XM193 or XM855 bulk 5.56 ammo ?

[joekoug]

Probably "The Internet". That's where every reliable piece of (mis)information comes from. Hey - I read it somewhere from some guy on a forum who is the go to guy for this type of information - it says so in his signature.

 

[jeremy]

Probably "The Internet". That's where every reliable piece of (mis)information comes from. Hey - I read it somewhere from some guy on a forum who is the go to guy for this type of information - it says so in his signature.

Zing...

 

[Destro]

However, Destro seemed to be saying something very different, and completely contradicting the info posted directly on Federal's website.

Busted...thanks jerk , I will clarify my statement by saying it is Military Reject ammo, not factory reject.....key word on their website is loaded to commerical spec. We can debate what the XM means as far as militaty reject ammo means...

BTW: somebody from the INGO Gun store of the year said that "Trusted sources" have told him that it is reject ammo for one reason or another

i'll cite that source first

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...ading/99553-xm_designation_for_5_56_ammo.html

 

[Destro]

here's another decent source

The Gun Zone -- XM/PD Ammo

 

[joekoug]

Busted...thanks jerk , I will clarify my statement by saying it is Military Reject ammo, not factory reject.....key word on their website is loaded to commerical spec. We can debate what the XM means as far as militaty reject ammo means...

BTW: somebody from the INGO Gun store of the year said that "Trusted sources" have told him that it is reject ammo for one reason or another

i'll cite that source first

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...ading/99553-xm_designation_for_5_56_ammo.html

I WAS right it WAS an internet expert. Funny how everyone backed off when he cited his source (which happened to be internet hearsay. It was someone form a forum who knows a lot and he heard it from someone who knows what they're talking about).

 

[Destro]

I WAS right it WAS an internet expert. Funny how everyone backed off when he cited his source (which happened to be internet hearsay. It was someone form a forum who knows a lot and he heard it from someone who knows what they're talking about).

so do you believe it's not .mil reject ammo?

 

[Lodogg2221]

So, XM is first run commercial ammo, or commercial quality anyway, but ammo the military rejected, or is said to have rejected, for any number of reasons including a slight imperfection in the brass.....but that meets every requirement for commercial ammo, but could have been originally intended to meet military specs....

Or at least thats the thought on XM, though I still didnt see any proof of that on either of those two links. One mentioned prefix and suffix....the other was "a guy I know told me", and from a dealer, which holds even less water.
Ive had dealers tell me Glocks are junk....because they dont sell them. They all have a reason to tell you what they do. Its like the old joke, how do you know when a salesman is lying? His mouth is moving.
Trust but verify. If you cant verify, dont believe it.

In this case, wouldnt there be TONS of stories about how bad XM ammo is? Ive never seen any, and I was searching out info on XM about a month ago....of course maybe I just didnt look under the right rocks.

 

[joekoug]

I tend to believe what the manufacture states over what someone said they heard from an unnamed source. That's just me.

For plinking I shoot 193 and 855 and have no problems with either. For accuracy I hand-load. Rejected by the military means nothing to me. My uncle is a mechanical engineer with a very big defense contractor and we just recently had a discussion on "military grade" or "mil-spec" means. He told me that machine screws regularly get rejected because they have 1/4 of a thread over spec.

Does that mean they are bad screws? No.

My

 

[jeremy]

I WAS right it WAS an internet expert. Funny how everyone backed off when he cited his source (which happened to be internet hearsay. It was someone form a forum who knows a lot and he heard it from someone who knows what they're talking about).

Back off?!
Who?!

so do you believe it's not .mil reject ammo?

No, I do not believe it is Military Rejected Ammunition.

 

[jblomenberg16]

So, XM is first run commercial ammo, or commercial quality anyway, but ammo the military rejected, or is said to have rejected, for any number of reasons including a slight imperfection in the brass.....but that meets every requirement for commercial ammo, but could have been originally intended to meet military specs....

I would agree with you that the Federam XM ammo was intended to be produced for the military, and/or at least run on the exact same equipment as military contract.

Much of the XM193 I've shot has crimped primers, Nato Head stamps, etc. All items that aren't necessary or typical in ammo built strictly for the civilian market.

I've shot some other commercial spec M193 reportedly made by "A US Military Contractor" that was clearly made for commercial use only. I.e. no primer crimps, not Nato stamp, etc.

 

[Destro]

I tend to believe what the manufacture states over what someone said they heard from an unnamed source. That's just me.

you do that

 

[joekoug]

you do that

I will, thanks for your blessing. It's more solid than: a guy heard it from a gal who heard it from a guy who heard it from a reliable (unnamed) source online who knows what s/he is talking about.

 

[Lodogg2221]

you do that

What about Federals info on the page linked is incorrect?

 

[joekoug]

And just to clarify, I'm not knocking the source cited. He is very knowledgeable and helpful to many on this board, myself included. But being a life-long student who has written way too many papers to remember, information is only as good as it's source, and when that source is "a trusted source" I tend to not take it as fact.

 

[windellmc]

What I heard was that the XM may not have passed all of the military required testing, was never tested to milspecs, or was from cancelled military contracts. I have heard of light primer crimping and missing primer or bullet sealant. None of those are required for commercial ammo but if it is in the milspec it has to be there to sell it to the gov't.

855 is rumored to be slightly less accurate than 193 due to the steel penetrator not being as concentric as it could be so the rounds are just slightly out of balance. If I remember correctly we are talking less than 0.5 MOA difference though.

On the other hand it is just about all we can get and there are no guarantees that the other manufacturers are testing their commercial ammo to milspec standards.

 

[rhino]

I've shot a fair amount of XM193 since it hit the market. If you look at a few hundred rounds, you'll see some things that could conceivably cause an inspector to reject a lot for a military customer. One is I've seen quite a few rounds that don't have any visible signs of the primer sealant on the case head. Every round I've acquired and tried to fire that was in a 20 rd box has functioned without isssue.

I also purchased a few thousand rounds of the bulk-packed XM193, and quite a few of those rounds had dents in the cases, torn/cracked case mouths, or the overall length was visibly shorter than the rest. I sorted out those that I thought might cause a problem (bigger dents, cracked/torn cases, bullet set back completely inside the case) and the shot the rest without issue.

I haven't shot any that was manufactured in the last few years, so I only know stories about reliability issues, no personal experience.

 

[Destro]

What about Federals info on the page linked is incorrect?

it probably does meet "commerical standards" or they wouldnt even sell it. Im not disputing that

 

[windellmc]

I have heard reports from military that what they get is sometimes missing primers or bullets so maybe the "commercial" stuff is actually better?

 

[the1kidd03]

I have heard reports from military that what they get is sometimes missing primers or bullets so maybe the "commercial" stuff is actually better?

I've handled, opened, distributed, shot, etc MANY, MANY cans of ammo and I've never seen or even heard of that

 

[Destro]

I have heard reports from military that what they get is sometimes missing primers or bullets so maybe the "commercial" stuff is actually better?

I would pray that is not the case, if so Federal should not be running LCAAP