Stop ordering fuel filters from China

[churchmouse]

" $1000 for $50 worth of machine work."
Not sure you could find those labor rates in China. Never mind here.

Is this how you see this. Seriously. Have you ever seen the process. Been a part of the process. The process being buying/leasing a building. Insuring said property against the onslaught of God knows what. Utility's and Gov. compliances. Setting the building up with power, HVAC, lights etc. Buying a single C&C machine will make most people wilt. Lathes and mills and C&C's. Add in tooling. The tooling for these metals is freaking expensive. Are you with me here yet.....

The mark up might be seem stiff but volume is not there for lower prices. Then the dealer mark up's.

And paying an operator/operators a fair wage plus benefits.

Are we there yet...……

$50 in machining. Man that is funny.

Unless I am missing something.

 

[Gaffer]

Did you mean to quote Edwea? By reading JHB's comment I think he agrees with you :>)

Ron

 

[JHB]

Retired Tool & Diemaker the last ten years I was outsourcing machining stamping die spare parts. For $50.00 they may look at the prints to give you a quote.

 

[edwea]

$50 of machining was an exaggeration. My point was that they seem over priced for what they are. Everytime I save up enough to buy a suppressor, which happens several times a year, I end up thinking "I could buy a pretty decent whole gun for this amount of money" and that's what ends up happening. It doesn't seem to me that a suppressor should cost as much or more than an entire gun when the gun has many more parts and more assembly.

 

[printcraft]

Drilling holes in my fuel filters?
Sounds like a liability thing. Wouldn't that start an engine fire?

Less restriction on the fuel flow = more horsepower. Everyone knows that.

Saw a table at the 1500 selling these and also thread adapters. Seemed like a brave business to be running and kinda sketchy.

I remember the oil filter adapter that is used for “cleaning” table. Told a guy looking after we walked off it was probably a bad idea to buy it.

 

[JHB]

CM hit the nail on the head if you never had your own business it is hard to imagine the cost involved. Guess who gets to pay the employers share of your Social Security premiums.

 

[JettaKnight]

WTF would you risk putting some cheap chinese junk on the end of your firearm?


I wouldn't buy a crappy red dot, and here's something you expect to survive a bullet traveling through it followed by the blast.

 

[Karl-just-Karl]

Some people only shop by price.

 

[Hawkeye]

Is this how you see this. Seriously. Have you ever seen the process. Been a part of the process. The process being buying/leasing a building. Insuring said property against the onslaught of God knows what. Utility's and Gov. compliances. Setting the building up with power, HVAC, lights etc. Buying a single C&C machine will make most people wilt. Lathes and mills and C&C's. Add in tooling. The tooling for these metals is freaking expensive. Are you with me here yet.....

The mark up might be seem stiff but volume is not there for lower prices. Then the dealer mark up's.

And paying an operator/operators a fair wage plus benefits.

Are we there yet...……

$50 in machining. Man that is funny.

Unless I am missing something.

Maybe if it wasn’t so restrictive to purchase them, there would be higher demand/volume, fewer barriers to entry, more competition - then, maybe, you’d see more innovation, more options, and lower prices. But I suspect I’m preaching to the choir on this.

 

[churchmouse]

Maybe if it wasn’t so restrictive to purchase them, there would be higher demand/volume, fewer barriers to entry, more competition - then, maybe, you’d see more innovation, more options, and lower prices. But I suspect I’m preaching to the choir on this.

Oh you are spot on.
When you are piece building the costs are higher if not just to make the overhead.
I am not privy to the process on the suppressors per say but spent a lot of time in and around the machine shop arena. And I own some decent equipment as well. Just tooling up can be insane spendy.
Tooling up for Inconel is seriously spendy.

In the Mid 80's I was involved with a racing team located just south of the Indy speedway. The Hendricks Motorsports GTP Corvette. Google the car...…...man it was fast. Problems keeping the engine alive at high boost from the heat generated. It would destroy the exhaust valves regardless of what we tried.
A GM engineer (Mr Goodwrench sponsored car and a GM test bed) suggested Inconel. OK lets try the material NASA developed for the rocket engine bells.
We dubbed it "Unobtainium" due to the difficulty's I buying it at that time. Then getting the blank valves made. Then machining them. Wow what a series of hurdles to jump. Local shops were not equipped to do this. Mr. Hendricks had to tool up a local engine builder t finish machine the blanks. The costs were serious.

Stop looking at the actual price unless you know it is gouged up from other shops. Look at the quality of what you want. We all want a deal. But as with anything you get what you pay for most times.

 

[Hop]

ATF seizes Maglight flashlights from Loews! Film at 11!

 

[snorko]

They are still just a fuel filter. Unless you put it on a gun. Then you'll have to get a stamp for your fuel filter. We wouldn't want any starving people to poach deer in the middle of the night.

Pic below was first result from googling "Chinese fuel filters". Clearly not a fuel filter. I believe suppressors should be an over the counter item but current law is current law. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

 

[JHB]

A decent suppressor can be made on a $3000.00 lathe by a second year trade school student if they still teach them how to run manual machines. CNC machines are another story cost wise but they will be a lot faster.
Tooling can be reasonable or expensive depending on the material used for the baffles.
Materials can be reasonable or costly depending what is used.
A manufactures license won't be cheap. You are dealing with the government.
I thought about getting the license and doing it to keep busy in retirement but the cost is high and I quit working for a reason. I hate working.

 

[Hop]

Wow, in no way is that a fuel filter!

With e-file Form 1 being quick, and Maglight tubes & freeze plugs so abundant, I don't see why you'd risk ordering one of those crappy Chi-com kits.

 

[Ggreen]

The real risk in ordering these is you cannot be sure both ends are not drilled. The monocore filters are often drilled, even without a drilled endcap it could still be seen as suppressor parts (baffles). Even with a preapproved form 1 a person cannot buy premade suppressor parts (drilled baffles or formed monocore). F the nfa, but the alphabet bois are looking to turn ignorance into felonies.

 

[churchmouse]

A decent suppressor can be made on a $3000.00 lathe by a second year trade school student if they still teach them how to run manual machines. CNC machines are another story cost wise but they will be a lot faster.
Tooling can be reasonable or expensive depending on the material used for the baffles.
Materials can be reasonable or costly depending what is used.
A manufactures license won't be cheap. You are dealing with the government.
I thought about getting the license and doing it to keep busy in retirement but the cost is high and I quit working for a reason. I hate working.

I have far less invested in my lathe but the tooling adds up and yes it could be used for this as could my mill but not to run production numbers for profit. No way. As you said.....that's work.....

 

[Ggreen]

$50 of machining was an exaggeration. My point was that they seem over priced for what they are. Everytime I save up enough to buy a suppressor, which happens several times a year, I end up thinking "I could buy a pretty decent whole gun for this amount of money" and that's what ends up happening. It doesn't seem to me that a suppressor should cost as much or more than an entire gun when the gun has many more parts and more assembly.

A decent suppressor easily costs as much as a gun. I'm not sure you understand what goes into one to make it last. Suppressors deal with extreme pressure and heat. Good ones must be laser precise from machining, to welding to coating and finishing to not reduce the accuracy of a firearm and give predictable poi at each install. There are a lot of cheap ones on the market, and some expensive ones that fail on extended use or open up your rifles groups.

Not to mention the burden of government regulation, taxation, record keeping, continual compliance.... We could probably knock 100 off of each can of they treated them like stocks or triggers.

 

[Ggreen]

I have far less invested in my lathe but the tooling adds up and yes it could be used for this as could my mill but not to run production numbers for profit. No way. As you said.....that's work.....

There is protective finishes that also must be added into the cost. Anodizing, nitriding, cerakote, whatever other treatment they want to put on the baffles. I know you understand, but very few understand what manufacturing quality actually costs now that we live in import and throw away America.

 

[churchmouse]

There is protective finishes that also must be added into the cost. Anodizing, nitriding, cerakote, whatever other treatment they want to put on the baffles. I know you understand, but very few understand what manufacturing quality actually costs now that we live in import and throw away America.

Yes. And if these coatings are not applied (depending on material used) the life of the piece is short.

 

[edwea]

A decent suppressor easily costs as much as a gun. I'm not sure you understand what goes into one to make it last. Suppressors deal with extreme pressure and heat. Good ones must be laser precise from machining, to welding to coating and finishing to not reduce the accuracy of a firearm and give predictable poi at each install. There are a lot of cheap ones on the market, and some expensive ones that fail on extended use or open up your rifles groups.

Not to mention the burden of government regulation, taxation, record keeping, continual compliance.... We could probably knock 100 off of each can of they treated them like stocks or triggers.

You are correct! I don't know what the costs of machining a suppressor are. I don't know much about the specific materials or coatings. And I agree that the limited market and hurdles to manufacturing, selling and possessing them contribute to the cost. Furthermore, I agree that if treated like other gun parts are, the cost would almost certainly be lower.