Revolver gunsmith for USPSA set up

[partyboy6686]

Hummmm Good point.

Lets see a new shooter shooting a Revolver on the Misfits. What could possibly go wrong

He'll see Open and PCC shooter's never do a reload and say screw revolver.

 

[Bosshoss]

He'll see Open and PCC shooter's never do a reload and say screw revolver.

That's what usually happens

 

[vvk]

Bosshoss, obojohn - thank you for the tips. I have decided to sell Dan Wesson and 1 or 2 other plastic guns and buy a more suitable revolver.

 

[Water63]

Bosshoss, obojohn - thank you for the tips. I have decided to sell Dan Wesson and 1 or 2 other plastic guns and buy a more suitable revolver.

vvk I bought a S&W 627 off Dog 1 that Bosshoss worked his magic on. It is a wonder to shoot as a matter of fact I outshot my STI Edge today in steel challenge with it. You are in Carmel another option for you is to contact Alaskan454 he runs the Steel and ICORE matches at Wildcat Valley Rifle and Pistol just outside of Lafayette. He has made the same offer that Bosshoss has made you to several guys. We had a couple shooters today from Carmel area so you might run into someone you know. There will be a ICORE match the 4th Saturday of every other month so June 24th should be the next match.
I invite you to the ICORE match if nothing more than to see what the guys are running. I ran a stock 686 but you will need 6+ speedloaders so a moon clip gun is a good option and like they told you a 6 shot gun is a disadvantage in USPSA but in ICORE the classic is limited to 6 rounds.

Good luck on your quest come see us in June at WCVRP.

 

[Alaskan454]

I'll second that, if you want to try revolver I've got a 929 or GP100 rig you can borrow at our next ICORE match. I was planning on shooting a 3" classic gun anyway.

 

[vvk]

Water63, thank you for the tips regarding and info regarding ICORE at Lafayette.

Alaskan454, thank you for your generous offer to shoot your 929 at the next ICORE match! If I don't buy a suitable revolver by that time, I will definitely make use of it. I really appreciate the offer!

I am currently considering which 627 revolver to buy. There are quite a few used 627 pro 4 inch revolvers available and they are quite a bit cheaper than 627 PC 5 inch revolvers. Does 1 inch in barrel length make a significant difference in competition? What about 929 with its 6.5 inch barrel? Does it have any advantage other than it shoots cheaper 9mm and reloads are easier than with 627. Does 929 allow faster follow up shots in comparison with 627 pro? I am somewhat in favor of a shorter barrel in case I decide to take it to the woods. I think shorter barrel is more practical.

 

[Alaskan454]

In my personal opinion there is no particular advantage to the 627 vs 929. You can load both quickly with good moonclips and the 627 can run a variety of 38 based cartridges. As for barrel length, I shoot my 3" guns just as well as the 6.5" ones. I would pick up a gun you will shoot more often, familiarity is more important than anything else.

 

[BJones]

I have shot USPSA revolver with a 627 and a 929. They are both fun, whatever you get make sure its an 8 shot revolver. Both the 627 and 929 are fun to shoot. Alaskan54 is right, buy the gun you will shoot the most.

 

[vvk]

Thanks everyone for the comments! This is very helpful information.

What about the performance center vs pro diffences for the 627 model in terms of competition? There's not a huge difference in price, but I am in favor of the pro model due to a shorter barrel length of 4 inches (vs 5 inch for performance center), and the pro model is also cheaper (double bonus) unless of course the performance center upgrade would lead to better results in competition. Does performance center model shoots better in any way that is meaningful for competition?

 

[Bosshoss]

The PRO and PC guns are the same inside. Pro has a standard front cylinder lockup and PC has a ball detent front lockup. The difference in barrel length makes a SLIGHT difference in accuracy due to longer sight radius. You would have to shoot a lot to get to the point where it mattered. The longer barrel is easier to make minor for USPSA(although every gun is different and I have seen 4" guns run higher velocity than 5" guns with the same loads).
The 4" gun is a little cheaper than the 5" gun but the 5" is worth more when/if you sale it. The demand for the 5" is way higher than the 4" (for competition at least) which makes the PC gun easier to sell.
Both take the same amount of work/money to make a good competition revolver out of them.
5" PC for the win IMO.

 

[Slawburger]

Bosshoss is wise in the ways of the revolver.
His squadding choices are a little dubious though.

 

[vvk]

The PRO and PC guns are the same inside. Pro has a standard front cylinder lockup and PC has a ball detent front lockup. The difference in barrel length makes a SLIGHT difference in accuracy due to longer sight radius. You would have to shoot a lot to get to the point where it mattered. The longer barrel is easier to make minor for USPSA(although every gun is different and I have seen 4" guns run higher velocity than 5" guns with the same loads).
The 4" gun is a little cheaper than the 5" gun but the 5" is worth more when/if you sale it. The demand for the 5" is way higher than the 4" (for competition at least) which makes the PC gun easier to sell.
Both take the same amount of work/money to make a good competition revolver out of them.
5" PC for the win IMO.

Thank you for the detailed response. I will buy the 627PC then. How much money is needed to make a good competition revolver out of 627PC?

 

[Bosshoss]

Like everything else "that depends".
A full competition action job is $250 and add $25 for return shipping if you can't or don't want to pickup.
Picking up is a good idea because I will spend a couple of hours with you showing you how to maintain and adjust the revolver and cover things like moonclips and other items you will need.
My competition action jobs include A radical hammer cutting(lightening) and chamfering of the cylinder. Blueprint all the action parts and polishing. I will make minor adjustments to the timing and other out of tolerance parts if needed. If there is a major problem with the gun which is rare but happens, the gun will go back to S&W for them to fix as I don't feel I should fix their mistakes. This will add time as S&W is usually quick but still takes time. Very few have to go back.
Front sight(fiber optic) will be extra above the action work.
Cylinder release is a personal preference item but I have several that you can try to see which one works best for you.
Cylinder release is extra cost above action work.
Grips are also a personal preference item. I can recommend some but there are way to many for me to stock them.
I have cheaper action work but they will be heavier trigger pull weights.
Be advised that my competition action jobs are set up to run fully seated Federal primers ONLY.
If you want to run different primers then the trigger pull will be heavier.

 

[m_deaner]

Bosshoss is the way to go for a competition setup. He did my 929 and the difference is night and day.

 

[vvk]

Like everything else "that depends".
A full competition action job is $250 and add $25 for return shipping if you can't or don't want to pickup.
Picking up is a good idea because I will spend a couple of hours with you showing you how to maintain and adjust the revolver and cover things like moonclips and other items you will need.
My competition action jobs include A radical hammer cutting(lightening) and chamfering of the cylinder. Blueprint all the action parts and polishing. I will make minor adjustments to the timing and other out of tolerance parts if needed. If there is a major problem with the gun which is rare but happens, the gun will go back to S&W for them to fix as I don't feel I should fix their mistakes. This will add time as S&W is usually quick but still takes time. Very few have to go back.
Front sight(fiber optic) will be extra above the action work.
Cylinder release is a personal preference item but I have several that you can try to see which one works best for you.
Cylinder release is extra cost above action work.
Grips are also a personal preference item. I can recommend some but there are way to many for me to stock them.
I have cheaper action work but they will be heavier trigger pull weights.
Be advised that my competition action jobs are set up to run fully seated Federal primers ONLY.
If you want to run different primers then the trigger pull will be heavier.

I have sold my dan wesson and placed on order for 627PC. It's used, but the seller claims it's unfired and brand new. I don't care if this is true since I saved 200+ over the retail price. This does mean that if there's a major problem, S&w won't take for warranty work since I am not the original buyer. But let's hope for the better.

I will be contacting you regarding action work when I get the revolver in my hands, probably end of next week.

Regarding federal primers only set up, I would prefer the gun to run with all primers even if it means a heavier pull. How much heavier does it have to be and how does it compare to the factory pull weight?

I also have a 629 44 magnum revolver that I bought new, but I have never fired it. Obviously this cannot be used in competition, or at least I wouldn't want to do that, but can it be set similarly to 627 in terms of trigger pull? I would like my competition training to carry over to the other revolver.

 

[Seancass]

I'll let Bosshoss answer your questions, but I'll throw in another endorsement! My 929 is a very early model and the factory trigger was garbage. Felt like it was full of gravel/sand. Bosshoss cleaned it up and it's great now!

I've never used a speedloader gun in USPSA, but I have in steel and ICORE. They're a lot of fun but a lot of work!

 

[vvk]

I'll let Bosshoss answer your questions, but I'll throw in another endorsement! My 929 is a very early model and the factory trigger was garbage. Felt like it was full of gravel/sand. Bosshoss cleaned it up and it's great now!

I've never used a speedloader gun in USPSA, but I have in steel and ICORE. They're a lot of fun but a lot of work!

Are you shooting your 929 in ICORE? I thought it must be a 6 shot revolver. Or you are allowed to load 6 rounds in 929?

 

[Seancass]

ICORE is friendly to 6 and 8 shot guns! The stages are usually six-shot-friendly so that eight-shooters don't have an extra advantage.

ICORE Divisions:
Classic: 6-shots, speed loaders
Limited: 8-shots, moon clips, iron sights,
Open: Optic sights(red dot) and/or compensator/ports
Limited-6: 6-shots, moon clips, iron sights (this is a newer division)

That's almost the entire rule book for what's allowed in each division. For example, you could throw an optic on and compete in Open with six shot gun if that's what you feel like!(I've seen that several times)

Alaskan454 puts on a good match near Lafayette and I hope you attend! It looks like the next one will either be long stages or challenging stages! However, I think ICORE is a very welcoming, run-what-ya-brung and Have Fun sport!

 

[Bosshoss]

Are you shooting your 929 in ICORE? I thought it must be a 6 shot revolver. Or you are allowed to load 6 rounds in 929?

8 shot guns are used in limited and open.
6 shot moonclipped guns shoot in limited 6 division.
6 shot speedloader guns run in classic.

 

[Bosshoss]

I have sold my dan wesson and placed on order for 627PC. It's used, but the seller claims it's unfired and brand new. I don't care if this is true since I saved 200+ over the retail price. This does mean that if there's a major problem, S&w won't take for warranty work since I am not the original buyer. But let's hope for the better.

I will be contacting you regarding action work when I get the revolver in my hands, probably end of next week.

Regarding federal primers only set up, I would prefer the gun to run with all primers even if it means a heavier pull. How much heavier does it have to be and how does it compare to the factory pull weight?

I also have a 629 44 magnum revolver that I bought new, but I have never fired it. Obviously this cannot be used in competition, or at least I wouldn't want to do that, but can it be set similarly to 627 in terms of trigger pull? I would like my competition training to carry over to the other revolver.

FWIW I have seen S&W do warranty work on guns that have had several owners. Seems that it depends on who you get and how you handle it. I tell everyone to NOT tell them you bought the gun used. If previous owner sent in the warranty card that would be the only way they could tell. They still have fixed some that had several owners and had the card sent in by one of the previous owners, no charge.

As for the primer question. I have no way to answer that as I have been asked why S&W revolvers have such a heavy DA trigger from the factory, many times. They set the gun up to run ANY primer. I have done guns for shooters and told them Federal only and they brought the gun back and said it won't run and they are using other primers. I had one person bring me some loads and some primers he was using, the primer box didn't have one word of English printed on the box, don't have a clue who made them or where they were made he just picked them up at a gun show because they were cheap and now his gun wouldn't work
A competition revolver is like a race car it can be finicky and needs to be kept clean and fed the proper fuel or it won't run.
Every gun is different but a PC gun usually averages 12 pounds DA. Some as low as 10 some as high as probably 16 as my gauge doesn't read that high.
I usually set the DA on a competition gun around 6 pounds and that is fairly forgiving and has a solid reset. They will usually will run at 5 pounds or slightly less but you have to be perfect on your loading and keeping the moonclips very flat and the gun clean. VERY unforgiving.
Some guns will run Winchesters at 6 pounds but I usually set up around 7 pounds. CCI 7 to 7.5 depends on that individual gun. As for Wolf, S&B, Tula, etc. I have no idea because I have never used them and don't know anyone who does(in competition).
Federal primers are a little harder to find but they are worth it.

The 629 could get by with a basic trigger job that will smooth it up and lighten the trigger some.