Obama Asks Military Leaders If They Will “Fire On US Citizens"

[IndyDave1776]

Guys....let's refrain from posting this nonsense....ok? Consider your source before spreading whacko stuff on the Net. Thanks.

Condescend much? I fail to see what is 'nonsense' or 'whacko' about this. I had an uncle in the guard when Clinton was in office who was asked basically the same question. The only thing subject to speculation is what the 'correct' answer is in the opinion of those asking the question, and if they did not have nefarious motives, why the question would be asked in the first place.

 

[victor 1971]

I am a vet. I would have no part in firing on our citizens. I would expand on this topic but you just never know who reads this stuff. This conversation is best saved for face to face discussion.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Can I be completely honest?

I would open fire on US citizens. That's why I carry a handgun. To kill US citizens who pose a danger to myself, or someone incapable of defending their life. You're killing someone? You're in my house, trying to take what I worked for? You're in a movie theater, shooting unarmed civilians? You're plotting an extremist attack on our government? I'll kill you. 10 out of 10 times.

Context is important here, fellas.
I know it's easy to have a hot button pushed and become worried, and that's why we have to be calm here. We're already at a disadvantage because we don't control media outlets. We need to approach things from multiple angles... read... develop our own opinions.

But it's official. I wouldn't be removed from that program, because I would open fire on US citizens. And so would you. That's why you carry.

No Obama fan here, but I am going to need better sourcing than several articles all citing one man's Facebook posts for this.

...and popsmoke has a point- if we would never fire on U.S. citizens, we shouldn't need to carry, should we? I mean, the incidence of a foreign invader or alien attacking is fairly small.

I've never heard of this Garrow before nor have am I familiar with this website. I agree that context is important, but taking the article at face value, it leads the reader to believe that the context of this Obama litmus test is officers' willingness for firing on US citizens--not to protect innocent victims from grave bodily harm or to protect themselves from an attack but in the context of quelling an uprising that may or may not be due to redress of constitutional greviences.

 

[Disposable Heart]

This question has been around ever since the military was pretty much established guys. Sorry to burst people's bubble and dreams of facing down against Obama's military armed homie armies that will run roughshod over their neighborhood...

My father was asked the question when he became a Colonel. My grandfather was asked when the US government officially took over the Flying Tigers in Burma. This is nothing new. They ask these questions in light of rebellions in our nation, such as the attacks on Harper's Ferry by slaves, Shay's Rebellion, Black Panthers, etc... Just to name a few.

Ever since there have been people attacking the system, one way or another, there will always be this question. Domestic terrorism just happens to be on their curriculum nowadays and everyone is getting panicked. Uh, Oh, legislation talk, then BOOM, every person with Lexis Nexis or Google thinks they are an investigative reporter to blow open the current power holder's conspiracy to gun down Americans. But these things have always been there, questions always have been asked...

 

[Expat]

Sort of ironic that everyone that posted that Obama, given the chance would try to take our guns, was shouted down here and called whackos, up until the last few months...

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Sort of ironic that everyone that posted that Obama, given the chance would try to take our guns, was shouted down here and called whackos, up until the last few months...

You're not insinuating history's repeating itself, are you?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I am a vet. I would have no part in firing on our citizens. I would expand on this topic but you just never know who reads this stuff. This conversation is best saved for face to face discussion.

Never say never. Would you have fired on Tim McVeigh if you knew where he was going with that truck of fertilizer?

What about the US citizens who found their way into foreign lands and ended up fighting for the Taliban? Is there citizenship a blank check to walk the battlefield unhindered?

What about if a group was storming a military installation, ala Ft. Hood but on a larger scale. Should the MPs sort out if they are citizens before engaging? If they are, then what? Sorry, can't shoot you during your homicidal rampage as you're all citizens. Carry on.

Rather than just give blanket "I'd never do that" statements, think about it a bit. Never or Always is seldom a good idea.

That said, I don't buy into this "US on the brink of tyranny" that seems to get espoused here fairly frequently. In case you didn't notice, he won the election without a single shot being fired.

 

[Expat]

You're not insinuating history's repeating itself, are you?

I just notice that the Obamanistas love to label every critic as a whacko but I don't see their mea culpa when they turn out wrong. I don't know if this is true. I hope not. But I wouldn't put anything past this administration. I think they have some fascist tendencies. There I said it.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I just notice that the Obamanistas love to label every critic as a whacko but I don't see their mea culpa when they turn out wrong. I don't know if this is true. I hope not. But I wouldn't put anything past this administration. I think they have some fascist tendencies. There I said it.

 

[Hawkeye]

I just notice that the Obamanistas love to label every critic as a whacko but I don't see their mea culpa when they turn out wrong. I don't know if this is true. I hope not. But I wouldn't put anything past this administration. I think they have some fascist tendencies. There I said it.

Hehehehe. Hes said "fascist"! Hehehehe.

 

[mbills2223]

Guys....let's refrain from posting this nonsense....ok? Consider your source before spreading whacko stuff on the Net. Thanks.

whack stuff? Have you not seen the DHS issued manual stating that Constitutionalists, veterans, and firearm owners should be considered potential terrorist threats?

Guys....let's refrain from being sheeple led to the slaughtering of our rights...ok? Consider US/world history before dismissing anything from the realm of possibility. Thanks.

 

[-Rogue-]

My hopes are that even in a bad situation as this that military personel would not follow these types of orders, right? Im curious to see what others have to say about this. Anyone in the military have any input?

As a former Marine and with BS in Psychology, I think the danger is very real that many would just simply "follow orders." Its sad, but in the heat of the moment, many will ignore orders and more will follow them.

Look to Psychology experiments:
Milgrim Obedience Study: Milgram Experiment - The Milgram Obedience Experiment
Stanford Prison Experiment: The Stanford Prison Experiment: A Simulation Study of the Psychology of Imprisonment

Now, one may criticize that actually firing upon civilians is morally abhorrent, but take the perspective of a Private on that crowd control line: you are scared, nervous, overwhelmed, and needing guidance. If one ordered you to fire, would you do so, especially if it helped resolve those feelings? Do you really think that your patriotic duty would override your rampaging emotions?

 

[bakeman]

happened in new orleans....

 

[popsmoke]

My hopes are that even in a bad situation as this that military personel would not follow these types of orders, right? Im curious to see what others have to say about this. Anyone in the military have any input?

I'm an infantry squad leader, stationed in Fort Knox.

Context is the crucial thing here. I've said this in duplicate threads, but I would open fire on US citizens. Just because you might have been born here doesn't mean you're given special privilege when it comes to lethal force. If you're attacking innocent people, you deserve to die.

Most people in here agree too, because they carry a gun. The only people most of them will have a chance to kill is US citizens. How many people here wouldn't jump for the chance to go back in time and put a bullet between Timothy McVeigh's eyes the day before he would have destroyed the Oklahoma City building?

 

[Caleb]

What about the US citizens who found their way into foreign lands and ended up fighting for the Taliban? Is there citizenship a blank check to walk the battlefield unhindered?

I remember being at the hotel in NY on my way to pick up my supra motor, sitting in the business area on the computer(On INGO actually) when an older stranger sat at the computer next to mine. He proceeded to start small talk and then asked me if I want to go fight in the middle east for money...I declined and he quickly disappeared.

I have to wonder if he was recruiting for the terrorist or for mercenaries...

 

[Smokepole]

Let's not forget Kent State. Those kids weren't firing on anyone.

 

[Sdixon]

As a veteran I can say, depending on the situation I can absolutely see our troops firing on Americans.

Of course if they told the 1st Mar Div "Ok gents we are going to march into L.A. and kill anything that moves..." the Vast majority of Marines would refuse. However, I think its very unlikely they would give such a direct order to kill Americans.

One the other hand, if they took the same group of Marines to L.A. under the pretense of "keeping the peace", or "providing Aid" and those Marines started taking fire, Molotov cocktails, etc from the crowds, I don't think they would have any problem returning fire.
Let a few on each side get killed; You know how it goes from there...

Dont forget that in several instances in recent history, our troops have fired on U.S. citizens when used as "riot control" National Guard (Kent state,Katrina), Marines( LA Riots) to name a few.

 

[singlestacksig]

the statement no warning shots is made to avoid another Kent State, If there is some disturbance that needs military involvment & there is a need for deadly force, do not send bullets into an unknown target.. shoot the threat..

 

[johnny45]

Some citizens shoot back at tyrants.