyed at least one nice vacation a year, health insurance, and looked forward to a Union retirement. Making about $32-37K a year.

By the end of the 1970's the plants were closed, thousands of long time factory workers were unemployed, the military was scaling back as the war was over, and all of a sudden a high school graduate could not count on a 30 year career on the assembly line and living happily ever after. I got married in 1979....mortgage rates were nearly 16% and more in some places, the economy was stalled, it was impossible for most folks to save a dime. Luckily for me I had been a electronics junkie and in 1980 I got my first paying job working with "computers" and doing "data processing". A self taught skill set that has served me well now for almost 40 years. My college grad kids chose technical and business fields that have paid off for them, but they have way too many friends that have undergrad degrees in unmarketable skills, so they have almost no way to ever repay the student loans they took out by the tens of thousands.

$60K - $80K for a BA in Social Work is going to be hard to pay back

Every generation of workers has to face a different environment. My parents worked at the same place their entire lives...I seem to have to find a new job every 9-10 years...

 

[bobzilla]

Without knowing a skilled trade or owning your own business in which is a skilled trade, you'll more than likely struggle your whole life unless you are super content with having hardly nothing at all. Of course you have the exceptions but if it were the norm then no one would spend money on a secondary education if they were gonna earn the same as someone who has an associates or higher degree. Hough said it best, you need to assess what you want to do in life and see if college is necessary then assess your cost vs. what you'll make to see if it's worth it. If I would've stayed working in that factory while I was going to school then I'd still be making $35-$40k/yr working 5 days a week. But I spent $10k at a community college and got an associates degree and more than doubled my yearly salary and only work 4 days a week. My decision how allowed my wife to be a stay at home mom and home school our 5 kids.

One of my closest friends is a high school drop out with a GED. Works from home in the IT field unless they need him on sute where they fly him in and put him up in nice hotels and an expense account. Makes 6 figures. Thy man has worked his ass off to get where he is and I couldn’t think of a better example of what America is and can be.

Im a college drop out. Did 3 semesters as a music ed major before ibA.) ran out of money and 2.) realized teaching was not my thing. I work he’s at every job I’ve ever had and I’d say I’m doing OK. 22+ an hour, 3 weeks I vaca and a week of pto and my employer willing to spend another 3k this coming year to advance my knowledge base with another certification which brings another raise.

So the whole “struggle your whole life and be content with hardly anything” crap is a bit insulting and completely false.