New 700

[Basher]

There are some hardcore riflemen on that other forum. Also some old farts that like to argue.
Entertaining, at times.

This statement sums up 24HR perfectly lol.

And I agree that at the ranges most hunt, caliber is irrelevant. Know your dope and how to read wind, and the animal won’t know the difference!

 

[teddy12b]

I've owned a 700 or two over the years, but none now. Recently shot a friends 700 that's an SPS tactical in 308 from the "good old days" of Remington and the gun was so old it didn't have a threaded barrel. After shooting my custom rifle or a Tikka CTR, or another friends Bergara HMR Prem I was really shocked at how much I dislike the 700.

Bottom line is this, I hope Remington makes a come back, but I'm not going to buy one until I hear lots of great reviews and no word of recalls. More than likely though, they're a copy paste of Colt firearms where they lived off an old name and have done nothing to keep up with their competition other than keep their prices higher than they should have.

The only real legacy of the Remington 700 is the action spacing for aftermarket stocks. Otherwise, there are simply much better options out there today.

 

[two70]

No need to apologize. You might have needed more purple, and maybe I needed more smilies lol. But posts like that attacking the Creed DO make me chuckle. Over on the 24HourCampfire forums some people get real worked up about the CM being a fad or whatever and I just think it’s hilarious that it’s still viewed as such by some people. The 6.5mm caliber is in near perfect balance regarding all the important details, and the CM is just a modern, true short action update of the Swede. I don’t see it fading away into the history books any time soon!

Is the 6.5 CM a fad? Probably, though one with more than the usual staying power. It is certainly a triumph of marketing and hype. The 6.5 CM definitely hit the cartridge lottery and became far more popular than better cartridges of the same bullet diameter that preceded and followed it. It is kind of fitting that a 6.5 CM discussion broke out in a Remington 700 thread since both trade more on perception than reality, though they certainly appear to have different trajectories in popularity.

 

[Basher]

Is the 6.5 CM a fad? Probably, though one with more than the usual staying power. It is certainly a triumph of marketing and hype. The 6.5 CM definitely hit the cartridge lottery and became far more popular than better cartridges of the same bullet diameter that preceded and followed it. It is kind of fitting that a 6.5 CM discussion broke out in a Remington 700 thread since both trade more on perception than reality, though they certainly appear to have different trajectories in popularity.

Now might be a good time to go start your own denial thread re: whether the 6.5CM is a fad or not so we don’t clutter up the OP’s thread anymore…

Edit: here we go!
6.5CM: Fad or Rad?

 

[teddy12b]

Regarding the 6.5cm, it's not a fad. I'm the first guy to jump on the newest caliber bandwagon as I've got burned in the past doing that when I was younger and dumber (6.8spc back in the day). When I bought my 6.5cm it was also my one and only true custom gun so it took a lot of convincing for me to make that change. What ultimately put me over the top was talking with the guys a GA Precision and them saying that they not only build more rifle in 6.5cm than 308, but Hornady also produces more ammunition in 6.5cm than they do 308.

There was a time when the 6.5cm was just for the man bun sporting hipster kid wearing skinny jeans sipping a starbucks. That day has come and gone. In todays world you just have a better option. Imagine the same engine in a full size truck vs a corvette and imagine which one goes through the air better. There's a time and a place for everything, and I still have a 308. There's nothing wrong with a 308 and I'm thoroughly invested in it from dies, lapua brass, multiple rifles etc. The 6.5cm just happens to do everything the 308 does for hunting out to 500 yards, and beyond that you are mathematically more likely to get a hit with a 6.5cm than a 308.

 

[Basher]

Regarding the 6.5cm, it's not a fad. I'm the first guy to jump on the newest caliber bandwagon as I've got burned in the past doing that when I was younger and dumber (6.8spc back in the day). When I bought my 6.5cm it was also my one and only true custom gun so it took a lot of convincing for me to make that change. What ultimately put me over the top was talking with the guys a GA Precision and them saying that they not only build more rifle in 6.5cm than 308, but Hornady also produces more ammunition in 6.5cm than they do 308.

There was a time when the 6.5cm was just for the man bun sporting hipster kid wearing skinny jeans sipping a starbucks. That day has come and gone. In todays world you just have a better option. Imagine the same engine in a full size truck vs a corvette and imagine which one goes through the air better. There's a time and a place for everything, and I still have a 308. There's nothing wrong with a 308 and I'm thoroughly invested in it from dies, lapua brass, multiple rifles etc. The 6.5cm just happens to do everything the 308 does for hunting out to 500 yards, and beyond that you are mathematically more likely to get a hit with a 6.5cm than a 308.

Out to ~250 yards depending on several loading factors, the .308 bests the 6.5CM in energy, but the difference is relatively small (an animal probably wouldn’t know the difference). If you needed every last ft/lb for some reason then the .308 wins. For most game though, it’s a non-factor.

Brian Litz of Applied Ballistics puts out some amazing data, including this graphic I’ve seen several times:



There’s some REALLY good info in that image. If you’re only hunting paper/steel, the advantages of a smaller, lighter projectile (to a point), driven at a higher velocity, simply can’t be ignored. There’s a point of diminishing returns of course, as impacts can get harder to see, but the data is clear. If you’re hunting actual game, again, for the vast majority of hunters who harvest at ~300 yards and in (most often much closer), the 6.5CM isn’t giving up much.

I have a .308 for the same reasons others have mentioned: ease of finding quality ammo, I’m already invested in it, it’s still a VERY solid performer (even out to 1000 with the right bullet/load/shooter), it’s an excellent training round, and my particular rifle is an FN SPR w/ one of the chrome-lined barrels that’s guaranteed to shoot MOA or better (in my case it does much better) for 10,000 rounds. That’s hard to overlook! But if I were in the market for another precision rifle, it would likely be a 6.5CM.

 

[Hookeye]

Hmmm, wonder if Merkel does a Helix Alpinist in 6.5 CM, or Steyr CLII SX ?

May get one of those in .308, or worst case, settle for 7600 rem carbine. Of course that reissue not avail in 18.5".

Platform as important as cartridge for me. Wouldnt mind a Ruger 1A in 6.5 or 308 either.

The new 700 doesnt interest me at all. Have an ADL w HS stock in .243 and I rather like it.

 

[teddy12b]

I completely agree that Brian Litz of Applied Ballistics is a ballistic genius. I'm pretty sure he's the reason most long range shooters buy a kestrel loaded with AP software.

The 308 vs 6.5cm for hunting debate can be swung either way depending on what ammo and bullet weight we're talking about, but I've shot deer with both and never had a complaint. I think all my 6.5cm deer have been at 250 ish yards, and my freezer is full. Next year I want to try a different bullet in my 6.5cm though as last year the one I poked was at 300 yards, and he just didn't seem to know he was already dead and kept walking around.

Kinda jealous on that FN SPR and wish they still made those. The older I've gotten the more I'd appreciate the controlled round feeding.

 

[BackFromDC]

But the guns are in a locked case………. And stealing is against the law SO since gun laws stop gun crime there is no way they could ever take those guns from Walmart

Damn, really!? That's how it works? It didn't happen in DC that's for sure