Top three Best Quality CCW (pistol) - Excluding 1911s

[JTinIN]

In a general research phase of looking at a moderate size CCW pistol and would be interest in options for a "best quality" CCW pistol. Placing primary focus on reliability, reasonable accuracy and controls (of course fit and controls are a personal interface issue). While like a nice deep royal blue with careful machining, as well as the next guy, this is for concealed carry pistol and a functional tool, so to save weight etc. don't care if it is plastic, aluminum or Ti ;-). Unless there is an over riding reason (remember did say best quality ;-), figure a cost of two grand or less should get you near the best factory production pistol there is for every day usage.

Reason 1911's are excluded, is that they are a world of their own, with a nice carry gun running several grand .... plus have a STI 9mm Lawman that playing with this year and lastly really would like a non SA carry gun as too much time is spent in the truck when at clients.

Thanks
John

P.S. If the answer turns out to be a Glock 19 or West German SIG P228, these are both good answers ;-)

 

[lucky4034]

Moderate size? I like my RAMI... and I'm guessing that a compact CZ 75b would be a great option as well. Get it tuned for CC from Cajun Gun Works or CZ Custom and its going to be tough to beat for my preferences, especially considering that gun + custom work will come in less than $1k.


(Can't imagine why someone would need a $2k carry piece?)

 

[JTinIN]

Moderate size? I like my RAMI... and I'm guessing that a compact CZ 75b would be a great option as well. Get it tuned for CC from Cajun Gun Works or CZ Custom and its going to be tough to beat for my preferences, especially considering that gun + custom work will come in less than $1k.

(Can't imagine why someone would need a $2k carry piece?)

THANKS! The compact CZ and who to tune it is spot on why I am asking and even more so had not known of the RAMI subcompact (guess need to check more OEM web sites, but easier to ask hear as I don't know the question to ask). The RAMI that looks even better for warm weather. Looks like polymer is gone, but aluminum is around. http://cz-usa.com/products/by-category/sub-compact/

Reason picked two grand, is that figure was high enough to to cut off most factory pistols, but filter some of the one of a kind custom guns.

Still not 100% locked in on a compact gun, could easily talk myself into a nice subcompact to replace the S&W J frame and be used instead of the compact gun during the summer and maybe winter (Jacket weather can always migrate back to the W. Germany SIG P220 during the late fall thru early spring or a full size HK or FN).

 

[Double T]

You don't have to spend 2k for a functional 1911 these days, but I digress.

For 2k you can get either a g19/g26 or g23/g27 carry combo for deep concealment/normal.

I can conceal the 19 without any issues, but then I also really don't give a crap if I print of it hangs out.

Have never fired a sig, but they seem a little unbalanced when I've held them.

I'd say the combo with full size mags for backup a must.

 

[rockhopper46038]

The P228 is superb. When I don't carry a 1911, I carry it. The CZ P-01 would be worth looking at, or the CZ 75 (or a clone of either, like the Canik55 Stingray-C, perhaps). If you wanted to improve either of those choices, you could send the SIG off to Bruce Gray (as I did) or the CZs/clones off to the CZ custom shop or Cajun Gun Works, or someone who does that kind of work. I'm still partial to the 1911 though, and don't think you would necessarily need to exceed your $2K budget to get one that meets your requirements - but perhaps you could expand on your comment "...and lastly really would like a non SA carry gun as too much time is spent in the truck when at clients" so I could understand that a little better.

Edit: Jeez, looks like I'm about 15 minutes late to finishing this post :noob:

 

[JTinIN]

Thanks everyone for the inputs, including who's who of smiths for the various guns.

Like the 1911s and got a STI 9mm Lawman for a little over a grand that appears to be reasonable, will let you know more later this summer when get to a thousand rounds of 147gr loadings (or what ever is the most accurate for paper punching). What would you get (or have) for a carry 1911 now days (assume for most in 45 ACP ;-)?

I have a little damage to the left hand (bone on bone contact for the thumb) so anything with a hard to pull back and small slide is marginal as may not be able cycle the slide to clear well etc. Let my Officer's model go years ago when found could not work the slide reasonable well (before know the issue). The Colt Commander was fine as are most of the plastic guns and nearly all the 9mms.

Have a nice carpeted spot in the current truck that keep a side arm, that is accessible, out of sight and the firearm is fixed in place, except for a really bad roll over. For either a cocked and locked SA auto (aka 1911) or a Glock "Safe Trigger" I am really more happy to have them on my side in a holster or possible in a holster attached to the truck (always an option but don't know how at the moment as is a smaller truck with 375K miles on it, so in another few years might change ....). If the firearm is in a holster, in the truck, when you pick it up, have to use the other hand to hold and remove the holster ... nearly as bad as having to load the chamber ;-). Thus the transition years ago to a West German SIG P220 from the 1911 when started to be in and out at different clients.

With regards to printing, there are times and places I have to tuck in my shirt and can't have the gun print ... if it does then it has to say home ... or at least in the truck.

 

[kawtech87]

Moderate size? I like my RAMI... and I'm guessing that a compact CZ 75b would be a great option as well. Get it tuned for CC from Cajun Gun Works or CZ Custom and its going to be tough to beat for my preferences, especially considering that gun + custom work will come in less than $1k.


(Can't imagine why someone would need a $2k carry piece?)

This exactly.^^^ Took the words out of my mouth. I was just thinking My CZ P-01 fits that bill perfectly with a cost of well under 1k. I just picked up a Like New unfired RAMI in a trade and I'm looking forward to getting it on the range to see how she runs.

I also really like my Ruger LCR for deep CC (also well under 1k let alone 2k). But so does my fiance and now that she is out of college for the summer she has stolen it from me again until next semester starts. Oh well Now I will have my RAMI instead.

Edt: I forgot you said 3. So I'll throw my G19 in the mix too. The Glock 19 is really hard to beat for an all around gun.

 

[worddoer]

For 2k you can get either a g19/g26 or g23/g27 carry combo for deep concealment/normal.

With that budget in mind this gets my vote.^^^^^^^^^^

Keep in mind that $$$$$$ does not equal reliability. There are many high reliability guns in the sub $1,000 price range.

Glocks are relatively inexpensive. They are easy to maintain and repair. Parts are easily accessible and inexpensive. And Glock reigns supreme in aftermarket accessories. You can easily customize the guns to fit your needs. And having magazine interchangeability between your different sized pistols can be advantageous.

If you don't like the ergo's of the Glock (Make sure to try a Gen 4 version before you give up on them), then a Smith and Wesson M&P with the similar setup could be a viable option. They seem to be equally as reliable. They don't quite have the aftermarket support that Glock does as of this writing. But they are catching up. And you might as well plan on a trigger job from day one. Most people dislike the factory trigger on the M&P and will use APEX (an aftermarket company) trigger parts. Depending on your mechanical skills, you could do this yourself. Most of the APEX parts are drop in replacements.

There could be some metal framed pistols that fit this category, but I don't have any experience on those.

Good luck in your search.

 

[JTinIN]

Difference between CZ P01 and a Compact?

Also who in Indiana (say Richmond to Ft Wayne to Lafayette to Bloomingtion/Columbus and maybe Seymour carries CZ? Have clients in Indy so get there every week

 

[kawtech87]

Difference between CZ P01 and a Compact?

P-01 has an alloy frame with a light rail and decocker.

75 Compact is steel framed and traditional 1911 style saftey but with a DA/SA option.

CZ-USA -> CZ 75 Compact

CZ-USA -> CZ P-01

Then there is the PCR which is kinda the hybrid of the two. No light rail alloy frame and decocker.

CZ-USA -> CZ 75 D PCR Compact

The P-01 is currenty in service as the Czech police sidearm and is replacing the old 75B as the service pistol being issued to over 60 countries. CZ has been making some of the highest quality firearms right up there with the US and Germany for a very long time. They have never really persued the US market because they have never really needed to.

For that reason they can be hard to find. They are only imported once a year from what I have heard and only a limited number of each of the models are included in that shipment. When they are gone, and they go fast to people who know what they are, they are gone until next year. Atleast that is what i have been told

Not sure who is a dealer for them but I know Bradis takes them when they can get them. Elmore's Ive heard is a dealer. They do have a dealer locator on thier website you could check out.

Edt: It looks like The Outdoorsman in Greenwood is the closest (to me) registered dealer in central Indiana.

 

[JTinIN]

P-01 has an alloy frame with a light rail and decocker.

75 Compact is steel framed and traditional 1911 style saftey but with a DA/SA option.

CZ-USA -> CZ 75 Compact

CZ-USA -> CZ P-01

Then there is the PCR which is kinda the hybrid of the two. No light rail alloy frame and decocker.

CZ-USA -> CZ 75 D PCR Compact

The P-01 is currenty in service as the Czech police sidearm and is replacing the old 75B as the service pistol being issued to over 60 countries. CZ has been making some of the highest quality firearms right up there with the US and Germany for a very long time. They have never really persued the US market because they have never really needed to.

For that reason they can be hard to find. They are only imported once a year from what I have heard and only a limited number of each of the models are included in that shipment. When they are gone, and they go fast to people who know what they are, they are gone until next year. Atleast that is what i have been told

Not sure who is a dealer for them but I know Bradis takes them when they can get them. Elmore's Ive heard is a dealer. They do have a dealer locator on thier website you could check out.

Edt: It looks like The Outdoorsman in Greenwood is the closest (to me) registered dealer in central Indiana.

Thanks have asked at the Outdoorsman, Elmore's and Bradis on CZs for the last couple years with mostly a no and blank face.

Bradis I will most likely not be going back to again in the near future, or if my luck holds out the rest of my life time, after being away for a few years (health issues) walked in and asked a couple basic questions that was like pulling teeth and really had the feeling that they did not have use for a 60 year guy trying to buy a handgun. Two more return visits over a half year and got even less answers, ended buying else where. but was not that big of purchase, under four grand total so probable not worth their time.

 

[snapping turtle]

1: H&K p7 (the original plastic fantastic)
2: Smith model 60 (Been working well for CC since it was intoduced)
3: Kimber Solo

All of these would work well and leave room for some custom work and holsters. Plus a good under the seat safe of some type.

The above are all good choices also. A revolver is not fool proof with time issue and the lack of overall rounds but a few speed loaders and you have as many rounds as you will need to get to a main firearm. I am of the belief that a handgun is around to get you to a primary weapon so take what I say for what it is worth about 2 cents.

With 2 grand to spend of a cc weapon I personally would go with a used but reliable pistol and a BBQ show off gun for that amount. I think a working gun like my old rossi 357 2 inch is a perfect CC weapon as I have less money in it than a full tank of gas at today's prices and for a 2 inch barrel I can still hit well at 25 yards.

 

[JTinIN]

1: H&K p7 (the original plastic fantastic)
2: Smith model 60 (Been working well for CC since it was intoduced)
3: Kimber Solo

Have the hammer less aluminum J Frame (well actually it is loaded and four inches below the keyboard as I type in the empty keyboard drawer of the desk ... before being put on when I leave with a total of eleven rounds of Hornday 125gr 38 Sp ... speed strip of six and five in the J frame).

Sold of the P7s (hard slide pull for the left hand) and never really grew into them over the last twenty years. Put always though they were the a good size and accuracy combo. They are probably really what is being replaced.

Now the Kimber Solo sounds like a Khar and maybe nicer ... another data point to research and look into. Thanks!

Thanks
John

P.S. Don't have to spend two grand, the he belt feeds always need to to have ammo ;-)

 

[Ninja1310]

You'd prefer steel/alloy? You could look into the CZ P-07 Duty if you wouldn't mind carrying polymer, it's inexpensive and a great shooter.

 

[JTinIN]

You'd prefer steel/alloy? You could look into the CZ P-07 Duty if you wouldn't mind carrying polymer, it's inexpensive and a great shooter.

Sounds like the CZ answer could easily be one of each .... LOL!

 

[Ninja1310]

Sounds like the CZ answer could easily be one of each .... LOL!

CZ make great firearms so they're always something to look into, but you can't go wrong with a glock 19 or other similar sized or smaller glock for CCW.

 

[JTinIN]

CZ make great firearms so they're always something to look into, but you can't go wrong with a glock 19 or other similar sized or smaller glock for CCW.

Was thinking of a steel CZ a couple years ago when wanted a heavier 9mm, but never find one home when I looked ... so got a STI 9mm 1911 instead (different animal and really like the trigger ;-).

Well maybe in 2014 before the next round of Gun Control Laws and a new congress make another crazy time, I can actually find a CZ or three in stock to look at.

 

[lucky4034]

I own a full size 75b stainless steel and of course my Rami.... I love them both. I think eventually I'll break down and get a SP-01 Shadow and/or a CZ97...

FYI - Here is a decked out Shadow for sale at the CZ Custom Shop CZ 75 SHADOW LINE SA DA

Obviously, everyone has a long list of guns to get... CZ's just feel so good in the hand to me.

 

[lucky4034]

Still not 100% locked in on a compact gun, could easily talk myself into a nice subcompact to replace the S&W J frame and be used instead of the compact gun during the summer and maybe winter (Jacket weather can always migrate back to the W. Germany SIG P220 during the late fall thru early spring or a full size HK or FN).

My Rami has an alloy frame... but its got some heft to it. IMO it probably won't replace your J-Frame. Its just much more substantial than some of the lightweight revolvers and single stack semi-autos out there that can be tucked away in a pocket.

 

[church]

Springfield xds .45 is a good choice!