open carry stopped by hobart pd while pumping gas

[JettaKnight]

Oh and sorry for the sideways idk how to fix it. I recorded it staight up and down.

Sideways camera I can live with. Officer doofus's backward cap, however...


...24 pages later...

Wait, there's not much to this? Am I missing something? Cops stops you, runs a quick check, and send you on your way without an Officer Maxey style verbal beatdown and we got 24 pages?



The only thing I see wrong here is Officer Doofus coonfingers your weapon and you use a passive aggressive tone, i.e. "Why am I being detained?" and giving him grief for asking for a driver's license.

If someones ltch becomes invalid I believe its leos job to go get it. Can someone post something that says we must provide a VALID ltch? Or does it say we must posses a ltch? But either way were fittin to find out

Huh? What lead you to believe that? I'd take umbrage at paying cops to run around all over town trying to collect invalid copies of Larry's (Larries?). And besides, it not hard to forge one...

Like it or not, if it's not valid, then you are committing a crime by carrying without a license.

So, unless the cop can't run a quick check, how do you determine if it's valid?

 

[Rookie]

So, unless the cop can't run a quick check, how do you determine if it's valid?

Not my problem.

 

[JettaKnight]

So, unless the cop can't run a quick check, how do you determine if it's valid?

Not my problem.

OK, now I understand why there's 24 pages of banality.

So to go along with the OC/CC debate we now have a LTCH visual check only vs. DL database lookup fight?

Ugh.

I'm out.

[video=youtube;MVYA-WS56J8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVYA-WS56J8&feature=kp[/video]

 

[Mr. Habib]

The courts have ruled that once a valid LTCH is produced, than all questioning about the gun must cease. The officer can call in the license # to verify it. I am not required under the law to produce any other form of ID or answer any questions. If the officer cannot do his job with the tools provided by the legislature , that is not my problem. Perhaps he should seriously consider changing careers to something more closely alined with his skill set.

 

[sj kahr k40]

Disappointed the OP didn't say "don't taze me bro" at least once, always say that when filming!

 

[KG1]

He was detained for carrying a firearm which is a crime in the state of Indiana. The detention was only for the time that it took for the officer to verify the LTCH, this providing affirmative defense to breaking the law.

Guilty until you can prove your innocence. Kinda bass ackwards.

 

[dansgotguns]

The courts have ruled that once a valid LTCH is produced, than all questioning about the gun must cease. The officer can call in the license # to verify it. I am not required under the law to produce any other form of ID or answer any questions. If the officer cannot do his job with the tools provided by the legislature , that is not my problem. Perhaps he should seriously consider changing careers to something more closely alined with his skill set.

Ok this is my thoughts too, could be wrong not saying its correct just my impression. Can you cite anything to support?

 

[long coat]

Didn't the LEO screw up when he said "don't reload till I leave" & when he wanted you to cover it?

Indiana Code 35-47-11.1

 

[Mr. Habib]

Ok this is my thoughts too, could be wrong not saying its correct just my impression. Can you cite anything to support?

Per Indiana law, one is only required to ID one's self if they have committed an infraction or ordnance violation, see Adam Starr v State of Indiana. One is only required to present a DL while operating a motor vehicle. Don't recall the IC for that, but it may be referenced in Starr. In Richardson v Indiana the court ruled that once a valid LTCH is produced then all questioning about the gun must cease. Hope that helps.

 

[dansgotguns]

Per Indiana law, one is only required to ID one's self if they have committed an infraction or ordnance violation, see Adam Starr v State of Indiana. One is only required to present a DL while operating a motor vehicle. Don't recall the IC for that, but it may be referenced in Starr. In Richardson v Indiana the court ruled that once a valid LTCH is produced then all questioning about the gun must cease. Hope that helps.

Yea but poaseaion of handgun is infraction

 

[ryancantshoot]

So in practical application it seems there is no reason to carry the pink card at all. correct?

 

[Mr. Habib]

Didn't the LEO screw up when he said "don't reload till I leave" & when he wanted you to cover it?

Indiana Code 35-47-11.1

Yes he did. If he ordered the OP to cover it up or in anyway mandated how the gun was carried, I believe that stating that it must remain unloaded until the officer left would also apply, then 35-47-11.1 would apply. If true, then the OP could, and in my opinion should, seek legal counsel to pursue the financial compensation allowed under the law.

 

[Rookie]

Yea but poaseaion of handgun is infraction

Nope. It's a misdemeanor. Or a felony depending where you are.

 

[dansgotguns]

Ok last two poats were interesting. But can anyone site anything stating or implying mere possession and giving the officer ltch enough to ens the stop?

 

[Rookie]

Already did...

 

[Rookie]

IC 35-47-2-24

Indictment or information; defendant's burden to prove exemption or license; arrest, effect of production of valid license, or establishment of exemption
Sec. 24. (a) In an information or indictment brought for the enforcement of any provision of this chapter, it is not necessary to negate any exemption specified under this chapter, or to allege the absence of a license required under this chapter. The burden of proof is on the defendant to prove that he is exempt under section 2 of this chapter, or that he has a license as required under this chapter.
(b) Whenever a person who has been arrested or charged with a violation of section 1 of this chapter presents a valid license to the prosecuting attorney or establishes that he is exempt under section 2 of this chapter, any prosecution for a violation of section 1 of this chapter shall be dismissed immediately, and all records of an arrest or proceedings following arrest shall be destroyed immediately.

 

[dansgotguns]

Already did...

I get what your saying rookie, but what about this crud about validating

l feel like your saying if I give the pink card (only the pink card as starr vs indiana I believe u said) it should be enough to use radio to radio in ltch number and validate it that way. Correct? Then radio says all good and we go out separate ways

 

[Mr. Habib]

That's the way it SHOULD work, however, as you've seen, it doesn't always.

 

[Rookie]

Validation isn't your problem. Look at your LTCH, it has identifiers on it (height, weight, etc). Officer has enough info on the LTCH to check if it's valid.

You gave him your drivers license. Do you think he used it to validate your LTCH? Nope, he ran it for warrants. He can do the same with your LTCH.

You have to produce drivers license if you're accused of an infraction or ordinance violation. Carrying without a valid LTCH is neither.

 

[Mr. Habib]

Validation isn't your problem. Look at your LTCH, it has identifiers on it (height, weight, etc). Officer has enough info on the LTCH to check if it's valid.

You gave him your drivers license. Do you think he used it to validate your LTCH? Nope, he ran it for warrants. He can do the same with your LTCH.

You have to produce drivers license if you're accused of an infraction or ordinance violation. Carrying without a valid LTCH is neither.

You have to ID yourself. DL is only one way to do it.