Question to LEO's only

[snowman46919]

If you tell your kid you're going to take him to a movie with every intent to do so, then get called in to work or get hit by a bus on your way home and are unable to, did you "lie" to him?

I am pretty sure the sheriff didnt get hit by a bus or called to work lets be realistic, but to answer your question yes my kid would feel like I lied to him. He may understand the circumstances but he is still going to feel I was dishonest... well unless a bus hit me

 

[iChokePeople]

The question isn't whether your child will have his feelings hurt, it's whether you "lied" to him. The circumstances don't matter in the least, based on YOUR definition.

 

[snowman46919]

The question isn't whether your child will have his feelings hurt, it's whether you "lied" to him. The circumstances don't matter in the least, based on YOUR definition.

And I still said yes he would feel I lied to him...

 

[iChokePeople]

OK, if whether he "feels" like you lied is the standard, I get where you're coming from. I completely disagree about the nature of "lying", but if the only part that matters in your point of view is how one person FEELS, then there's no point in further discussion about it from me. Good luck.

 

[snowman46919]

OK, if whether he "feels" like you lied is the standard, I get where you're coming from. I completely disagree about the nature of "lying", but if the only part that matters in your point of view is how one person FEELS, then there's no point in further discussion about it from me. Good luck.

Honesty is honesty in my book, cut and dry plain and simple you say your going to do something outside of getting hit by a bus you do it. There isn't any feelings to it. Conversely if you say your not going to do something then you don't do it cut and dry.

 

[iChokePeople]

My standard is a little lower, I guess -- in my book "lying" requires the KNOWLEDGE that you're saying something that's not true. If you say something with the belief that it's true, and it turns out that it isn't, you're MISTAKEN. If circumstances change and and you later change your mind, again, in MY book, you 'changed your mind'. Unless you said it with the knowledge that it wasn't true, to me, that doesn't equal "lie".

 

[snowman46919]

My standard is a little lower, I guess -- in my book "lying" requires the KNOWLEDGE that you're saying something that's not true. If you say something with the belief that it's true, and it turns out that it isn't, you're MISTAKEN. If circumstances change and and you later change your mind, again, in MY book, you 'changed your mind'. Unless you said it with the knowledge that it wasn't true, to me, that doesn't equal "lie".

Fair enough but would you not explain those circumstances to the subject of the mistaken statement for the fact that they wouldn't feel lied to?

 

[theweakerbrother]

Did you hit the record button on your cell phone? Would anything happen if you caught the police officer saying he wont ticket you and then he comes back with a ticket? If you took it to court, he says you didn't and then you produce evidence that says otherwise?

My guess is no. I don't know how these things work.

 

[iChokePeople]

Depends on the situation, I suppose. If he was a nice guy, and if I was having a good day, and if I had time to spare, probably. If I thought he was a ****, even MORE likely, just because I'd enjoy seeing his butthurt expression and making it clear that it was HIS(/her) fault. If it was my kid from the previous examples, definitely. Well, on the bus thing, I guess that would be 'maybe, depending on whether I lived', etc. But maybe, just maybe, while he was running your info, he got called on the radio and needed to hurry off. Or maybe he got a call from his wife telling him she was leaving with his brother. Or maybe he heard an ad for a sale on donuts (no offense, LEOs, just playing here...) In any case, for MY definition of 'lying', that's not the issue. Me, i'm not much of a 'feelings' guy, so I would not tell you that I'd definitely make the effort to explain or placate.

 

[XMil]

Cute internet pictures: When you know you're wrong and you don't really have anything intelligent to say.

 

[KG1]

Cute internet pictures: When you know you're wrong and you don't really have anything intelligent to say.

Denny, I believe your phone is ringing.

 

[jsharmon7]

Oh man, it's the laughs here that keep me coming back! The irony is thick.

 

[XMil]

Oh man, it's the laughs here that keep me coming back! The irony is thick.

I thought we established that a picture is the proper method for that.

 

[Denny347]

Cute internet pictures: When you know you're wrong and you don't really have anything intelligent to say.

Based on your original post I figured pictures is about all you'd understand.

 

[public servant]

You could try typing slower.


OP...I think he should have told you why the circumstances changed. he didn't, though. Don't lose sleep over it.

 

[88GT]

"I WILL" is an implied promise. I don't remember any qualifications to that promise being made after the implied promise. No 'unless your record comes back ****ty' or 'unless writing you one meets my quota.' One would think that one's own integrity would require one to explain the deviation from the stated plan of action so as to avoid issues likes this. "I know I said I wasn't going to ticket you, but ....."

And if you don't think it's lying, try telling your wife you'll do something, and then not doing it without providing an explanation.

 

[public servant]

And if you don't think it's lying, try telling your wife you'll do something, and then not doing it without providing an explanation.

In the event your husband or significant other didn't do something they said they would...do you run around calling them a liar or do you simply ask why they did not do it.

Again...the OP probably should have been told why the circumstances changed. But the OP should have asked him why he was writing the ticket now.

 

[snowman46919]

Definitely not losing any sleep over it, I honestly wasn't trying to stir the pot just wondered if it had occurred with any here before. It was naive of me to think an innocent question could remain as such. I have strep throat and up until yesterday I didn't have anything for the pain of the open aching sores in my throat and it made me a bit grumpy combined with the not eating. I am paying the ticket next week. Anybody that feels like they need to make a quota give me your jurisdiction and I will give you a vehicle description and plate number and come say hi.

 

[thebishopp]

Seems the seatbelt law is merely a money generator for the state. I think it's time to get rid of some of these ridiculous laws.

If I choose not to wear my seatbelt that is my choice and my choice alone. Although I do wear it and when I have children they will... when they become an adult they should have that choice.

When I went through the police academy in Kentucky back in the 90s there was an instructor there (I think his last name was Henderson - it was remarked that he actually helped write some of the Kentucky Revised Statutes - he was very old).

Anyway. Part of the legal course that he taught touched on seat belts. He asked us why did we think we had a seat belt law in KY.

Of course many talked about accidents and safety and all that.

He told us, "NO". The reality was that KY received a kick back from the insurance companies in exchange for having the law. He was dead serious. He then speculated about the constitutionality of the law for a few minutes.

I can see the logic in it though. If seat belts help reduce the chance of serious injury then it reduces the pay out insurance companies have to make, also (and what I think is more likely the reason), if there is a law saying you are required to wear a seat belt, and you are in an accident and found not to be wearing it, you are in violation of the law. As such they may be able to deny any claim based on that fact. Either way it is a win win for both the state and the insurance company to have such a law in place.

Like I said, this guy was a pretty well respected lawyer and DOCJT legal instructor (he had to be older than dirt already when I went through his class).

Just thought this story might have some relevance to your comment.

 

[Mens Rea]

This may have been already stated but two words sums it up easily = Officer discretion.

Let the flaming begin! LOL