Trump Impeachment Thread

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  • PaulF

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    1. Out of control spending? If you think Trump's spending is out of control, what are your thoughts on Obama's? Adding almost as much debt as all prior Presidents combined. (to the extent Presidents control spending)

    2. Tax cuts - long term. The long term health of America's corporations will benefit many for the long term. Half of Americans have 401k's that will benefit, and a robust economy will help many, LONG TERM. Better and higher paying jobs, long term.

    3. You really think the current economic upswing is leftovers from Obama administration?

    The rest of your points that I didn't quote contain some merit.

    Respectfully,

    Steve

    .

    Respectfully, in reply:

    1) I have never been a fan of Obama, and my lengthy post history here only supports that. I think spending has been out of control my entire life, regardless who has held the top office. I am fiercely independent, but I have tended to vote (R) because they claim to be for responsible spending...except when they are responsible for the spending.

    2) The evidence is conflicted *at best* when it comes to the long term effects of unfunded tax breaks for the wealthy...including enough wiggle room to suspect the cuts actually trigger economic crisis.

    3)No, I really don’t. I think the economy is larger than one man, and the economy we act in today is the result of decisions made sometimes years in the past. I don’t think the current economic climate has much to do with Trump at all...I think we’d be here whether Clinton or Cruz currently occupied the big chair.

    Like I said at the beginning of my post...I’m no fan of the way Obama used that office. I wanted to replace him with someone *better* than Obama. Instead, we got someone not quite as bad as HRC. To me that barely qualifies as a base hit, let alone a home run.

    I think our country is tracking the wrong path, and that Trump is heading down the same path as Obama was and Clinton would...if MAYBE at a bit slower pace. Maybe.
     

    PaulF

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    That one mystifies me. If you are a working American then one would assume you aquired your health coverage (which directly affects your 'medical expenses') through your employer. So how did those out-of-pocket expenses get so out of control? You should be able to Answer that Conundrum straight Away. As for meaningful action, did not Trump lead the charge to repeal Obamacare and allow insurance companies to sell non-compliant policies - two things that would allow premiums and deductables to fall. Do you think that your policy being required to cover birth control, mental health, sex change, everyone's children until they are 26 etc etc etc doesn't affect the cost of that policy? Do you think your employer (who pays the lion's share of the cost of your policy) isn't price sensitive? Are you upset that Trump didn't go full Quixote and attack the AMA and AHA head on? Or would you just be criticizing that failure now if he had? Do you even have any economically sound ideas for things he could do to achieve the ends you desire? What are your favored actions in that area that promise to effect your desired changes? It's the easiest thing in the world to be a back-bencher, which is why it earns such great respect

    A couple of your base assumptions are off a bit.

    I have purchased my own coverage since 2016, because I was able to buy a better policy than my employer offered at a lower premium. My policy has increased e wry year, it is still less expensive than my employer’s personal coverage and offers far more robust coverage with a much lower out-of-pocket cap.

    Obamacare offered a better policy for me, at a lower rate than my “employer subsidized” plan. Both plans costs continue to rise at an alarming rate.

    As far as a solution? IDK. The solution seems like it would either require a lot less goverment meddling...or a lot more. I really don’t know what would work here, but I imagine it will resemble how we tackle public education, with everyone having access to a publi healthcare system and those that have the means will seek out higher quality private care.
     

    Dead Duck

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    I had no idea that Making America Great Again was soooooooo baaaaaaad...... :(

    I should move to Canadia.
     

    ghitch75

    livin' in the sticks
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    he has no more of a " ego" problem than before him and a 100 times more "capable" than him too....


    i have never understood or seen this "wrong path" Trump is taking us down.....
     

    Mgderf

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    A couple of your base assumptions are off a bit.

    I have purchased my own coverage since 2016, because I was able to buy a better policy than my employer offered at a lower premium. My policy has increased e wry year, it is still less expensive than my employer’s personal coverage and offers far more robust coverage with a much lower out-of-pocket cap.

    Obamacare offered a better policy for me, at a lower rate than my “employer subsidized” plan. Both plans costs continue to rise at an alarming rate.

    As far as a solution? IDK. The solution seems like it would either require a lot less goverment meddling...or a lot more. I really don’t know what would work here, but I imagine it will resemble how we tackle public education, with everyone having access to a publi healthcare system and those that have the means will seek out higher quality private care.


    You do realize, don't you, that the only reason the A.C.A. (a.k.a. "Obama-care") offered you a lower price is because EVERYONE else is subsidizing your policy, right?
    If you didn't know this, you need to go back and do some fact checking.
    Now that the individual mandate is gone, your premiums will skyrocket, IF you can even get the same policy.
     

    mmpsteve

    Real CZ's have a long barrel!!
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    You do realize, don't you, that the only reason the A.C.A. (a.k.a. "Obama-care") offered you a lower price is because EVERYONE else is subsidizing your policy, right?
    If you didn't know this, you need to go back and do some fact checking.
    Now that the individual mandate is gone, your premiums will skyrocket, IF you can even get the same policy.

    But Obama said 'if you like your policy, you can keep your policy' over and over. Are you calling him a liar? ACA didn't work out so well for my business. My company policy was dropped, after having payed for mine and my employees for 32 years. Now I pay double, and deductibles and out of pocket are tripple. Yes, we need more .gov interference, it's worked so well. But at least low-income types get free contraceptives, and if that doesn't work, free abortions. Makes me all warm and fuzzy inside.

    .
     

    Dead Duck

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    But Obama said 'if you like your policy, you can keep your policy' over and over. Are you calling him a liar? ACA didn't work out so well for my business. My company policy was dropped, after having payed for mine and my employees for 32 years. Now I pay double, and deductibles and out of pocket are tripple. Yes, we need more .gov interference, it's worked so well. But at least low-income types get free contraceptives, and if that doesn't work, free abortions. Makes me all warm and fuzzy inside.

    .

    .....and free obummer-phones.

    [video=youtube;tpAOwJvTOio]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpAOwJvTOio[/video]
     

    rhino

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    But Obama said 'if you like your policy, you can keep your policy' over and over. Are you calling him a liar? ACA didn't work out so well for my business. My company policy was dropped, after having payed for mine and my employees for 32 years. Now I pay double, and deductibles and out of pocket are tripple. Yes, we need more .gov interference, it's worked so well. But at least low-income types get free contraceptives, and if that doesn't work, free abortions. Makes me all warm and fuzzy inside.

    .

    It's hard to shock me, but when someone actually blames Trump for the current cost of health insurance??? HOLY CRAP. It doesn't get much more out of touch with reality than that. Well, unless you're someone who is subsidized by all of the rest of us (including me while I'm unemployed and paying COBRA).

    Yeah. I've mentioned it enough times on here that some people are probably sick of hearing about it. I lost my privately-purchased health coverage that I'd had since the early 1990s when Obamacare went into effect. Then after I got a job that had good insurance benefits, Obamacare forced the company to discontinue because the deductible was too low. The replacement had a deductible that was over SEVEN TIMES what we had before.

    And of course COBRA is killing me right now. My private policy cost a lot less than this COBRA extension. Thanks, Obamacare!!
     

    bwframe

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    It's hard to shock me, but when someone actually blames Trump for the current cost of health insurance??? HOLY CRAP. It doesn't get much more out of touch with reality than that. Well, unless you're someone who is subsidized by all of the rest of us (including me while I'm unemployed and paying COBRA).

    Yeah. I've mentioned it enough times on here that some people are probably sick of hearing about it. I lost my privately-purchased health coverage that I'd had since the early 1990s when Obamacare went into effect. Then after I got a job that had good insurance benefits, Obamacare forced the company to discontinue because the deductible was too low. The replacement had a deductible that was over SEVEN TIMES what we had before.

    And of course COBRA is killing me right now. My private policy cost a lot less than this COBRA extension. Thanks, Obamacare!!

    We should all remember that everyone that voted for any dem, voted for this continuing crisis. Not to mention gun control, of course.

    These are the same folks who want Trump impeached...
     

    PaulF

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    You do realize, don't you, that the only reason the A.C.A. (a.k.a. "Obama-care") offered you a lower price is because EVERYONE else is subsidizing your policy, right?
    If you didn't know this, you need to go back and do some fact checking.
    Now that the individual mandate is gone, your premiums will skyrocket, IF you can even get the same policy.

    My policy is an individual policy from a major national insurer. The policy I have now was available before the ACA (at a lower rate, BTW...but I had never shopped for health ins.). I pay full retail price for my policy, which isn't subsidized by an employer or through use of pre-tax dollars. My only subsidy is the size of the risk pool. I don't qualify for the statutory subsidies from the ACA, and I pay for my policy with after-tax money. The only "subsidy" I receive is the larger risk pool forced by the ACA.

    By the way, you benefit from that same "subsidy" as well. That's how risk pools work.

    It's hard to shock me, but when someone actually blames Trump for the current cost of health insurance??? HOLY CRAP. It doesn't get much more out of touch with reality than that. Well, unless you're someone who is subsidized by all of the rest of us (including me while I'm unemployed and paying COBRA).

    Yeah. I've mentioned it enough times on here that some people are probably sick of hearing about it. I lost my privately-purchased health coverage that I'd had since the early 1990s when Obamacare went into effect. Then after I got a job that had good insurance benefits, Obamacare forced the company to discontinue because the deductible was too low. The replacement had a deductible that was over SEVEN TIMES what we had before.

    And of course COBRA is killing me right now. My private policy cost a lot less than this COBRA extension. Thanks, Obamacare!!

    HOLY CRAP...straw man much?

    Your cobra plan is "subsidized" in EXACTLY the same way as mine...through risk sharing alone, so your high horse sure has some awfully short legs.

    If you're going to clutch your pearls over something I said, at least have the intellectual sincerity to make it about something I actually said...I didn't blame Trump for insurance rates getting as high as they are, I blame Trump for being too much of a feckless moron to be able to do anything meaningful at all about it with a majority in both houses of congress and an ever-friendlier supreme court.
     

    terrehautian

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    I was let go of my job on November 1st, my insurance was good through the end of the month. My former employer said I would get cobra information within a week. I had no plans to go on cobra as my wife had insurance. Cobra for my daughter and myself would have taken 75% of my severance per month. I feel bad for anyone using cobra if it is as bad as what I was offered.
     

    Kutnupe14

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    Meh, I'll just wait until Mueller is done with his investigation. Trump may not have committed anything that is serious enough to warrant actual impeachment. However, he has surrounded himself with enough crooks, liars, criminals, and opportunists, that people should take note when deciding if he's the guy in 2020.
     

    KG1

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    Meh, I'll just wait until Mueller is done with his investigation. Trump may not have committed anything that is serious enough to warrant actual impeachment. However, he has surrounded himself with enough crooks, liars, criminals, and opportunists, that people should take note when deciding if he's the guy in 2020.
    They are dropping like flies. There won’t be anybody left by then.
     

    spec4

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    Kut, let me tell you: If Trump is on the ticket in 2020, he gets my vote. I suspect a few other Americans feel the same way.
     

    KG1

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    IMO the Trump’s haven’t done anything that they’re being persecuted for as far as I can tell that even comes close to anything that the Clintons have already gotten away with.
     

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