Ok... The debate continues!

[sgreen3]

I recently posted a thread on .300 Win Mag vrs .308 for long range shooting(alot of great info) if im just looking for a target gun, could a rifle in .223 fit the bill? How far out could a .223 get me consistanly an accuratly? Thanks

 

[nalees]

Snipershide will give you more info on these sorts of things than you could want!

 

[oneshotonekill]

If you could take wind out of the equation yes it would do wonderful. The thing about a heavier bullet is it is less effected by the wind. The higher the ballistic coefficient the better it cuts through the air. The biggest variable you need to figure out is the distance you will be shooting. A .223 is a fine round, but really falls off beyond probably 400 yds.

 

[sgreen3]

If you could take wind out of the equation yes it would do wonderful. The thing about a heavier bullet is it is less effected by the wind. The higher the ballistic coefficient the better it cuts through the air. The biggest variable you need to figure out is the distance you will be shooting. A .223 is a fine round, but really falls off beyond probably 400 yds.

Thats what I was kinda wanting to know, I thought about trying to go out to a 1000yrds, but im thinkin I better work up to that,lol. So honestly for the time being 500 is prolly what im going to work up to an get good at that first, then go out further.

 

[gunowner930]

Thats what I was kinda wanting to know, I thought about trying to go out to a 1000yrds, but im thinkin I better work up to that,lol. So honestly for the time being 500 is prolly what im going to work up to an get good at that first, then go out further.

.308 seems like a happy medium, especially if you're wanting to work your way out to 1000.

 

[Bapak2ja]

Thats what I was kinda wanting to know, I thought about trying to go out to a 1000yrds, but im thinkin I better work up to that,lol. So honestly for the time being 500 is prolly what im going to work up to an get good at that first, then go out further.

.308 seems like a happy medium, especially if you're wanting to work your way out to 1000.

Bunch of show-offs! I can't even see out to 500 yds! LOL

I knew these folks were a superior breed!

 

[Indy_Guy_77]

You CAN stretch the .223 / 5.56 out further than 400 yards. Lots of people do it all the time.

I'm not at all one of those people and don't want to be.

I'd also imagine that the above caliber is more difficult to shoot at longer ranges due to the above mentioned wind issue.

If all you're wanting to do is punch holes in paper or ring a steel gong, .223 can still do it.

It might just barely "ping" the steel... I'm pretty sure INGO member drob has a taxidermied prairie dog that his wife tagged at 400-ish yards with a .223. Had 1 entrance wound and no exit...

-J-

 

[gunman41mag]

If you could take wind out of the equation yes it would do wonderful. The thing about a heavier bullet is it is less effected by the wind. The higher the ballistic coefficient the better it cuts through the air. The biggest variable you need to figure out is the distance you will be shooting. A .223 is a fine round, but really falls off beyond probably 400 yds.

The 223 should be good till 600 yards

 

[Yeah]

Do you reload?

If so, there are far better choices than any of the above. If not, you are leaving so much performance on the table that fretting too much over which caliber you pick seems pointless.

Someone who reloads might turn his 223 Rem into a 223AI. Experience suggests that would get a 75 AMax going about 3135 fps. Which would best a whole pile of 308 Win and 300 Win Mag factory loads all the way to 1000 yards, with far less recoil and using less barrel.

 

[sgreen3]

.308 seems like a happy medium, especially if you're wanting to work your way out to 1000.

Maybe that is the best one to go with.

 

[sgreen3]

Do you reload?

If so, there are far better choices than any of the above. If not, you are leaving so much performance on the table that fretting too much over which caliber you pick seems pointless.

Someone who reloads might turn his 223 Rem into a 223AI. Experience suggests that would get a 75 AMax going about 3135 fps. Which would best a whole pile of 308 Win and 300 Win Mag factory loads all the way to 1000 yards, with far less recoil and using less barrel.

Unfortunatly no I dont reload, But this is pretty much going to be a bench rifle, recoil does suck. But It cant be no worse than my mosin,lol

 

[sgreen3]

Bunch of show-offs! I can't even see out to 500 yds! LOL

I knew these folks were a superior breed!

Lol, You can do it my friend. All ya need is a good scope

 

[Indy_Guy_77]

OP: You can also look into the .270 Winchester.

Hard-pressed to find in an AR platform, though... I don't know that anyone makes an AR for that chambering, though, considering how long the cartridge is.

But it can be the bee's knees in a bolt gun. Mild recoiling, can buy ammo at just about any Walmart that sells ammo, too.

It's probably slightly more expensive to buy than .308, however....

-J-

 

[ViperJock]

So, If you want to shoot a .223 to 600 yards it can be done and done with good accuracy and precision. You need to be able to read the wind and you need a heavier, match bullet such as a boat tailed 77g or higher grain Sierra. (any good brand, I just use Sierra)

.308 is cheaper than 300 win mag. It will go to 1000yd. People shoot 1000 yd matches at camp perry with 308s. Again, get the right rifle and ammo. HAVING said that, the 300 win mag would probably be a better choice for anything that far, especially if you aren't just punching paper. If you want to really get into LONG range, get a 338 lapua.

 

[shibumiseeker]

The thing with going smaller calibers and trying to stretch them out is that if you get good at loading and shooting a smaller caliber, it almost automatically makes you better with heavier calibers at longer ranges.

I shoot .223, .22-250, .308, and .50bmg. Until recently I've mostly limited to 100 yards as that was what I had to practice with. I now have 400 yards and am working to extend that to 600 and then 1000.

If you want to work on your shooting skills and stay within a reasonable budget, get a quality .22lr and good optics and practice with that to 100 yards. It will open your eyes a lot as to what YOU need to work on.

Obviously that course of action won't get you much experience with loading your own, but that's a whole different ballgame.

Practically speaking, 400 yards is going to be your range for .223. Yes, you can stretch it to 600 yards, but that's pushing the envelope, and will be a task for once you've mastered the closer distances.

With .308, 800 yards is your practical range, and 1100 yards will be the range that tests the limits.

My experience has been that for the most part early on I was the biggest variable. Now with several years of precision shooting, I'm starting to develop the appreciation for better rifles and optics and ammunition as my skills slowly have crept up on the limits of the equipment I was using.

 

[sgreen3]

alot of very good info to consider, I guess it looks like the .308 might be the ticket after all. From what Im seeing the .223 just dont really have the wieght to get out that far consistantly. I have shot .22's for a while, an have no problem at all goin out to 100yrds with it. also have no problem getting my mauser out to 200yrds. Thats why Im looking to step up from what I got, so i guess it might just be a .308. Thanks to every one, very helpfull!

 

[tenring]

Didn't someone win a 1000 yd. match at Perry awhile back with a .223? That should lend substance to what the average person needs for a bench rest gun. They produce minimal recoil compared to the larger calibers, a whole lot cheaper to shoot, and with prices set to elevate substantially soon, economics come into play. As over 90% of the ranges in the US are 100 yds., finding a 600 yd. range, and especially a 1000 yd. range could be a chore. I had a 700 VLS changed out a few years ago, had the action blue printed, a match grade Douglas #7, 26", 8 twist barrel put on, HS Precision magazine slapped on, bedded with Marine Tex, a Jewel trigger as icing on the cake. Put a Super Snipe 20X on top, use 1/2 paste on dots on computer paper for POA, and have a blast at 100 yds. Got my 77SMK's up to 2985 fps. at the muzzle [could go faster but why?] and get my groups at 3's. Have lucked out and had a few 2's but a touch of arthritis, bi-focals, and getting a whole lot older means I have to lower my expectations a whole lot. I can get half inch groups all day long with a stock 700 VLS in .308 with my hand loads, and one holers with 168 FGGM, but the price of those things are ridiculous for the average shooter. Save your nickels and dime, do your research, have one built, get into hand loading, and look forward to a lifetime of fun.

 

[sgreen3]

Didn't someone win a 1000 yd. match at Perry awhile back with a .223? That should lend substance to what the average person needs for a bench rest gun. They produce minimal recoil compared to the larger calibers, a whole lot cheaper to shoot, and with prices set to elevate substantially soon, economics come into play. As over 90% of the ranges in the US are 100 yds., finding a 600 yd. range, and especially a 1000 yd. range could be a chore. I had a 700 VLS changed out a few years ago, had the action blue printed, a match grade Douglas #7, 26", 8 twist barrel put on, HS Precision magazine slapped on, bedded with Marine Tex, a Jewel trigger as icing on the cake. Put a Super Snipe 20X on top, use 1/2 paste on dots on computer paper for POA, and have a blast at 100 yds. Got my 77SMK's up to 2985 fps. at the muzzle [could go faster but why?] and get my groups at 3's. Have lucked out and had a few 2's but a touch of arthritis, bi-focals, and getting a whole lot older means I have to lower my expectations a whole lot. I can get half inch groups all day long with a stock 700 VLS in .308 with my hand loads, and one holers with 168 FGGM, but the price of those things are ridiculous for the average shooter. Save your nickels and dime, do your research, have one built, get into hand loading, and look forward to a lifetime of fun.

I would go with a .223 but I just hate to buy it an it not do what i need it to do. Since i dont reload, an honestly prolly wont anytime soon. We have a farm to shoot on so really i can try to go out as far as I want,lol. It kinda seems that the .308 from what I have read is going to make it the easiest to get out to 500yrds without having to handload. The shells are a more pricy but ill just save my brass incase I do start to reload.

 

[ViperJock]

Didn't someone win a 1000 yd. match at Perry awhile back with a .223? That should lend substance to what the average person needs for a bench rest gun. They produce minimal recoil compared to the larger calibers, a whole lot cheaper to shoot, and with prices set to elevate substantially soon, economics come into play. As over 90% of the ranges in the US are 100 yds., finding a 600 yd. range, and especially a 1000 yd. range could be a chore. I had a 700 VLS changed out a few years ago, had the action blue printed, a match grade Douglas #7, 26", 8 twist barrel put on, HS Precision magazine slapped on, bedded with Marine Tex, a Jewel trigger as icing on the cake. Put a Super Snipe 20X on top, use 1/2 paste on dots on computer paper for POA, and have a blast at 100 yds. Got my 77SMK's up to 2985 fps. at the muzzle [could go faster but why?] and get my groups at 3's. Have lucked out and had a few 2's but a touch of arthritis, bi-focals, and getting a whole lot older means I have to lower my expectations a whole lot. I can get half inch groups all day long with a stock 700 VLS in .308 with my hand loads, and one holers with 168 FGGM, but the price of those things are ridiculous for the average shooter. Save your nickels and dime, do your research, have one built, get into hand loading, and look forward to a lifetime of fun.

I bet that the someone who won the 1000yd at camp perry with a .223 had more than a little experience and practice. I'm guessing that their skills were "significantly" above average.... OK, so it was me. (NOT likely in this life)

I guess what I am saying is that if I was just getting into long range and wanted to shoot that far, I would go bigger, cause it would be easier to get there faster. AND THEN once I could do it with a .308 or 300WM and wanted a bigger challenge, I might go down to a .223 and try it.

Lots of ways to consider it. Good luck to the OP in his decision.

 

[sgreen3]

Thanks Viper, Very good point. That seems to be the thought behind the bigger caliber.