Looking at 9/11 with actual science

[dross]

This is probably my main reason for doubting the conspiracy theories; when I see the federal government in action it does not seem competent enough to pull off a complex conspiracy.

My main reason for doubting it is that when you see a perfectly plausible explanation for something captured on video, like oh, say several tons of airplane and explosive liquid crashing into a building, and then later that building falling down, and then you discover that the planes were hijacked and flown into the buildings by fanatical enemies of the country, it becomes hopelessly ridiculous to believe that the buildings fell from some OTHER hidden means, and that the airplanes crashing into them weren't the REAL reason they fell, but simply an elaborate cover for the the real reason, that seem superfluous on its face, 'cause why wouldn't you just blame the actual method of the buildings falling on the patsies in the first place?

So basically, my main reason for doubting a government conspiracy is that the lack of evidence on the one hand and the overwhelming evidence on the other is only surpassed by the total, utter, crazy ridiclified nature of the theory in the first place.

 

[Keith_Indy]

Tests showed that the recovered metal could noto nly hold the load, it could do so for twice as long as the towers were up.

Nist tests on recovered steel showed temps got NO WHERE NEAR hot enough for long enough to do any kind of damage.

No need to go further then this to show the governments conspiracy theory has no backing.

If ANYONE has any PROOF of a raging inferno that can soften every steel support in all three buildings at the exact same time needed for a straight down collapse, please help the government out because as of today, their "raging inferno" theory has NO PROOF what so ever.

Well, one thing wrong with the NIST tests that I can see off-hand.

There were 200,000 TONS of steel in the WTC complex. And they had how many recovered sections of columns? Talk about a needle in a haystack.

********************** (Following not directed at Randall Flagg)

That presentation also has some good graphics on where some of the airplane debris ended up. Also of the impact damage, 3-4 floors each at the impact sites.

Page 46, you can see the top of the South tower as it collapses, and it ain't "straight down." In fact, it looks to me like what would happen if you kicked out the support on one side.

And this is an awful lot of buildings with major damage, partially collapsed, collapsed, or destroyed. So, how did buildings coming "straight down" cause all this damage?

So can we please stop saying they fell straight down. They kinetic energy of the planes hitting is also massive, 6250 MJ.

Collapsed or Destroyed
One World Trade Center (North Tower)
Two World Trade Center (South Tower)
Marriott Hotel (3 WTC)
Five World Trade Center
Seven World Trade Center

Partially Collapsed
Four World Trade Center
Six World Trade Center

Major Damage
One Liberty Plaza
East River Savings Bank
N.J. Kalikow and Co. Building and Millennium Hotel
Federal Building
N.Y. Telephone Building
One World Financial Center
Two World Financial Center
Three World Financial Center
St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church
90 West Street
Bankers Trust

So, for anyone interested, here are a bunch of civil and structural engineers that explain why the towers collapsed the way they did. And they have the calculations to prove it. Something which the ae911truth site does not have behind it.

I also like their dedication (listed on the home page.)

 

[shibumiseeker]

My main reason for doubting it is that when you see a perfectly plausible explanation for something captured on video, like oh, say several tons of airplane and explosive liquid crashing into a building, and then later that building falling down, and then you discover that the planes were hijacked and flown into the buildings by fanatical enemies of the country, it becomes hopelessly ridiculous to believe that the buildings fell from some OTHER hidden means, and that the airplanes crashing into them weren't the REAL reason they fell, but simply an elaborate cover for the the real reason, that seem superfluous on its face, 'cause why wouldn't you just blame the actual method of the buildings falling on the patsies in the first place?

So basically, my main reason for doubting a government conspiracy is that the lack of evidence on the one hand and the overwhelming evidence on the other is only surpassed by the total, utter, crazy ridiclified nature of the theory in the first place.

Dross, I've been watching you for quite a while in this thread, and I am beginning to sense that you are trying to say something here. You keep using these big words, like "airplane" and "hijacked". Maybe with more time your agenda will become clear.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

Dross, I've been watching you for quite a while in this thread, and I am beginning to sense that you are trying to say something here. Maybe with more time your agenda will become clear.

Didn't you see him with the stick?

 

[dross]

Dross, I've been watching you for quite a while in this thread, and I am beginning to sense that you are trying to say something here. You keep using these big words, like "airplane" and "hijacked". Maybe with more time your agenda will become clear.

Didn't you see him with the stick?

It's the poet in me, lads. I like to hide my true meaning in symbolism, subtle wordplay, and double entendre.

 

[Eddie]

It's the poet in me, lads. I like to hide my true meaning in symbolism, subtle wordplay, and double entendre.

All I am hearing is blah, blah, blah, I'm a Native American who's been handling coal dust, blah, blah, blah.

Didn't you ever see lightning hit a tree?

 

[Keith_Indy]

This has an interesting video of all 3 collapses.

Here's a question, note at 2:16 the collapse of the north tower. Those are columns 10's of stories still standing and falling, while much of the rest of the building is collapsing around it. What explains that? Not sure if those are interior or exterior columns, but they are clearly seen.

YouTube - New collapse footage of WTC7 and North Tower - Nov 2008

 

[jeremy]

This has an interesting video of all 3 collapses.

Here's a question, note at 2:16 the collapse of the north tower. Those are columns 10's of stories still standing and falling, while much of the rest of the building is collapsing around it. What explains that?

Could it be that the floors collapsed first, and then the central core was damaged from debris falling in on itself.

It was Aliens that were working with the Government in the Conspiracy...
Everyone knows this...

 

[dross]

All I am hearing is blah, blah, blah, I'm a Native American who's been handling coal dust, blah, blah, blah.

Didn't you ever see lightning hit a tree?

Touche, my friend. Touche.

 

[dross]

This has an interesting video of all 3 collapses.

Here's a question, note at 2:16 the collapse of the north tower. Those are columns 10's of stories still standing and falling, while much of the rest of the building is collapsing around it. What explains that? Not sure if those are interior or exterior columns, but they are clearly seen.

Here's an explanation:

When two huge airplanes filled with explosive liquid traveling at hundreds of miles per hour hit two huge buildings causing those two buildings to fall, a lot of weird, chaotic, unpredictable bad stuff will happen to the things in close proximity to that incident.

There ya go.

 

[printcraft]

You guys have obviously not watch the video in the OP have you.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

Here's an explanation:

When two huge airplanes filled with explosive liquid traveling at hundreds of miles per hour hit two huge buildings causing those two buildings to fall, a lot of weird, chaotic, unpredictable bad stuff will happen to the things in close proximity to that incident.

There ya go.

"Making the complex understandable"

 

[Keith_Indy]

This explains in fairly plain English what likely happened. But it's only from a Professor of Civil & Environmental Engineering at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology.

http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/nr/2001/skyscrapers.pdf

3rd paragraph on the 2nd page.

 

[dross]

You guys have obviously not watch the video in the OP have you.

I pretended to watch the video, but actually I was really watching another video so as to cover up the video I was really watching. I wanted to hide that I was watching videos at work, so I hid that I was watching that video by watching another one.

Ingenious, don't you think?

 

[Keith_Indy]

It was Aliens that were working with the Government in the Conspiracy...
Everyone knows this...

No, Marvin was accounted for... and RR was no where near the building, so it wasn't my fault (those pesky Acme explosives never go off when I want them to.)

 

[Eddie]

Don't forget that the conspirators had the foresight to know about the highjackings, the resources to place the demolition charges throughout the three buildings without anyone noticing, the newly developed fast burning thermite and detonators that would coincide with the airplane impacts and the ability to bribe or intimidate all of the other investigating agencies...

but they didn't have the sense to make the controlled demolition not look like a controlled demolition. What a bunch of amateurs. No wonder they got caught by a bunch of internet detectives.

 

[printcraft]

........
but they didn't have the sense to make the controlled demolition not look like a controlled demolition. What a bunch of amateurs. No wonder they got caught by a bunch of internet detectives.

On that point..... everyone forget the towers collapsed basically straight down for a moment, ok.

Now, what if they did topple sideways like they do in the movies?

The conspiracy theorists would be saying......
"SEE, those buildings are too large and heavy to fall sideways,
gravity should have pulled them straight down. They were obviously
helped down by the placement of explosives, they couldn't get enough
explosives placed in the proper locations with the buildings occupied so
that is why they fell crooked, freaking government conspiracy I tell ya!"

 

[rhino]

Here's what I just read:

Blah, blah, science stuff, blah, blah, I'm a sheep with a strange horn growing out of my noseforehead thingy, blah, physics, blah.

Haven't you ever seen a tree struck by lightning?

Curiously, that's exactly what I was thinking as I was typing it. Something must have been garbled when I uploaded the text.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

According to the MIT professor, if either of the jets had hit considerably further down (say, between 20 and 40) one of the towers might have toppled instead of pancaking.

 

[Eddie]

According to the MIT professor, if either of the jets had hit considerably further down (say, between 20 and 40) one of the towers might have toppled instead of pancaking.

Yeah but he's just a professor at MIT. What does he know? I read something different on a website maintained by a guy who's selling a book about the conspiracy.