My Encounter with Border Patrol: aka "Does I'd like to talk to a Lawyer really work?"

[E5RANGER375]

Let me reiterate...



Your post is simply ridiculous.

Please stop making it harder on your fellow LEO's who actually do a good job & follow the Constitution & their oaths.

A question to the mods:

In the other thread about a cerain Circle Center Mall incident you threatened to ban the OP for just stirring the when you had no real evidence that's what he was intentionally doing.

Does that count for everyone or does the fact that j706 is a cop make him immune from being banned for this obvious attempt just to get the Rights minded members of all riled up?

I see no real usefullness to his post except to **** people off & give LEO's more difficulty in countering the "you're all alike" charge.

Isn't that the true definition of "troll"?

Ok, Ok. I'm not really suggesting he be banned but neither should anyone else except for the most egregious of violations.

he isnt trolling. the dude really believes like that. i always have a problem with his post and have asked him to please resign as an LEO several times on INGO. thats the kind of LEO i dislike.

 

[j706]

So by relinquishing your right to not answer his questions, how much further do you allow them to go? Will you let them search you without PC? Your family? Your vehicle? Your home?

Do you not think that you could be incriminating yourself before you are taken into custody? I don't get your line of thinking...

If they thought they needed to search me,my car or my home I don't care. They won't find one single illegal thing on or in any of the above. I follow the law and have no worry's of incriminating myself. I am not hiding from anyone and I am not hiding anything. Guess I must be in the minority here. Must suck looking over your shoulders all the time and freaking out every time you see a police car or a LEO. Holy Cow!!

 

[Wwwildthing]

That bill has zero to do with this situation. It only affects Arizona law enforcement, not the Border Patrol. The first time I went through one of those stops was over twenty years ago, just south of Alamagordo, NM.

I've lived in Tucson for 6 months of the year, every year, since 2000... and your going to try to tell me how things work down there?

You sound just like the ex-state trooper I met in a Greensburg gun shop a few weeks back... he tried to tell me my drivers license and carry permit were invalid.

Yea, right.

Are you aware that a Border Patrol cop pulled Jared Lee Loughner over for a traffic violation on the morning of the Tucson shooting? He was packing under 'Constitutional Carry'... and as he had no record or warrants, he was released with a written warning.

Maybe you'd like to explain to us why the Border Patrol is doing traffic stops and checkpoints, if they have no teeth in Arizona law? Answer - Because they are sworn to uphold the laws of the United States and the State in which they are assigned... they have the same police powers as any other LEO.

Back on topic - I'd still say the OP got a pass because he didn't look Hispanic and had his family with him... his 'lawyer card' had nothing to do with it.

 

[j706]

I've lived in Tucson for 6 months of the year, every year, since 2000... and your going to try to tell me how things work down there?

You sound just like the ex-state trooper I met in a Greensburg gun shop a few weeks back... he tried to tell me my drivers license and carry permit were invalid.

Yea, right.

Are you aware that a Border Patrol cop pulled Jared Lee Loughner over for a traffic violation on the morning of the Tucson shooting? He was packing under 'Constitutional Carry'... and as he had no record or warrants, he was released with a written warning.

Maybe you'd like to explain to us why the Border Patrol is doing traffic stops and checkpoints, if they have no teeth in Arizona law? Answer - Because they are sworn to uphold the laws of the United States and the State in which they are assigned... they have the same police powers as any other LEO.

Back on topic - I'd still say the OP got a pass because he didn't look Hispanic and had his family with him... his 'lawyer card' had nothing to do with it.

I don't know much about the border patrol but I don't believe they can enforce any law except federal law. I don't know why they do whatever it is they do. But if I was stopped by them I would fully cooperate. I would cooperate with ANY legal question,stop or request.

 

[E5RANGER375]

If they thought they needed to search me,my car or my home I don't care. They won't find one single illegal thing on or in any of the above. I follow the law and have no worry's of incriminating myself. I am not hiding from anyone and I am not hiding anything. Guess I must be in the minority here. Must suck looking over your shoulders all the time and freaking out every time you see a police car or a LEO. Holy Cow!!

so just because I refuse to submit to searches i dont legaly have to submit to or legaly refuse to answer questions that automaticly makes me a law breaker who has something to hide? where do you get this stuff? are they really pumping you full of this crap? i know your older, so maybe your the one teaching it. i sure hope not.

I dont have illegal stuff either, and I dont look over my shoulder anymore than any other aware person should do. I just dont believe in handing over rights that protect me.

 

[MinuteMan47]

I've went through a few of these checkpoints. I find it rather ironic and quite hilarious that a few of the BP officers I've dealt with spoke in a Hispanic accent and asked "Are you a US Citizen?"


I should ask...well........Are you!?

 

[Hoosier9]

Are you aware that a Border Patrol cop pulled Jared Lee Loughner over for a traffic violation on the morning of the Tucson shooting? He was packing under 'Constitutional Carry'... and as he had no record or warrants, he was released with a written warning.

Maybe you'd like to explain to us why the Border Patrol is doing traffic stops and checkpoints, if they have no teeth in Arizona law? Answer - Because they are sworn to uphold the laws of the United States and the State in which they are assigned... they have the same police powers as any other LEO.

Back on topic - I'd still say the OP got a pass because he didn't look Hispanic and had his family with him... his 'lawyer card' had nothing to do with it.

Loughner was pulled over by an Arizona Game and Fish officer, not a Border Patrol officer.

Loughner pulled over hours before shooting

Not saying a Border Patrol officer couldn't have made a traffic stop, as I believe that they can enforce state laws under certain conditions. I don't think that they routinely engage in vehicle stops for running red lights, however.

 

[E5RANGER375]

I've went through a few of these checkpoints. I find it rather ironic and quite hilarious that a few of the BP officers I've dealt with spoke in a Hispanic accent and asked "Are you a US Citizen?"


...well........Are you!?

and a little bit of

 

[j706]

so just because I refuse to submit to searches i dont legaly have to submit to or legaly refuse to answer questions that automaticly makes me a law breaker who has something to hide? where do you get this stuff? are they really pumping you full of this crap? i know your older, so maybe your the one teaching it. i sure hope not.

I dont have illegal stuff either, and I dont look over my shoulder anymore than any other aware person should do. I just dont believe in handing over rights that protect me.

Who said refusing to answer something makes you a law breaker? Not me.
Older? Me? Heck I am only 25

 

[j706]

I've went through a few of these checkpoints. I find it rather ironic and quite hilarious that a few of the BP officers I've dealt with spoke in a Hispanic accent and asked "Are you a US Citizen?"


I should ask...well........Are you!?

I could see how that would be a little irritating. But I am all for keeping all the illegals OUT OF HERE! They are a major PITA and think us and our laws are a big game.

 

[Rookie]

If you're truly 25, then that would explain a lot. Not excuse it, explain it.

 

[dross]

I've lived in Tucson for 6 months of the year, every year, since 2000... and your going to try to tell me how things work down there?

You sound just like the ex-state trooper I met in a Greensburg gun shop a few weeks back... he tried to tell me my drivers license and carry permit were invalid.

Yea, right.

Are you aware that a Border Patrol cop pulled Jared Lee Loughner over for a traffic violation on the morning of the Tucson shooting? He was packing under 'Constitutional Carry'... and as he had no record or warrants, he was released with a written warning.

Maybe you'd like to explain to us why the Border Patrol is doing traffic stops and checkpoints, if they have no teeth in Arizona law? Answer - Because they are sworn to uphold the laws of the United States and the State in which they are assigned... they have the same police powers as any other LEO.

Back on topic - I'd still say the OP got a pass because he didn't look Hispanic and had his family with him... his 'lawyer card' had nothing to do with it.

What are you even talking about?

1. The Border Patrol has been doing these kinds of stops for twenty years, at least, because that's the first time I was stopped for it.
2. The Border Patrol follows Federal law, not State law.

As to the rest of your post, I have no idea what points of mine you're addressing.

 

[SirRealism]

I would cooperate with ANY legal question,stop or request.

Please define a "legal question".

 

[SirRealism]

I've lived in Tucson for 6 months of the year, every year, since 2000... and your going to try to tell me how things work down there?

No, he was informing you that the agency doing this stop does not derive authority from the law you mentioned. He doesn't need to live there to do that.

 

[Wwwildthing]

Loughner was pulled over by an Arizona Game and Fish officer, not a Border Patrol officer.

Loughner pulled over hours before shooting

Not saying a Border Patrol officer couldn't have made a traffic stop, as I believe that they can enforce state laws under certain conditions. I don't think that they routinely engage in vehicle stops for running red lights, however.

Your right, my bad... but it goes back to my point... all the LEO's in Arizona, regardless of agency, are sworn to enforce state and federal law.

 

[j706]

Please define a "legal question".

Yea that is kinda broad isn't it? I would answer any question asked of me during a traffic stop,check point or whatever. My main point is I will not sit there and sound like a parrot about not answering basic questions without a lawyer present. Silly IMO.

 

[SirRealism]

Your right, my bad... but it goes back to my point... all the LEO's in Arizona, regardless of agency, are sworn to enforce state and federal law.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the state law in question granted authority to state LEAs similar to what the feds already had. (Or at least, that was the spin.)

 

[Wwwildthing]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the state law in question granted authority to state LEAs similar to what the feds already had. (Or at least, that was the spin.)

Correct... but if you read the bill, you'll see wording that 'gives teeth' to federal agencies (ICE, Border Patrol, etc) as well.

 

[ElsiePeaRN]

These checkpoints are a direct result of Arizona Senate Bill 1070....

Incorrect.

That bill has zero to do with this situation. It only affects Arizon law enforcement, not the Border Patrol. The first time I went through one of those stops was over twenty years ago, just south of Alamagordo, NM.

+1 Having lived in SoCal, I was also subject to these BP checkpoints long before the Arizona law.

I've lived in Tucson for 6 months of the year, every year, since 2000... and your going to try to tell me how things work down there?

It seems to me he was just pointing out that you made a false statement. I was about to post it myself til I saw ranger and dross already addressed it. It doesn't really matter how you think things work down there. You made a statement about the checkpoints that is simply wrong.

Are you aware that a Border Patrol cop pulled Jared Lee Loughner over for a traffic violation on the morning of the Tucson shooting?

Please check your facts here and post a source. I believe you are mistaken about this as well.

 

[j706]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the state law in question granted authority to state LEAs similar to what the feds already had. (Or at least, that was the spin.)

I would say federal immigration laws only. I don't know of any LEO that can enforce all federal and all state laws. Those story's get a lot of spin. Kinda like the one that conservation officer's have more authority than other LEO's. That is just exaggeration. While on the subject, surprisingly enough under Indiana law a town marshal has the broadest statutory authority of any Indiana LEO. Not many people know that.