"If you see something..." Meh

[Brad69]

Found the mission statement on the FBI looks like it has a wide berth of responsibilities.

Protect the United States from terrorist attack
Protect the United States against foreign intelligence operations and espionage
Protect the United States against cyber-based attacks and high-technology crimes
Combat public corruption at all levels
Protect civil rights
Combat transnational/national criminal organizations and enterprises
Combat major white-collar crime
Combat significant violent crime

I believe we have created a weak National Police Force that has evolved into a large Washington D.C. based entity. It seems to employ lifetime bureaucrats from the DC area for the most part and has a large support staff.

IMO the tip should passed to the State Police and on down the chain ?
BTW don’t think all State Police are like Indiana some states they have very limited authority.

 

[Trigger Time]

Found the mission statement on the FBI looks like it has a wide berth of responsibilities.

Protect the United States from terrorist attack
Protect the United States against foreign intelligence operations and espionage
Protect the United States against cyber-based attacks and high-technology crimes
Combat public corruption at all levels
Protect civil rights
Combat transnational/national criminal organizations and enterprises
Combat major white-collar crime
Combat significant violent crime

I believe we have created a weak National Police Force that has evolved into a large Washington D.C. based entity. It seems to employ lifetime bureaucrats from the DC area for the most part and has a large support staff.

IMO the tip should passed to the State Police and on down the chain ?
BTW don’t think all State Police are like Indiana some states they have very limited authority.

I think the FBI should be eliminated. How do these organizations operate with little to no accountability to even Congress. A federal agency ignoring congressional subpoenas is just outright treason to me. I can't believe some of the things that come out of the FBI's mouth. The AG needs to reign in these independent operators that think they can do whatever they want or feel like.
The deep state b.s. is getting very old. It's time to start jailing top officials

 

[KellyinAvon]

39. 39 times they were called to his residence for domestic issues. Crazy
For me that number just blows my mind. For some of the Leo's on here I bet they have addresses on their beat that probably rivals that number.
I'm deffinately not a fan of "pre-copping" or "pre-crime" but it just bafles me that we don't have some way to hold people or make them seek help if they threaten schools or cops or government officials, or even just regular citizens.

I'm thinking after 5 or so the entire local PD recognizes the address when it comes over the radio. This wasn't a temporary thing either, it was over 7 years. At some point several years ago this became a predictable trend.

 

[HenryWallace]

How about bringing back citizens arrest? I'd say always keep it local unless it's a wider problem. I trust my neighbors much more than I trust Feds.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Well, possibly but in light of this we need to review what happened and see what can be modified to at least stand back and objectively look.
It is obvious this is (as most of the others) a case where no one either paid attention or cared enough to pursue it. I as a member of the gun community am getting damned tired of the assaults from the ignorant left.

What would INGO's reaction be to the following headline:

"Man argues with mother, arsenal taken from house."

Everyone wants a crystal ball. Everyone wants 2nd amendment and due process until hindsight says it was a bad idea in this particular case.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

How about bringing back citizens arrest? I'd say always keep it local unless it's a wider problem. I trust my neighbors much more than I trust Feds.

Why "bring it back"? It never went anywhere.

Indiana Code Title 35. Criminal Law and Procedure § 35-33-1-4 | FindLaw

a) Any person may arrest any other person if:
(1) the other person committed a felony in his presence;

(2) a felony has been committed and he has probable cause to believe that the other person has committed that felony;  or

(3) a misdemeanor involving a breach of peace is being committed in his presence and the arrest is necessary to prevent the continuance of the breach of peace.


(b) A person making an arrest under this section shall, as soon as practical, notify a law enforcement officer and deliver custody of the person arrested to a law enforcement officer.

(c) The law enforcement officer may process the arrested person as if the officer had arrested him.  The officer who receives or processes a person arrested by another under this section is not liable for false arrest or false imprisonment.

 

[Trigger Time]

Why "bring it back"? It never went anywhere.

Indiana Code Title 35. Criminal Law and Procedure § 35-33-1-4 | FindLaw

a) Any person may arrest any other person if:
(1) the other person committed a felony in his presence;

(2) a felony has been committed and he has probable cause to believe that the other person has committed that felony;  or

(3) a misdemeanor involving a breach of peace is being committed in his presence and the arrest is necessary to prevent the continuance of the breach of peace.


(b) A person making an arrest under this section shall, as soon as practical, notify a law enforcement officer and deliver custody of the person arrested to a law enforcement officer.

(c) The law enforcement officer may process the arrested person as if the officer had arrested him.  The officer who receives or processes a person arrested by another under this section is not liable for false arrest or false imprisonment.

Is being an illegal a felony? Serious question.
Next time the local cops won't arrest an illegal that hits you in a traffic accident Maybe a citizens arrest and transport to ICE office is necessary

 

[Trigger Time]

I feel terrible also for the officers who have dealt with this animal before the shooting and who's hands I'm sure were tied by the law. I know they must be feeling terrible and like they could have prevented it. Hindsight is 20/20 and if the law didn't give those officers the tools they needed then it's not their fault it's first the piece of **** who did this and second it's the laws that are insufficient to lock up TRUE mentaly ill violent citizens. Theres a difference in people who are depressed or mentaly ill and people who are violent mentaly Ill.
Also I think it's VERY important that before we permanently take away a citizens right to carry a gun or purchase a gun that a court make a ruling on all the evidence. However a temporary ban until a reasonable court date can be held seems reasonable. May be those things are already in place? But also lets do a better job or pass laws that require a suspected mentaly Ill and violent person to undergo a psychological evaluation in custody before being released

 

[Kutnupe14]

Like I said in one of the other threads on the topic, there is a reason 911 doesn't go to the FBI.

I have no idea how many tips the FBI gets, but I know how many we get and most of them are useless. Things like, "three days ago there was a road rage shooting and there's a black car backed into a parking space at my apartment complex that hasn't moved in three days." That's an actual tip, btw. Useless, but still has to be sorted through.

What I'd suggest is...call 911. This is the sort of thing that local PD's/Sheriff's handle. Like this:

https://www.kxly.com/news/grandma-calls-911-to-report-grandsons-school-shooting-plans-1/702170515

Different outcome, likely because the right people had the right information.



And we all knew this would pop up at some point. You don't let a rabid dog play with your kids up until he bites one.

Approximately 2000 a day... prior year ranges from 700k to 1M a year.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Is being an illegal a felony? Serious question.
Next time the local cops won't arrest an illegal that hits you in a traffic accident Maybe a citizens arrest and transport to ICE office is necessary

Even if it is, it's an immigration law, which you are unable to enforce.

 

[WanderingSol07]

I find calling the local PD, city, county, or even state police the best and I use their normal phone number if it is not an emergency. I usually call about odd and suspicious things I see. I think the best one was a few years ago I called the city (West Lafayette) and reported McCormick Road was flooded over at the pond, too deep to drive through and that there was a 3' snapping turtle sitting in the road on the high side. They called me back to let me know they put signs up and got animal control to chase off the turtle.

I think local PD is vested in the community and they will respond and/or investigate better than some state or federal agency. I would think the state and FBI would respond better to a local PD call for help too.

 

[Trigger Time]

Even if it is, it's an immigration law, which you are unable to enforce.

A citizen can't make a citizens arrest on an illegal alien? What makes immigration felony different than any other?
I highly doubt the feds would arrest citizens who bring them criminals but I've seen stupid stuff before

 

[MCgrease08]

Is being an illegal a felony? Serious question.
Next time the local cops won't arrest an illegal that hits you in a traffic accident Maybe a citizens arrest and transport to ICE office is necessary

Even if it is, it's an immigration law, which you are unable to enforce.

A citizen can't make a citizens arrest on an illegal alien? What makes immigration felony different than any other?
I highly doubt the feds would arrest citizens who bring them criminals but I've seen stupid stuff before

I'm not sure about the citizen's arrest, but to Kut's point, local LEAs can't enforce federal law.

Even if they stop an illegal, there's nothing they can do unless they've also violated a local ordinance. Even then it's most likely to result in a citation unless it's something like a DUI crash that would result in criminal charges.

 

[Trigger Time]

No wonder cops can't do anything half the time when people call them. It's like a union welder telling a union electrician he can't help him with his job to help the company get the job done efficiently because it's cross trade craft
Cops shouldn't have to worry about that. To regular citizens like me this is the stupidest thing ever
Our laws and courts and prosecutors are ****ed up!

So I totally get why someone would call the FBI thinking they are getting straight to the top and solving the problem. Because they don't know how ****ed up our laws and jurisdictions are

 

[churchmouse]

What would INGO's reaction be to the following headline:

"Man argues with mother, arsenal taken from house."

Everyone wants a crystal ball. Everyone wants 2nd amendment and due process until hindsight says it was a bad idea in this particular case.

I get this and yes, you are right BUT how about this one....Man fights with mother 39 times. Nothing done. Man goes off deep end and shoots up school. 17 dead.
1 or 2 times......Meh. 39 times shows a certain pattern don't you think. Just saying. We have to learn to see the difference I would guess.

 

[BlackGun]

.....pass the salt

 

[jamil]

And we all knew this would pop up at some point. You don't let a rabid dog play with your kids up until he bites one.

Intervention is a reasonable response to seeing evidence that the kid was planning to do a mass shooting. I don't think intervention is treading all that close to the concept of "pre-crime".

From the video, it seems the right thing happened as far as criminal charges. They weren't certain there are any they can make. The grandma did the right thing, and it may be very likely she prevented another senseless loss of life. And the kid may get some help sorting out whatever brought him to this state, if that's even possible.

 

[churchmouse]

.....pass the salt

OK.....Beer or Sprite over ice...???

 

[BlackGun]

either one CM....

 

[jamil]

Well, possibly but in light of this we need to review what happened and see what can be modified to at least stand back and objectively look.
It is obvious this is (as most of the others) a case where no one either paid attention or cared enough to pursue it. I as a member of the gun community am getting damned tired of the assaults from the ignorant left.

Whatever happens, I don't want it to be societally acceptable to charge people with crimes they might commit, or to commit people to mental institutions unless they actually need committed. Those 39 times show that the guy has some mental/socialization issues. But has he committed a crime, and is there a clear reason to detain him for mental issues? I don't know.

I do think that if people called local police to report his Youtube videos and other social media posts, and they still didn't do anything, then I'd say they have some major explaining to do. I'm just not willing to give up standards which protect people's rights not to be detained by whim, just because it seems obvious to us that this guy should have been.