Police shoot and kill armed 8th grader at Texas school

[ArmedProgrammer]

I see your point, and see the difference between self defense and stopping a threat to others. And yeah, that's a particularly tough sort of go/no go decision. If I was a teacher, or a pilot, or [insert occupation here], I would want to carry as I do today. For self defense, and that of those I care about. If I was a teacher, I would like to think that my students would get the same protection that my children would get were they standing beside me. Of course - it's easy to say what one would do - when one's not looking at the wrong end of the dangerous situation!

Crappy choice to have to make, crappy situation. As others have said, prayers for the guy that had to make that split second decision.

 

[phylodog]

What a nightmare.

 

[phatgemi]

Texas 8th Grader Killed by Police

Dupe thread. My bad. Man I cant scoop any news. Sorry guys.

 

[Pocketman]

... Police are trained, conditioned if you will, to neutralize a danger. ...

Really, you believe this?

When I was in the Marine Corps I fired thousands of rounds a day in training. When I was a reserve police officer it was one trip a year to the range, 65 rounds. Many police officers know less about firearms than many on this board. DEA officers that shoot themselves in a class room, troopers that leave their service weapons in the head at Lowe's, city officers that lose bagfuls of pistols. These are the guys that are trained, conditioned to neutralize a danger?

This is not cop bashing by any stretch. There are well trained officers. There are poorly trained officers. I will assume that the worst and dumbest is rolling to an event where my life or someone I love is in danger until the responding officer proves otherwise. YMMV.

You'll reserve judgment other than to conjecture that this could be the story of some National Guard junior Rambo reserve cop getting his "first kill". Nice.

You are correct. Training doesn't always equate to proficiency and there are all kinds of police officers. My point is, an officer is likely to better handle such a situation than a teacher. Wasn't at the school today and do not want to pass judgement.

When I was a young LEO, I encountered a 16 year old brandishing a handgun in a school parking lot. I had cover. He was in the open. He dropped the gun when ordered and all turned out well. To this day, I do not know if I would have shot him over what turned out to be a toy.

Since reading this story, I've mentally gone through my perception of today's scenario and am thankful I am not in the Texas officer's shoes.

 

[sgreen3]

Dupe

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...nd_kill_armed_8th_grader_at_texas_school.html

 

[marshallartist]

No second guessing here. I'm just thankful that I didn't have to make that decision and my kids were not involved.

 

[blamecharles]

No second guessing here. I'm just thankful that I didn't have to make that decision and my kids were not involved.

Agreed there is no second guessing from me either. If someone is pointing a gun at me with unknown intentions then sorry for you pal. I used to drive a semi for a living and had to prepare for what ifs on that job as well, for instance what if a deer jumps in front of me or a cow or a car or a kid. I know which ones I'm swerving from before I get Into that situation.am I going to respond the way I think I am? Maybe and maybe not but that isn't going to be where I think about it for the first time.

 

[Mr Evilwrench]

If you (as a person in authority) have drawn down on him and order him to drop it and he doesn't, the only possible logical interpretation is refusal, and you have to conclude bad intentions from that. At that age, you should expect him to know better, but he has a farkin gun. He may not be up to adult standards of behavior, but this isn't a couple of kids smacking each other with shovels in a sandbox. Not something I'd want to remember every time I closed my eyes, but I think I could keep convincing myself I was justified.

 

[MAJB Retired]

How stupid! If you shoot, you shoot to kill, not wound!

 

[HeadlessRoland]

Poor judgment on the part of the kid.
Malicious or not, he should have dropped the weapon when ordered.

 

[joshua_xdm]

Should a 15 year old be a 10th grader? I take it he wasn't a star student.

i 15 year old in 10th, must be doin somethin right. i was only 15 in 9th. and i was one of the youngest

 

[RBrianHarless]

Will be interesting what the Texas Rangers find in their investigation. Sad that the boy was put down but with all the training LEO's recieve, I am sure they responded with the appropriate force as they deemed necessary. Looking at the photo I would have thought it to be a Springfield XD instead of a Glock copy?

+1 on the comment made that a 15 year old can kill just as easily as a 25 year old. Kids have better accuracy today with all their "first person shooter" games on XBOX or PS3.

 

[indykid]

Just read that the kid had a "pellet gun"!!!! And yes, they can shoot you as dead as the real deal.


Police Shoot, Kill Teenager Holding Pellet Gun In Texas Middle School | Fox News

 

[swany11]

Just read that the kid had a "pellet gun"!!!! And yes, they can shoot you as dead as the real deal.


Police Shoot, Kill Teenager Holding Pellet Gun In Texas Middle School | Fox News

I sure hope the people that read pellet gun in the headline are smart enough to realize the officers have no way of knowing what type of gun it is. And I applaud the mother for not automatically blaming the police, but asking why her son put himself in that situation.

 

[Denny347]

What goes through kid's heads these days? What in his background would warrant this action? When confronted by the police, why didn't he comply? Obviously his plan was moot whatever it was. Why did the police shoot to kill and not to wound? I wasn't there but these are legitimate questions that an investigation should answer. More info is needed before an nobjective opinion can be rendered.

You know we do not shoot to kill, we shoot to stop. Taking a bullet anywhere in your body can be fatal...they just don't belong in there. Firearms are NOT less-lethal and firing it is considered deadly force and if they don't well, they are truly lucky.

 

[Mr Evilwrench]

Is gun. Is dangerous. Shot placement is key, but it's not all that predictable. If you fire at the pistol, you could hit the aorta. If you fire at the aorta, you could hit the left wrist. You start shooting, and stop when there is no threat. And you're rationally able to recognize that. Several shots may elapse before it gets through to you the guy isn't going to be hurting anyone anymore. You have to be able to understand that when things are out of control, you won't be in control. Monday morning quarterbacks are entitled to an opinion, but it doesn't count.

 

[tac-safe]

I agree...you train to stop the threat Not shoot to wound. I hope everything works out in the end. What are kids thinking these days? Why didn't he just comply with the officer's commands.

Be Safe!
San Antonio CHL

 

[Titanium_Frost]

You know we do not shoot to kill, we shoot to stop. Taking a bullet anywhere in your body can be fatal...they just don't belong in there. Firearms are NOT less-lethal and firing it is considered deadly force and if they don't well, they are truly lucky.

Exactly. "Shooting to wound" is a ridiculous thought brought on by TV and bad news media. Ever try to shoot something as small as a hand or leg at distance? Ever try to shoot something that small while moving and under stress? Ever stop and think that if you only wound someone who wants to kill you that they won't just shoot you back?

Its tragic for sure, but I don't blame the cops.

 

[finnegan]

The picture they put out of the pellet gun pretty much seals this one. No orange tip, trigger safety, and looks like a hogue grip possibly. I would have seen that and went "Glock." Can't find fault with the cops on mistaking that for the real thing in this one, in my opinion. Here is a website you can get them at (and yes I'm sure you aren't supposed to have them without the orange tip) that was in the top 10 searches for "Glock Pellet Gun":

http://www.surplusandadventure.com/...ring-airsoft/glock-17-airsoft-gun-279799.html

 

[strahd71]

i dont know if the pellet guns makes it better or worse. pellet gun looks better for the kid in some ways, worse for the cops in some ways, but worse mentally maybe for the cops who did the shooting.

sad, sad, sad

jake