Safety requirements

[wcd]

Been going back and forth about them and disengagement of the safety. For me if I am going to have a safety it’s going to be on a 1911 and it’s going to be swept downward. No exceptions period. I have a friend that likes to play carry of the week. In that he will carry something different depending on the day of the week with out any rationale.

But to me this seems like asking for complications. Going from something that disengages Downward to something that you apply upward pressure to disengage seems like a bad idea. His feeling is that he has overcome this by training yet he has been to the range ah once two years ago.


Anyone else in the camp regardless of platform the safety needs to disengage in the same direction?

 

[WebSnyper]

Been going back and forth about them and disengagement of the safety. For me if I am going to have a safety it’s going to be on a 1911 and it’s going to be swept downward. No exceptions period. I have a friend that likes to play carry of the week. In that he will carry something different depending on the day of the week with out any rationale.

But to me this seems like asking for complications. Going from something that disengages Downward to something that you apply upward pressure to disengage seems like a bad idea. His feeling is that he has overcome this by training yet he has been to the range ah once two years ago.


Anyone else in the camp regardless of platform the safety needs to disengage in the same direction?

All striker fired carry, no manual safety, for the carry rotation for me. Same holster style, carry location, etc. Muscle memory, and no need or want to complicate anything.

That said, I'm firmly in the camp of train with what you carry. I'm not one to say by that an external safety is bad, just need to train with it.

So yes, long winded way of saying, I agree. I'm not going with a different flavor every other day. I'm not sure how folks do that.

 

[Route 45]

Vast majority of my carry is a S&W Shield Plus, no manual safety. On the odd occasion I'll carry a Glock 42 or 43x. Different makes, but pretty much the same point and click interface. It's a good idea to stay with the same basic manual of arms for a carry gun, even if you occasionally switch between brands. I've got both Glocks and M&Ps as home defense guns.

The only manual safety equipped pistols that I own are a Colt 1911A1 Competition model and a Beretta 92FS. Both are range toys, but if I had to press them into service, I'd pick either one or the other, due to the different way the safety operates. Honestly, would probably pick the Beretta and ignore the safety, since it's DA/SA. That would be closest to what I'm used to.

 

[wcd]

All striker fired carry, no manual safety, for the carry rotation for me. Same holster style, carry location, etc. Muscle memory, and no need or want to complicate anything.

That said, I'm firmly in the camp of train with what you carry. I'm not one to say by that an external safety is bad, just need to train with it.

So yes, long winded way of saying, I agree. I'm not going with a different flavor every other day. I'm not sure how folks do that.

Agreed for me i have my 1911 and a P365 in an ankle glove. When I was required to carry my 92G the de cocker got swept downwards every time which did not not matter it was force of habit in a good way.

But I am with you why invite Murphy in.

 

[wcd]

Vast majority of my carry is a S&W Shield Plus, no manual safety. On the odd occasion I'll carry a Glock 42 or 43x. Different makes, but pretty much the same point and click interface. It's a good idea to stay with the same basic manual of arms for a carry gun, even if you occasionally switch between brands. I've got both Glocks and M&Ps as home defense guns.

The only manual safety equipped pistols that I own are a Colt 1911A1 Competition model and a Beretta 92FS. Both are range toys, but if I had to press them into service, I'd pick either one or the other, due to the different way the safety operates. Honestly, would probably pick the Beretta and ignore the safety, since it's DA/SA. That would be closest to what I'm used to.

Absolutely despite the heavy first trigger pull the 92 is no slouch.

 

[snapping turtle]

Can’t use a mossburg shotgun because the safety is not where the 870 safety is. So I see what you are saying. Could I overcome it. Yes. Could it cost me a buck or duck yes. Could it cost me my life I would also have to say yes. If I had a mossburg I could easily use it over time but because I have two 870’s it will never happen. I can used dad’s browning auto 5 just fine because the safety is where god (John Moses browning) put it there. Yet I can shoot a double at the skeet range fine.

P229 and my smith model 66 same double action pull same place on hip pretty much same sight picture. I don’t see the issue here. And yes I carry a 2.5 inch model 66 revolver as a daily carry often. Not a LEO so I am comfortable with the choice. Been carrying that model 66 or the copy 30 plus years. Only really been carrying the sig for 10. So a convincing aguemwnt for carrying the same.

A smith model 5906 not the same as above but I have had it for so long muscle memory takes over. Do I think it would cost me my life? Nope. But it does not get carried much since I got the sig. always carry at 3/4 o clock same. So this is a half way approach between the same and different but I have shot the 5906’s a ton.

There was a time I would rotate guns daily. Model 60 here. Little ppk/s on Friday if I was dressed up nice like 007. Glock 22 on Tuesday. Smith model 66 Saturday. Shoulder holsters and the smith 686 if it was a driving day or a cold day. Maybe strap a 8 inch smith model 29 on a chest rig if it was deer season. Maybe a mark two target for a woods walk. Maybe a 1911 combat elite for a fancy Texas BBQ. In hind sight I think I was just showing. The guns I had. I still will woods walk with the mark two government target cause what better gun could you take.
I will admit I never thought it could cost me my life but I guess it could. I never felt under gunner but I was armed pretty well.

This is America “you do you”.
I will admit the model 60 still gets thrown in a jacket pocket if I have to run to the bank machine or to the gas station.

I have convinced myself writing this that I am on the fence about it. Figuring I must be pretty good a awareness. I can say this “life is to short to carry an ugly striker fired pistol always”

 

[wcd]

Can’t use a mossburg shotgun because the safety is not where the 870 safety is. So I see what you are saying. Could I overcome it. Yes. Could it cost me a buck or duck yes. Could it cost me my life I would also have to say yes. If I had a mossburg I could easily use it over time but because I have two 870’s it will never happen. I can used dad’s browning auto 5 just fine because the safety is where god (John Moses browning) put it there. Yet I can shoot a double at the skeet range fine.

P229 and my smith model 66 same double action pull same place on hip pretty much same sight picture. I don’t see the issue here. And yes I carry a 2.5 inch model 66 revolver as a daily carry often. Not a LEO so I am comfortable with the choice. Been carrying that model 66 or the copy 30 plus years. Only really been carrying the sig for 10. So a convincing aguemwnt for carrying the same.

A smith model 5906 not the same as above but I have had it for so long muscle memory takes over. Do I think it would cost me my life? Nope. But it does not get carried much since I got the sig. always carry at 3/4 o clock same. So this is a half way approach between the same and different but I have shot the 5906’s a ton.

There was a time I would rotate guns daily. Model 60 here. Little ppk/s on Friday if I was dressed up nice like 007. Glock 22 on Tuesday. Smith model 66 Saturday. Shoulder holsters and the smith 686 if it was a driving day or a cold day. Maybe strap a 8 inch smith model 29 on a chest rig if it was deer season. Maybe a mark two target for a woods walk. Maybe a 1911 combat elite for a fancy Texas BBQ. In hind sight I think I was just showing. The guns I had. I still will woods walk with the mark two government target cause what better gun could you take.
I will admit I never thought it could cost me my life but I guess it could. I never felt under gunner but I was armed pretty well.

This is America “you do you”.
I will admit the model 60 still gets thrown in a jacket pocket if I have to run to the bank machine or to the gas station.

I have convinced myself writing this that I am on the fence about it. Figuring I must be pretty good a awareness. I can say this “life is to short to carry an ugly striker fired pistol always”

In agreement. I am all for people carrying what ever works for them. But I think some may be fooling them selves if they think consistency does not matter. And training yeah I fired it once lol

 

[BigRed]

Been going back and forth about them and disengagement of the safety. For me if I am going to have a safety it’s going to be on a 1911 and it’s going to be swept downward. No exceptions period. I have a friend that likes to play carry of the week. In that he will carry something different depending on the day of the week with out any rationale.

But to me this seems like asking for complications. Going from something that disengages Downward to something that you apply upward pressure to disengage seems like a bad idea. His feeling is that he has overcome this by training yet he has been to the range ah once two years ago.


Anyone else in the camp regardless of platform the safety needs to disengage in the same direction?

Yep!

KISS is a good policy

 

[ditcherman]

In agreement. I am all for people carrying what ever works for them. But I think some may be fooling them selves if they think consistency does not matter. And training yeah I fired it once lol

I agree consistency does matter, and I don’t have/probably won’t have and safeties that sweep up, except for the little odd ruger sr22.
That being said, I do ok at switching between carrying a p226 SAO and a p320. Tend to do some dry fire/draws and think about what I’m doing.
I will say that trying to shoot on a timer at the range, putting some pressure on, and switching guns, the trigger reset is what gets me more than anything.

 

[jerrob]

My FS is the only handgun I own with a safety, and if I ever find a capable smith, I'll have it converted to a G. It's my nightstand gun and a platform I've ran thousands upon thousands of rounds through since 1985.
The DAOs that I edc (290RS and a J frame), are as far apart by design as it gets, but operate the same, I carry them the same, when I practice/train with one, I do with the other.
Familiarity, FOR ME, reduces opportunities to make stupid mistakes.
I remember the changeover from the 1911s to Beretta, so many of us really struggled with engaging the de-cocker while putting it into battery, an instructor showed us a method that corrected the problem and told us to do it this way everytime, I did, I still do and it hasn't been an issue for 37 years and counting.
Repetition is good sometimes.

 

[JettaKnight]

Been going back and forth about them and disengagement of the safety. For me if I am going to have a safety it’s going to be on a 1911 and it’s going to be swept downward. No exceptions period. I have a friend that likes to play carry of the week. In that he will carry something different depending on the day of the week with out any rationale.

But to me this seems like asking for complications. Going from something that disengages Downward to something that you apply upward pressure to disengage seems like a bad idea. His feeling is that he has overcome this by training yet he has been to the range ah once two years ago.


Anyone else in the camp regardless of platform the safety needs to disengage in the same direction?

Vary your bow ties, not your side arms.



My favorite disengage direction is ... not there.

 

[Amishman44]

Been going back and forth about them and disengagement of the safety. For me if I am going to have a safety it’s going to be on a 1911 and it’s going to be swept downward. No exceptions period. I have a friend that likes to play carry of the week. In that he will carry something different depending on the day of the week without any rationale.
But to me this seems like asking for complications. Going from something that disengages Downward to something that you apply upward pressure to disengage seems like a bad idea. His feeling is that he has overcome this by training yet he has been to the range ah once two years ago.
Anyone else in the camp regardless of platform the safety needs to disengage in the same direction?

I grew up with SA revolvers...and then DAO revolvers, until 9/11...when I purchased my first Glock.
I have a 1911 Commander in .45 acp and it's awesome...and is the only pistol I own that has a safety.
Even my Beretta Centurion 92-D is a DAO pistol (right set of Wolff Springs and a MCARBO trigger polish and it's buttery smooth), and I don't have to give a thought about a safety being on or off.
That being said, I don't carry either the 1911 or (rarely) the Beretta 92-D...as I prefer a snub-nosed revolver, a Glock 36, or a Glock 45 (or, occasionally, a 26 in an ankle holster)...and that's about it.
I try to keep the number of pistols in the rotation to a minimum and try to get to the range with at least one of them once a month???

 

[russc2542]

I'm with you, OP. If you must vary your carry, keep the manual of arms the same. Even if you switch DA/SA to striker, keep the safety (or lack) the same.

If you have a safety, train to use it. Not much will picker your orifice like pulling the trigger and nothing happens because you always leave the safety off and for some reason, it gets clicked on. I've seen it several times at the range and in matches. Heck I've done it myself with my bolt target guns that I never use the safety on.

Personally, push-up-to-fire safeties are the devil. slide mounted safeties are the devil. If I can't rest my right thumb on the safety while firing (a la 1911), it's the devil lol.

 

[OurDee]

My #1 rule for safety is; CARRY!

If everybody carries, There will be weapons and spare ammo all around me. Now, if you are the "one weapon only" carrier that never trains on another weapon, shame on ya. I want to be able to pick up any weapon on the grey man's battle field and use it. If I have to cross Indy on foot to get home, I need an empty bag to carry what I find. Because I will not be carrying enough from the start. Sure most confrontations end in no shots fired, and that is a win in that battle, but the war is protracted. I hope to make it through life without ever needing to fire another round. However, I'll train like I can't draw from the armory without a certified card. Yous do yous and I'll do me. You shoot a Gxxxk only? Thanks. I can shoot a Gxxxk (and well). What you gonna do with my Para Ordnance Carry 12 (what da)...... Or, how'd he uncock that loaded hammerless coachgun? Why does he have a magazine when he is carrying a revolver?
#2 rule; don't stop learning.

 

[ECS686]

Some folks just think a firearm has to have a safety (antiquated but they feel better) but not all firearms are the same. M&P Shield safety is a joke and no way you can manipulate it.

I have been issued about everything BUT a 1911 Tecolvets, Betettas, DAO Ruger and S&W (3rd Gen) Sigs and Glocks. I have my own 1911 and M&Ps and S&W 3rd Gen
The 1911 and Betetta actually can be manipulated te same way. In my YSAF days we were mandated to carry Betettas hammer down with a round chamberd and ON FIRE. I was at a training event with an LA Sheriffs Deputy who issued Berettas (late 1980’s) and he stated they were mandated to carry on safe for weapons retention. They trained to do the downward swipe with the thumb just like you do a 1911 and Betettas work the same way. (Yeah I know why not get a G model but this was before the G model was a thing)

We tried it and it does work really well IF that’s something you want in a Betetta. A S&W 3rd Gen while similar will not work like that.

And the whole “you’ll place it on safe doing slide manipulation “ is way blown out of proportion. Never was an issue but like using your back sight to work a slide off a belt it just didn’t happen in numbers to be a real thing.

As far as safety concerns it can be overrated and is user dependent.
I have seen In competition and training courses folks mess up disengaging a safety. However those same folks are generally the type that just watching their admin handling they are not proficient with basic gun handling and they usually can’t run a striker any better.

 

[Gabriel]

What's a safety?

 

[JettaKnight]

What's a safety?

Your finger.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

My FS is the only handgun I own with a safety, and if I ever find a capable smith, I'll have it converted to a G. It's my nightstand gun and a platform I've ran thousands upon thousands of rounds through since 1985.
The DAOs that I edc (290RS and a J frame), are as far apart by design as it gets, but operate the same, I carry them the same, when I practice/train with one, I do with the other.
Familiarity, FOR ME, reduces opportunities to make stupid mistakes.
I remember the changeover from the 1911s to Beretta, so many of us really struggled with engaging the de-cocker while putting it into battery, an instructor showed us a method that corrected the problem and told us to do it this way everytime, I did, I still do and it hasn't been an issue for 37 years and counting.
Repetition is good sometimes.

I've got a couple with safeties, one of which I wouldn't mind getting converted which is the Ruger P-95, they did make a decock only version but unfortunately mine isn't. The other is a S&W 39-2 which while not a safe queen does have sentimental value. The Ruger is carried hammer down, safety off when I do carry it which is rarely/never anymore.

Can I ask what that method is?

I'm with you, OP. If you must vary your carry, keep the manual of arms the same. Even if you switch DA/SA to striker, keep the safety (or lack) the same.

If you have a safety, train to use it. Not much will picker your orifice like pulling the trigger and nothing happens because you always leave the safety off and for some reason, it gets clicked on. I've seen it several times at the range and in matches. Heck I've done it myself with my bolt target guns that I never use the safety on.

Personally, push-up-to-fire safeties are the devil. slide mounted safeties are the devil. If I can't rest my right thumb on the safety while firing (a la 1911), it's the devil lol.

Agreed. When I used to carry on a regular basis a RugerP-95 there was a time or two I checked and the safety was on, not sure if I neglected to take it off after holstering or if it got bumped on. Either way there is a what if thinking involved.

 

[jerrob]

I've got a couple with safeties, one of which I wouldn't mind getting converted which is the Ruger P-95, they did make a decock only version but unfortunately mine isn't. The other is a S&W 39-2 which while not a safe queen does have sentimental value. The Ruger is carried hammer down, safety off when I do carry it which is rarely/never anymore.

Can I ask what that method is?

Agreed. When I used to carry on a regular basis a RugerP-95 there was a time or two I checked and the safety was on, not sure if I neglected to take it off after holstering or if it got bumped on. Either way there is a what if thinking involved.

Not sure 'bout the Ruger or the S&W, Beretta makes a G conversion kit. I'll need a gunsmith as the kits come with very small spring that exceed my vision and dexterity.

 

[wcd]

I'm with you, OP. If you must vary your carry, keep the manual of arms the same. Even if you switch DA/SA to striker, keep the safety (or lack) the same.

If you have a safety, train to use it. Not much will picker your orifice like pulling the trigger and nothing happens because you always leave the safety off and for some reason, it gets clicked on. I've seen it several times at the range and in matches. Heck I've done it myself with my bolt target guns that I never use the safety on.

Personally, push-up-to-fire safeties are the devil. slide mounted safeties are the devil. If I can't rest my right thumb on the safety while firing (a la 1911), it's the devil lol.

I believe you indeed you get it 1000%.


Push up to fire safeties are the devil. I could not have said it better my self.